FB: American Rivers Conference

[Pat Coleman]

Not sure where you got your numbers. Wartburg average over 4300 people a game last year which wasn't bad considering Central, Simpson, and Coe were all on the road.
IIRC, Wartburg was in the top 10 again in attendance.

My numbers for all of this are only as reliable as the numbers put on the Iowa Conference website:

http://www.iowaconference.com/TASFBC/2006-FB/HTML/war.htm

According to the website, Wartburg played football in front on 28,768 people in 2006.  That was for the 10 games for an average of 2,877 fans per game.  According to the website, Wartburg played only three games in front of 4,000 or more fans (Monmouth, Luther, and Loras).

Now that I look at the games closer, it does seem bizarre that the Coe and Central games are so low.

I just am going off of what I am given access to.   Blame it on the SIDs!

Attendance is measured solely on home games.

[youcantseeme]

After spending my last Saturday watching the Central Coe game, I have some stuff I want to get off of my chest as a true fan of college football in general, and football within the IIAC.

This was my first look at Central's new fieldturf.  Not a huge fan of the two-toned look, but it is pretty sharp.  My main observation from the game is:  Central is a championship team if I have ever seen one.  They got down early, but made some real good adjustments to what they tried to do, and executed those adjustments.  Everyone makes changes along the way, but it is the execution that is the key.  They are not the most talented team they have had there, but I since I have been following football in the IIAC, that is a team that plays with more heart than any I have seen from Dutchland. 

On the Coe side: not a good game to lose.  Sure, Central made adjustments and plays, but the Kohawks still blew a 14 point lead.  Never feels good when that happens.  An overall lack of offensive production down the stretch has doomed Coe the last two weeks in two games that they should have won. 

Points:
-Brodyke is the best punter that I have seen at this level.  Hyperbole aside, he looks like a D1 or professional out there amongst D3 kids.  It is a thing of beauty to see spirals come off of his foot that are tighter than the passes of half of the QBs in the IIAC. 
-Connell is the hands-down MVP so far.  He makes all of the big plays, and makes them when they count.  The TD to win the game was perfect and hit his man right in stride.  Even more amazing if you consider that he took a vicious shot immediately when releasing the ball.  Tough kid, good player, GREAT competitor. 
-Central's linebackers seem a little overrated to me.  They just don't seem to make that many plays.  Not nearly the unit they have been in the past.
-Coe's o-line is MUCH improved.  They have made significant strides and I firmly believe that they are one of the top units in the conference.
-I cannot figure out why Robert Welborn isnt a bigger part of Coe's offense.  He is 6'5" and can leap out of a gym.  He had ONE pass directed at him in the game and he caught it in spectacular fashion for a TD.  He is too big of a threat to be used only as a threat.
-Tommy Breitbach is a stud, but the workload seems to really effect him come 4th quarter. 
-Special Teams decided this game.  Coe's punting and punt coverage killed them.  In addition to a poor job blocking for kicks (once again).  Tough for the defense to keep bowing its back up against bad field position. 

Finally, whoever is the PA guy at Central needs to take home a manual of college football and learn it, love it, and live it.  If on first down, there is a 6 yard gain, it is not 2nd and 5.  Which brings me to my last point, which is my biggest pet peeve at a sports event....DON'T DO PLAY BY PLAY FROM THE PRESS BOX AT A LIVE GAME!  You need to tell us the down, distance, who ran/caught the ball, who made the tackle, and maybe give verbal indications of penalties (provided you know what all of the officials signals mean).  I don't need to hear "Johnny was running really hard on that play" or "that ball was tipped and almost intercepted."  Stick to the facts, people can see what is going on, they don't need it read back to them.

Thanks for allowing me to rant.  As always, responses and/or backlash is always appreciated.   

[doolittledog]

Thanks for allowing me to rant.  As always, responses and/or backlash is always appreciated.   

How would you compare Central and Dubuque???  If you have seen Coe vs. both teams.

[youcantseeme]

I would say that Central is more explosive offensively that UD.  They are able to make plays in both the passing and running game.  UD seems to need to make exposive plays on the ground. 

The Dutch are going to take advantages of mistakes by an offense.  I felt that Coe really gave the game away by dropping 3 would be interceptions of Jackson.

I don't think that the UD corners are going to be able to play press coverage on Huisman and Smith.  Connell will kill them. 

Jackson should be able to make some plays on the ground as the Dutch defenders had a hard time keeping TeKippe contained.

Finally, big advantage to Central in the kicking game.  Brodyke is great and their coverage units are abover average despite Breitbach's return.

That being said, UD is confident and hot and Central is grinding for wins.  If I were to handicap this game on a neutral field I would call Central a 4 point favorite.

[doolittledog]

Thank you, good scouting report. 

So if it was on a neutral field it's Central by 4.  What would it be if played at UD like this weekend???

Of course Central travels well with their fan support so maybe it will have the atmosphere of a neutral field. 

[youcantseeme]

well....general rule is you get 3 points for home-field right? 

Central by 1.5  I will give myself the dreaded half point edge here.

[Floyd in Iowa City]

Points:
-Brodyke is the best punter that I have seen at this level.  Hyperbole aside, he looks like a D1 or professional out there amongst D3 kids.  It is a thing of beauty to see spirals come off of his foot that are tighter than the passes of half of the QBs in the IIAC. 
-Connell is the hands-down MVP so far.  He makes all of the big plays, and makes them when they count.  The TD to win the game was perfect and hit his man right in stride.  Even more amazing if you consider that he took a vicious shot immediately when releasing the ball.  Tough kid, good player, GREAT competitor. 
-Special Teams decided this game.  Coe's punting and punt coverage killed them.  In addition to a poor job blocking for kicks (once again).  Tough for the defense to keep bowing its back up against bad field position. 

Connell and the punter decided the Norse-Dutch game as well.  Central's Special Teams and turnover margin have helped win a few games or so over the past five decades.

Luther had a pretty good QB last year with some great targets at WR.  This year it is easier for Norse fans to daydream from time to time about what it might be like to have guys from other teams like Connell, Hawkins, TeKippe, or Jackson running the Norse Offense.  Feldt might have some big plays in him down the stretch as I am hoping play action passing becomes more effective when they need a big play or need to keep defenses honest.

Hawkins has usually looked good to me on a lot of throws when he gets time to throw.  The Beavers have not had an average running game for much of the last few years.

TeKippe has usually always been solid when I have seen him in either high school or college.  How is his mobility this year?

Jackson is having a great season, but I was having a case of Belleus whiplash last year when watching the Dubuque game and don't remember him as well.  I do remember him getting away with some dangerous throws, but everything was working for that offense.  I sure he will remind me about who he is in November.

Connell played well against Luther this year and in 2005.

Yordi is also putting up good numbers, so the race for 1st team all-conference might be tougher this year than last season.  My vote at this point is still for Connell.

[Floyd in Iowa City]

Not sure where you got your numbers. Wartburg average over 4300 people a game last year which wasn't bad considering Central, Simpson, and Coe were all on the road.
IIRC, Wartburg was in the top 10 again in attendance.

Wartburg ranked 4th in Division III Football attendance (home games) in 2006 at 4,343 per game.

Luther was 7th at 4,163 (too bad we played the Knights and Oles on the road).

Loras was 17th at 3,439.
Coe was 63rd at 2,271.
Central was 102nd at 1,766.
Dubuque was 116th at 1,618.
Simpson was 135th at 1,440.
B.V. was 142nd 1,340.
Cornell was 203rd at 740.

Bad weather plays a part for having huge crowds as not many showed up the week that Luther played at Simpson.  Rain may have kept some people away from the Coe-Wartburg game last year as well.

http://www.ncaa.org/stats/football/attendance/index.html

[DutchHawk]

Not sure where you got your numbers. Wartburg average over 4300 people a game last year which wasn't bad considering Central, Simpson, and Coe were all on the road.
IIRC, Wartburg was in the top 10 again in attendance.

Wartburg ranked 4th in Division III Football attendance (home games) in 2006 at 4,343 per game.

Luther was 7th at 4,163 (too bad we played the Knights and Oles on the road).

Loras was 17th at 3,439.
Coe was 63rd at 2,271.
Central was 102nd at 1,766.
Dubuque was 116th at 1,618.
Simpson was 135th at 1,440.
B.V. was 142nd 1,340.
Cornell was 203rd at 740.

Bad weather plays a part for having huge crowds as not many showed up the week that Luther played at Simpson.  Rain may have kept some people away from the Coe-Wartburg game last year as well.

http://www.ncaa.org/stats/football/attendance/index.html

I think you have to take these numbers with a grain of salt at D3 level...for example I dont think they count at Central every student and every pass that comes through the gate, that may be more in just pure ticket sales, minus all the alumni with lifetime passes and such that show up and just walk in...Ive never seen a hand held counter at the gate anyways...not to mention the student section. I think from playing there that Central brings more than 1776 people to their games. Maybe Wartburg is more stingent on their counting but we played up there in 05 and it seemed like it wasnt an outrageously huge crowd, but Im not sure. I just think counting methods are different at every school.

[TheOne89.1]

89.1
Weren't you JV all- conference for 4 yrs?

3 years for sure...don't know if I participated enough at JV senior year....guess SID Mark forgot to write up a press release for that honor.  I was in the same boat at dbljay21, just not talented as the guys who played on Saturday.  I came from a small school where you put on a jersey and you would play, hell now we are 9man and can barely field a whole team.  But I worked my ass off day in and day out at practice and in JV games...and the coaches recognized that by giving me the "Old Can" award (given to the non starting senior who contributed the most to the team) my senior year.  And that recognition means a lot to me...shows me that my hard work helped out, even if I wasn't on the field every Saturday.  (of course my first varsity play ever we scored on a rocket screen, even if I did almost take out our WR).

Of course this all made me think of the recruiting debate we are having on here.  I know this is a football board, but it's all about D3 where these kids are student/athletes, not athlete/students.  I got so much more from my years at Wartburg than just football, just as I'm sure many of you have.  My parents still go to games even though I'm not there.  Wartburg gained a some fans by recruiting me.  Even my hometown coaches cheer for the Knights (well the non-Luther grads at least).  Bringing in local kids from IA, MN, and WI really gets a town connected to that school.  Aunts and uncles, family friends, just townspeople in general who maybe had a son play HS ball with a kid who now goes to Wartburg or Central or BV.  Division 3 isn't about getting a ton of money for the school, it's more about building a family and a team.  I'm sure many of you who played have teammates who you are close to...many have probably stood up at weddings for friends you met through team.  In my experiences, those recruited from FL and CA usually went home after Thanksgiving break because the school aspect was too hard or they couldn't quite understand the idea of "frost" on the field (don't even mention snow).  But some did find friends here in Iowa and have started families and have stuck around.

I agree it's good to recruit locally as they probably are less likely to leave, but you can still find good athletes and more importantly good kids from as far away at FL and CA.

[TheOne89.1]

See you Friday @ 9:30. Bring your A game.

Don't worry, this guy is ready for whatever is dished at him.  Anyone willing to go against the NA fat guys is in for a long day.

[Klopenhiemer]

Talent is talent.  Everyone is exactally right.  Being that there is moe talent in CA, FL, and TX coaches will gravitate towards those regions. 

One thing to consider is that if you have to come all the way from CA to play D3 football in Iowa, how good are you to begin with.  Now please do not start throwing out names of conference MVP's of the past 15 years who didnt come from close to IA.  I know there are a few.  My point is I played on team that had 55 guys from 1000 miles away or more.  These guys were from AZ, CA, FL, and TX.  When you mixed there personalities with 55 guys from SD, MN, IA, and WI things did not go well.  There was a lack of appreciation for these players because they brought something to the table that was not football related.  They were thugs, poor grades, just there because it was there last hope. 

Let me get back on the NSIC for a second.  Take a look at Bemidji State and Winnona State.  You will see those rosters are flooded with MN and WI kids.  Take a look at SMSU.  Flooded with southern kids.  Whos winning and who isnt. 

Talen is talent and franky there is more talent down there.  The facts are after all of the d1,d1aa,and d2 teams get done picking at that talent.  Who is left?

Klop, you are painting with a pretty broad brush there.  Being from Cali doesn't mean you are a thug and being from the midwest doesn't turn you into Beaver Cleaver.  What is trying to be said here is you can look for talent everywhere...Iowa or out on the coast.  What you need to do is be a little selective.  Where that might come into play is developing good contacts with local coaches so you can find the right kind of kid. 

For too long Dubuque brought in those thugs you are talking about and they didn't fit in and they were soon gone from campus.  Thus, giving rise to the Dubuque has good atheletes but no dicipline tag.  The football player is a football player can only go so far.  You need to find out if he will fit your program.  As soon as Dubuque started finding some players that liked living in Dubuque and stuck around for their senior season you started finding Dubuque winning games on a consistant basis.  It takes more than just bringing in kids from out there to fill out your roster.  You need to find out a bit more about the kid.  Having a relationship with the local coaches will help you out. 

As far as travelling fans as I've said before I am out of the loop there.  From my time in school which was the late '80's to early '90's no school other than Central brought more than a few dozen fans with them.  Even the few away games we went to didn't have huge home support.  That all has seemed to change in the last 15 years or so.  It looks like a lot of the schools get more home and away support.  Something I am glad to see. 

Being a UD alum and former athlete there (and coming from Washington, DC to UD), I hesitate to say that UD brought in "thugs"...when I hear "thugs", I'm not sure what you are implying? Kids from out of state who had academic troubles, or even legal troubles, and left?? Hell, I know more of them from Iowa, Illinois and Wisconsin that had those issues, then from out of state...for years, "thugs" was associated with african american student athletes, when discussing UD...so for the record, I'm asking for clarification.
Thanks!

Here is my clarification.  I played on the team that was full of "thugs".  I have read the board twice over now and I do not know what UD and "thugs" got brough into the equation.  I also never menioned anything about african americans.  All races including whites that I encountered with this school were "thugs". 

I understand that I might have painted a broad brush on this one.  I appologize if I offened anyone regarding this. 

Purple Heys...Great point about the Little Leauge system and yes I do understand the population out there.  So I can appreicate why so many kids do branch out from these sates. 

One made a point regarding sunny beaches for iowa cornfields.  I introduced BV to a family memeber of mine from FL.  The kid quit after one year.  He was talking about transfering after the first week of camp.  It takes special recruiting, special kids, and special attention to detail when bringing kids in from long distances to play non scholy football.  THat was my only point. 

[DutchHawk]

Having been on the field a few years back against the more consistent 2-8 teams I would agree that DBQ had their share of the players with the "thug" mentality, regardless of race. It was clearly evidenced by the way they would talk and then get down on each other as the game got worse. Obviously they have rightened the ship to some degree which is good for the IIAC.

[Old Dutch]

Great comment TheOne, my original point about butts in the seats exactly, its the atmosphere and the excitement at the game that becomes a recruiting tool, thus becomes a competitive advantage.  All those aunts and uncles, friends and small town loyalists wearing the colors and supporting the home team has got to make an impression on recruits.  Who wants to go play in a quiet stadium in front of less than 1000 fans? 

Of course if the FLA and CA athletes don't make campus visits (do they?) it may not matter.  And if the school is offering a great location and escape from whatever threats exist in the hometown, those kids can create loyalty from a distance.  I would say DBQ is a great little city, but I could never understand these out of state kids flourishing in Fayette?

[TheOne89.1]

Of course if the FLA and CA athletes don't make campus visits (do they?) it may not matter.  And if the school is offering a great location and escape from whatever threats exist in the hometown, those kids can create loyalty from a distance.  I would say DBQ is a great little city, but I could never understand these out of state kids flourishing in Fayette?

I know we have had recruits from FL and CA visit before, usually if someone else from there HS is already playing at Wartburg.  But you make a great point about life in Fayette...or even a town like Waverly for that matter.  Growing up in a town of 700, Waverly is much bigger...but if you come from Clearwater FL up to Decorah, it's gonna be quite the change for you.