FB: American Rivers Conference

[johnnie_esq]

In my opinion, because 1) Coe beat UST by 3 and Concordia beat them by 11, 2) Concordia's one loss was to playoff participant SJU, while Coe's was to non-playoff participant Wartburg, 3) Concordia beat D-2 Moorhead State in their nonconference "tough" game, Coe beat mediocre UST (see above).  The first two are primary criteria for regional and ranking selection, and the committee is free to weight them in any particular way they choose.

Once again, given that the IIAC had two of the eight representatives on the regional ranking committee, who provided the rankings that was to be used for seeding teams, one of whom was Coe's coach and the other was Central's AD (both of whom are in the playoffs), while the lone MIAC rep was Bethel's coach (who saw both Central and Concordia this year), I hate to say it but you can't blame the politics, either.  Notwithstanding the QOW rankings and RRO record, which do give Coe an advantage, I think the committee saw that SJU and Concordia are exactly 25 seconds apart in quality.  Which is what most Johnnies believe as well.

I'm sorry, I just don't see the natural advantage on size.  Is it numbers and depth of the football team?  Is it resources to devote to the team?  Is it tuition cost?  Ease of admission to the school?   I think the D3 rules, now redshirt-free, generally provide for equal access to championships, and an even chance to win once there.   I don't see bigger as better-- if it was, we'd see the WIACers winning it all each year.  While it seems to hold true in other sports without roster limitations (see WIAC in track and basketball, for example), the caps do the trick-- and for a state supported institution, keep costs down.

I can certainly see an argument about the WIACs, which are generally bigger than many D2 schools and fit the midwestern notion of D2 schools, being out of place in D3, and I even support it to an extent.  But complaining about the MIAC as a whole (b/c UST is now WIAC-sized) I don't understand. 

I have had several on-board discussions involving Pat in the past, most of them with me hating the WIAC.  However, after my own further investigations, and observations, I no longer see them as the root of all evil (it was just the state of Wisconsin clouding my view).  I think their philosophy is different-- they are universities with some foci on research, not liberal arts colleges, and view them separate from that, but that doesn't necessarily unable to play on a level playing field.

[Pat Coleman]

Your objectivity is underwhelming, Mr. Pat Coleman.

Regardless of what you claim, I certainly have a lot more objectivity on the subject than you do.

[Already_Gone]

Dutchfan1:

I really could not care less if the discussion about school size goes on - or ends right here. I'm just pointing out something obvious. If you choose to ignore it - that's fine. Nevertheless - it is an issue.

And while it would obviously be impossible to truly even the playing field in D3 ... I suggest there is a simple solution.

Neutral sites for first-round playoff games.

The NCAA itself buys into that one. Look no further than the D1 men's basketball tournament.

[DutchFan2004]

Pat,

At the risk of sounding like sucking up.  I think that your comments have always been strait forward and you do not show bias.  You seem to be very informed and an impartial observer.  I think your objectivity is right on.  You seem to truly have the good of D3 in the best interest and not in favor of any school or region.  PS was good to see what you look like.  Its nice to put a name with a face.  Thanks for representing D3 the way you did and always do.

[Maroon&Gold]

Already Gone-  Okay, I know that I should probably just let this go, but I will take the bait.  

First of all, in an earlier post you made the point ot bolding the word PRIVATE to describe the IIAC schools compared to the MIAC and WIAC schools. Well compadre, do some research, although the WIAC schools are public, the MIAC is totally PRIVATE.

Next point, why is Coe traveling and not Cord?  Well for the afore mentioned reasons, one loss to #3 ranked undefeated in the final seconds compared to a loss to a 2 loss non playoff team,  Better win against the same opponent, Larger facility with the opportunity to sell more tickets (which means more money for the NCAA). What else do you need??

Another thing, before you go and attack Pat C. realize that his efforts are mostly responsible for us even having this forum to discuss such issues. And I would tend to believe that he as site operator would have somewhat of a better idea about overall D-3 issues than anyone of us fans would have. Like I said, I look forward to a very competitive and hard-hitting game on saturday.

[johnnie_esq]

AG- if there were revenue to support it, I think your idea would be great.  But that would normally entail a lot of flying around, not to mention the cost of travel and lodging for two teams instead of one, and that means $$$.  So it's not likely for some time yet, if ever.

The regional rankings had noted the Concordia/Coe placement for several weeks, so I don't see why it becomes a big deal now.  The regional rankings are meant to be what the committee is thinking for playoff selection at that time, so it should not be outrageous that a win over a mediocre Simpson team did not change their minds.

I still don't see the obviousness of it.  But for sake of everyone else in this forum, I'll drop it and wish the IIACers well on an injury-free Saturday, and hope that we can welcome Central to Collegeville again next week, if we make it that far as well!

[DutchFan2004]

Johnie-esq,

Well said I'm in the IIAC and I'm not complaining about Coe's treatment.  They had there chance ( with no disrespect to Coe) they didn't beat Wartburg.  They got our help to win the conference championship.  I'm just happy that with two 9-1 teams that we got a playoff game.  I really think it doesn't matter where you play the game.  We were 6-0 on the road.  3-1 at home.  The teams just have to execute and follow the plan that the coaches set out.  Where that happens doesn't matter.  I hope we can come to see you guys next week.  I'd love to see what Collegeville is like.  After coming to Bethel this year I saw that the MIAC loves football just as much as we do.  Good luck with Monmouth.

[johnnie_esq]

Dutchfan-- knowing several Central grads, and the history of our two programs, it would be a fun time among friends were the Johnnies and the Dutch tangle once more-- with Dutch letters in the land of the Stiftingfest, it would be much more fun than the Warhawks, in my opinion.

So let's see if we can both get it done!  Best wishes-- Go big red!

The Big Red Alliance: SJU, RPI, and now Central of Iowa.  Welcome to the club!

[DuffMan]

Good luck to Central this weekend!  I'd rather see you in Collegeville than those big cheapshot artists from Wisconsin!

[DutchFan2004]

Johnie-esq


If we do make it that far.  and I do mean if not looking ahead.  I will make a special trip to Pella before we come up there (providing you win) and purchase some Dutch letters just for the trip.  The one other thing that I personally love are puff pillows.  They are just wonderful.  Full of sugar and heart stoppers. Thanks for including us in the BIG RED CLUB.  

[Already_Gone]

It sure is swell that you aren't complaining about Coe's treatment, DutchFan2004. Mighty big of you.

As far as Coe needing Central's help this season ... guess you're right about that! By the way - you've gotta love those games in which you're out-gained by almost 200 yards of total offense, dominated at the LOS, go 3-of-14 on third downs, and still win, eh?

And just think how good Central's season would have been had the team not spit its bit September 17.

Oh, well. So it goes.

[DuffMan]

I guess that there is only one stat that matters, huh AG? 

[Kilted Rat]

Ask the Vikings how much it sucks to be outperformed in every offensive statistical category.


Good teams find ways to win especially when they are that "dominant."  It's playoff time, put up or shut up. Based on your moniker, AG, I think you realize that Central is AG from this years playoffs.

[DutchFan2004]

A-G,

I am not complaining about Coe's not getting a playoff game because it makes $en$e.  Coe does not have the nicest football stadium or visitor accomodations.  For being the co champs of the IIAC I think ( and ask any other IIAC fan) that Coes visitor stands are the pits.  Heck Dubuque and Loras with have no opposite visitors stands are nicer that yours.  It just makes sense to put it in a venue that will produce the most revenue.  If Concordia's facilities are as nice as they say and they can bring that many fans I think they should get the game.  This is all about money now.  That was the underlying point of me not complaining.  And the other is if we did not knock off Wartburg you would be on the road anyway possibly not getting a Pool C bid with a conference champ with 2 losses so I don't know what the beef is.  Just be thankful that you are there and make the best of it. 

[cobbernation]

Coe fans their will be plenty of seating for you at "The Jake" on Saturday.  Hopefully many of you can make it to Moorhead to watch a great game.  If you are looking for a great place to eat before the noon kickoff, Mick's Office is about 3/4 mile north of "The Jake" on 8th St. for burgers and fries.  Also the best beer in town.  And remember go COBBERS!  That's all I got.