FB: American Rivers Conference

[Charlie Kohawk]

Thanks youcantseeme. We saw it the first time. 

[DutchFan2004]

youcantseeme,

I see your MVP of Northern is third on the rushing list for conference games only.  Second in overall games.  Not in the top in scoring.  How do you come up with that when he dosen't lead the Stats.  Just curious on your reasoning. 

[warthog]

youcantseeme:

I didn't think your list was that interesting twelve hours earlier. 

Hang in there. You'll get it figured out.  Be sure to understand, the rest of us will continue to harass you.  We can be an unforgiving group. 

[warthog]

youcantseeme:

After having picked on you, I'll admit you probably have a good list so far.  If my earlier predictions for Loras and Luther come true, you may have to make some modifications at year end.

[warthog]

DutchFan2004:

Numbers don't always get you the award: Ted Williams the last major league baseball player to hit over .400 was not the AL MVP the year he did it.

[Confused77]

I was in attendence yesterday in Waverly, my confusion cleared as the week progressed and I ended up on the right side....The Loras side.

A few thoughts about the game, atmosphere, etc.

-The new athletic facility is going to be HUGE, I didn't realize it was going to be bigger than the town of Waverly.

-I am very disappointed with the atmosphere at WH Stadium, it is no where near as electric as I remember it being back in the late 90's and the early part of this decade.

The Game
-Loras stood toe to toe with the mighty Knights. I tip my hat to the knights for finally deciding to mash the ball right at the Duhawks in the second half.

-Loras squandered a HUGE opportunity to take a 14-6 lead at the half, I was not standing on that end, so I didn't see whether they were in or out..but that leads me to another issue.

-The officiating made me sick. It is not sour grapes because of the Duhawk loss, but there were calls missed both ways. I saw 2 clips/blocks in the back not called right in front of officials, both on Wartburg toss plays. I saw several calls that were not called against the duhawks as well, so it really was both ways, again the outcome may not change, but clipping penalties are the worst, those blocks can hurt someone and they are just cheap.

-Who is calling the offense for the Knights?  No matter who it is, what would compel them to call bubble or rocket screen on a key 2nd and 4? You have successfully mashed the ball all 2nd half and if you run on 2nd and 4 you pretty much guarantee a first down if you don't get the first I bet it would have been no worse than 3rd and 2. If you are gutsy enough to call a screen, I think you are gutsy enough to say it is 4 down time to get the 1st down and run the clock out. That screen call gave the Duhawks one final chance that didn't amount to much, but, it still gave them a final chance.

All in all a good game to watch, the Knights earned their victory in the 2nd half, again, hats off to them. Now, keep it going.

The Duhawks have some tough games remaining, but I do not believe they will lose all of their remaining games, I understand why people are saying that based on history, but I don't believe it will happen.

I AM OFFICIALLY OFF THE UD BANDWAGON!

[warthog]

Confused77:

If you found yourself on the Loras side, you must still be confused. 

You make some excellent points:

The game day atmosphere I try to explain away to construction etc.  Students can no longer get close to the action.  I hope that changes when things are completed. 

I also give homecoming as an excuse yesterday.  Say what? 

Over the years the Wartburg homecoming crowd has been a drain.  The homecoming game brings out the occasional fan.  You know what I mean: There were people in the stands yesterday who hadn't been at a game in 10 years and probaby won't be back for another 5 or 10 years.  When I arrived our normal family spot was taken by  retired minister and his family.   Wanting to be polite we didn't to ask them to move.  This was fairly typical as the normal hell raising crowd arrived. You just don't get wild and crazy when the people around you are wearing ties, pompom coursages, class of '56 name tags or sweatshirts that haven't been available at the bookstore since 1973.  Warthog, Warthog/Peacock Jr. and Little Warthog can raise some serious hell at a football game.  Yesterday we clapped politely and refrained from any unseemly behavior.

The play calling by Wartburg at the end of the game also confused me.  I assume you were talking about the turn of events after the Loras on-side kick attempt.  3:08 is left in the game.  The Knights are nursing a five point lead.  Hammes just runs for eight yards and sets up a 2nd an 2 yards to go on the Loras 36.  After a time out by Loras to stop the clock the Knights run this ill concieved pass play.  Now at 3rd and 7 yards to go a pass play needs to be considered.   The crowd was flabbergasted.  The clock was our biggest enemy.  It seemed a better choice would have been to give our backs two or even three chances to get the two yards.  Had the Knights made the two yards they could have pretty well taken a knee on a few plays and called it a day.  Instead we gave Loras a final chance.  With the way Loras had shredded the Knight defense on the previous series anything could have and almost did happen.

The Knight defense did come up big at the end of the first half.  I'll give them that.

The officiating appeared to be a comedy of errors.  I'm a idiot fan who doesn't know the rules and boos whenever a close call goes against my team.   I just thought the multiple conferences and stopping of play was so the crew got the calls right.  Both coaching staffs seemed to question what was going on.  This was the first time I had noticed so much confussion.  Perhaps the IIAC officials up in the pres box will report this back to headquarters.

[DutchFan2004]

Warthog,

Couldn't agree with you more about numbers and MVP.  If you read my post I asked what his reasoning was didn't I.  If you don't rely on the numbers then you must have other reasons to think that a player should get the award.  I was wondering what that might be in Northern's case.  I wasn't looking at Schuring because of his numbers.  I was referring to Dan Hammes actually.  Having seen him the past four years I think he is more worthy candidate for offensive MVP than Northern.  He is the heart and sole of the Knight offense this year if you ask me.  To me thats the sign of an MVP.  That was my whole point of the post.  Also Hammes in only behind Schuring.  You could make the case that Jermar Jackson with his arm and legs are more valuable as well (but UD dosen't have the success of wins) if you are only looking at numbers.  Even Pearson at Luther or Bellus at UD have some great numbers so I don't think you can look at numbers only.  I was just curious as to what his thinking was on the Northern nomination. 

[Confused77]

Warthog- I almost forgot to mention the Time Out Wartburg called because the down box on the sidelines was set to 4 rather than 3. The scoreboard was right, the official on my sideline had 3 fingers up, so the officiating crew was on the same page as well as the scoreboard operater. The only issue from that is the officials not charging the TO because the Wartburg coach actually thought it was 4th down and he seemed confused to me and wanted to change his play call, I see how he can be kind of upset with the down marker being wrong, but when I see the officials and the scoreboard reading the down correctly. I coach myself, and I use the scoreboard and if the scoreboard is incorrect I go immediatly to the official and ask him. I never rely on the crazy guys running the chains and down marker.
I have a hard time with the TO being given back. Thats like Loras asking for the whole series on the Goal Line back because the time keeper couldn't get the clock set right. Do all of these officiating errors change the outcome of the game? No, but they sure make for a game with too many interruptions and delays

I know the IIAC commissioner was in attendence yesterday, hopefully he thinks the officiating was not the greatest and tries to remind the crews to keep the flow of the game consistent.

[youcantseeme]

The disagreements are well-founded and i knew that my pick of Northern would be scrutinized.  So, I offer my rationale for the decision....

I picked these players before Saturday's games which was 4 games into the conference season for many teams.  At that time Northern was leading the conference in overall rushing and was second in conference only rushing.  In addition, of the players that I considered, he was the top running back in the all purpose yardage.  He seems to be the most versitile back in comparison with the other two running backs at the top of the list (Schuring and Hammes).   Finally, you could argue that Northern doesnt get the TD's to warrant MVP consideration.  I took into account that it doesnt appear that he gets a lot of carries inside the 5 yard line and that most of those carries go to Suckow.  From what i have heard that is due to the fact that Northern is the best blocker for the Kohawks.  I just get the feeling that he is the most valuable part of that offense compared to the other teams.  The other players that I considered were Hammes, Schuring, DeMoulin, Suckow, McCarron and Pearson.  I was also wondering if any of you needed any rationale for the other picks because i love talking football.

[brick_tamland]

My first post...dedicated to combating the stupid. With facts of course.

Schuring - Five games played. 555 yards gained. 4.9 avg. Five Tds.
Northern - Seven games played. 744 yards gained. 5.1 avg. Three Tds.
Hammes - Six games played. 633 yards gained. 4.7 avg. Six Tds.

Oh and without Schuring, Central loses against Wartburg and probably to Luther as well. Then there is this nugget, in 16 career games Schuring has 11 100-yard games.

Carry on.

[Dsquared]

Dutchfan1... you missed my picks.  They were on page 203 about... I was 4-0:)

More to come on the Wartburg game... and what spread was too low Pollock?

[DutchFan2004]

dsquared,


First I am Dutchfan2004 not Dutchfan1 

Sorry I did get your picks on my paper I just skipped over it when I typed it on.  I added it thanks for catching it.  I am in no way perfect (just look at my picks )

youcantseeme,

Thanks that makes sense what you wrote.  I didn't want to argue your opinion as it is your opinion.  I just was asking how you arrived at it.  I think the stats in the conference games are more meaningful as the teams are all the same.  I know you can then argue with injuries that some teams may or may not be as good on the day you play them but at least they are the same.  No patsy's to puff up the stats  and I am not opening the can of worms to a nonconference scheduling conflict here.  But with the conference stats at least the teams are all the same.  I don't know who will be or who won't be MVP. I was just curious how you came up with it.  Thanks for shedding some light. 

[ram_this]

My 15th post...

In 16 career games Schuring has 11 100-yard games.
In his last 12 games, Northern has nine 100-yard games.

In 16 career games, Schuring has 14 receptions for 112 yards (0 TDs)
This season, Northern has 17 receptions for 165 yards (2 TDs)

In 16 career games, Schuring has never been a blocking back
As a sophomore Northern paved the way for a freshman (Suckow) to the tune of 862 yards and 17 touchdowns. (Northern led Coe in receptions that year).

Not sure who you're calling stupid Brick. Youcantseeme is right on the money in describing what Northern brings to the table in terms of an all-around back. He'll never be an MVP because Suckow takes his TDs, but he is the best back in the league.

Schuring was more than deserving of MVP honors last year. If Central takes the conference, I'm sure he'll earn the award again. I'll even throw out that if Coe wins out, Northern will lose the MVP vote to DeMoulin. But taking a few stats, or nuggets if you will, off a piece of paper won't win your argument for who is the best back.

My Wayward Son.

[Charlie Kohawk]

It's way too early to speculate on MVPs. Schuring, Hammes, Northern and others are all in the mix. The picture will become clearer in the weeks ahead, beginning this Saturday with Wartburg's Hammes going head to head with Coe's Northern. With each going against one of the conference's top run defenses, someone could really make a statement. I will say this. Ashton Northern is a sports photographer's dream.