FB: American Rivers Conference

[doolittledog]

I knew what you were getting at.  I just don't think Pat always comes back with rational points...actually, maybe they are rational, I just never see administrators coming on these types of sites and defending themselves as often as Pat does.  It does seem odd to me.  I get it if YOU come over here and say it's crap if someone thinks a coach can get fired for losing 1 more game per year, that makes more sense to me.  Then again, I've never been accused of having much sense (I support UD)  

[SpeedKills84]

Typing on my phone I just lost a huge response. I will boil it down to this: You have no idea what I'm thinking if that's your response. I've worked in D3 schools and seen coaches canned.One W aint bringing those guys back. That's not what D3 is supposed to be about.

Here's what I am thinking.  In the half dozen or so message boards I visit.  I've never seen an administrator come down so hard on the posters that make up his site.  It seems odd to me. 

i'm willing to bet its because he knows what he is talking about.  he's dealt with and probably knows more about the inner workings of d3 football than most of the people on this board.  i would get annoyed too if everyone seems to think they know better than i do, when they clearly don't.

[Pat Coleman]

Doolittle:

Let's remember the actual chain of events here.

Coe scheduled two pretty weak NAIA teams.

Kohawk Krazy defending that by saying, in essence, Coe had no choice: http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1224211#msg1224211

I pointed out Coe could have played a WIAC schools, since they have to resort to playing D2 and NAIA teams to fill their schedule: http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1224226#msg1224226

5WOL said: "Coaches avoid scheduling tenure reducers" http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1224557#msg1224557

I said: One game isn't going to make or break a hiring decision, unless perhaps it's a rivalry game. http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1224794#msg1224794

5WOL turned it into the difference between 5-5 and 4-6, neither of which really describes Coe, by the way: http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1224897#msg1224897 Not often a consideration with Coe, plus, let's be honest, is that really Erik Raeburn's MO anyway?

I responded based on my broad-based observation of coaching firings nationally: http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1224936#msg1224936

Doolittledoug tried to equate Dubuque's last coaching change to this, although Brautigam's last season was 2-8, not 4-6 or 5-5. Also, he agreed with me in 90% of cases. http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1224961#msg1224961

Purple Heys goes even further off the topic, talking about a team that apparently is going 0-9 except for one non-conference game where they schedule a bad NAIA team rather than a WIAC team. Is a team that goes 1-9 going to keep its coach so much more than a team that goes 0-10? And in the process, he insinuated I don't know what I'm talking about because we allegedly cover the strong programs more than the others: http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1225178#msg1225178

I boiled my response down to the basics -- PH has no idea what my thinking is. http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1225227#msg1225227 -- Here's why, by the way -- when I was an SID the football coach went 1-9 and got canned. But he didn't get canned because he was 1-9. 2-8 wouldn't have saved him. He got canned because he lost the team and finished with a roster of 30-some kids. If he'd gotten an extra touchdown against Gettysburg on opening day and won instead of losing, would his job had been saved? Nope.

Doolittledoug does what people sometimes do when they don't like my response: They challenge my right to be a D3 fan: http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1225231#msg1225231

Now, I've made 26,000 posts. For him to call me "a bit thin skinned at anybody that makes comments about him on here" is jumping to conclusions. I doubt he's read more than a few percent of my posts or the posts I respond to.

If having an opinion, having knowledge and backing it up makes me thin-skinned in Doolittle's mind, well, sorry. I'm not giving up my opinions just because I also admin the board.

Ypsi's right. If I were coming down on anyone as a board admin, you would indeed know it.

[AZDutchman]

We had the big rivalry game tonight. I know that the state of Iowa has rivalries that have been going on longer than Arizona has been a state, but this one has all the hype and excitement that is the same in comparison.
Unfortunately, it has been a one sided battle for some time. My sons school has controlled in the domination for the past seven years. Their team has been struggling for a victory. They started their season 0-2 and us 2-0. The score between us in the past few years has been lopsided.
The outcome of tonights game...they won. 16-13 

[5 Words or Less]

I maintain, coaches avoid Goliaths

[5 Words or Less]

When records tail, coaches bail

Coach K ... 8-2, 10-1, 10-2, 12-1, 9-2, 8-2, 5-5
Coach H ... 4-6, 6-4, 6-4, 6-4, 2-8, 5-5
Coach B ... 0-8, 0-8, 1-7, 2-8, 6-4, 7-3, 2-8
Coach N ... 6-4, 9-2, 5-5, 3-7, 4-6
Coach D ... 2-8, 2-8, 0-10, 1-9

[5 Words or Less]

A) 5-5 vs. 4-6 ... building programs require winning records
B) Consecutive losing seasons deter recruits
C) Declining rosters affect enrollment & budgets
D) Administrators reorganize underperforming departments
E) Hence: Coaches schedule equal/lesser noncons

I boiled my response down to the basics -- PH has no idea what my thinking is. http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1225227#msg1225227 -- Here's why, by the way -- when I was an SID the football coach went 1-9 and got canned. But he didn't get canned because he was 1-9. 2-8 wouldn't have saved him. He got canned because he lost the team and finished with a roster of 30-some kids. If he'd gotten an extra touchdown against Gettysburg on opening day and won instead of losing, would his job had been saved? Nope.
If having an opinion, having knowledge and backing it up makes me thin-skinned in Doolittle's mind, well, sorry. I'm not giving up my opinions just because I also admin the board.

(100 - 30) X $30K/student = $2.1M!!!

Administration waited too long

[DutchHawk]

When records tail, coaches bail

Coach K ... 8-2, 10-1, 10-2, 12-1, 9-2, 8-2, 5-5
Coach H ... 4-6, 6-4, 6-4, 6-4, 2-8, 5-5
Coach B ... 0-8, 0-8, 1-7, 2-8, 6-4, 7-3, 2-8
Coach N ... 6-4, 9-2, 5-5, 3-7, 4-6
Coach D ... 2-8, 2-8, 0-10, 1-9

Coach K left, and went to coach in the carolinas, there was much else other than one 5-5 season that caused that. Trust me on that one.

Strong response by Pat.

[hazzben]

When records tail, coaches bail

Coach K ... 8-2, 10-1, 10-2, 12-1, 9-2, 8-2, 5-5
Coach H ... 4-6, 6-4, 6-4, 6-4, 2-8, 5-5
Coach B ... 0-8, 0-8, 1-7, 2-8, 6-4, 7-3, 2-8
Coach N ... 6-4, 9-2, 5-5, 3-7, 4-6
Coach D ... 2-8, 2-8, 0-10, 1-9

Coach K left, and went to coach in the carolinas, there was much else other than one 5-5 season that caused that. Trust me on that one.

Strong response by Pat.

yeah, from what I hear Coach K was a little too serious about Jesus for Central...

[Willie University]

I have always enjoyed that Pat and K-Mac and others visit all postboards and intergect on discussions. Their job is to follow D3 sports and although we may all be a little biased in some of our opinions, most always they bring logic, facts, and sarcastic humor to the discussions we have. I have never thought once of any of them as having "thin" skin 

Having been posting on here for 12+ years when all this website was about was D3FOOTBALL, that is my opinion. I have seen posters come and go over the years but it's nice to have the constants as well. When I began posting way back when, Spurrier was the only Spartan fan on here. He was King of the Spartan Nation-----I have always loved that self proclaimed title and hope he doesn't change to "king of the ram nation" Warthog was also on here way back when. Walston Hoover and Lance Harbor and Dutchfan1 (not 2K4 or the million other dutchblahblah nicknames that aren't original)  It is a rule that if you go to or support Central that you can't be original 

Do must of you remember Peacock  Probably not because he stopped posting when UIU left the IIAC but he was one of the originals as well. These postboards have become stronger the more people that have joined over the years, supported their conference and their teams. We that post have choosen to make our opinions known where some just read the postboards. And if you think for one second that every IIAC coach doesn't read this board, you are foolish. Every coach I have known over the years reads this board. I even know of some coaches that have printed off copies of a "post" and hung them in locker rooms to motivate the players!!

For me personally, I am a SPARTAN fan first and my loyalties will always lie there and that trumps everything else; I have also supported every coach that has coached at UD even if I haven't agreed with everything they have done or even during the losing seasons. Those that know me, know those 2 facts. I am not a bandwagon poster as the hundred or so I have seen over the years (do you HEAR ME LORASS FANS   

I am VERY biased in my opinions and always have been and as far as Warthog is concerned, probably always will be  BUT, in the 12+ years of being on this postboard, I have never sensed hardly a sniffle of bias from Pat on this board and definitely haven't thought his skin was thin 

But, that is my opinion, you have a right to your own.

Willie U

[Pat Coleman]

When records tail, coaches bail

Coach K ... 8-2, 10-1, 10-2, 12-1, 9-2, 8-2, 6-4
Coach H ... 4-6, 6-4, 6-4, 6-4, 2-8, 6-4
Coach B ... 0-8, 0-8, 1-7, 2-8, 6-4, 7-3, 3-7
Coach N ... 6-4, 9-2, 5-5, 3-7, 5-5
Coach D ... 2-8, 2-8, 0-10, 2-8

Now that I have weakened the schedule and added one win to each of these final years, do you keep those coaches?

[5 Words or Less]

I've sharred my idea ... why do you think programs shy from scheduling WIAC schools?

[Pat Coleman]

No doubt it's because they don't want to lose.

But my point that one game doesn't make or break a coach's job still stands. And my original point that WIAC schools have open dates late every year for a school in the Midwest who is left with dates to fill also stands.

[Purple Heys]

Purple Heys goes even further off the topic, talking about a team that apparently is going 0-9 except for one non-conference game where they schedule a bad NAIA team rather than a WIAC team. Is a team that goes 1-9 going to keep its coach so much more than a team that goes 0-10? And in the process, he insinuated I don't know what I'm talking about because we allegedly cover the strong programs more than the others: http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1225178#msg1225178

I boiled my response down to the basics -- PH has no idea what my thinking is. http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3785.msg1225227#msg1225227 -- Here's why, by the way -- when I was an SID the football coach went 1-9 and got canned. But he didn't get canned because he was 1-9. 2-8 wouldn't have saved him. He got canned because he lost the team and finished with a roster of 30-some kids. If he'd gotten an extra touchdown against Gettysburg on opening day and won instead of losing, would his job had been saved? Nope.

I don't feel a need to defend my observation of D3football.com's editorial point of view.  Over a period of time, look at the coverage on page 1 of the Home page and make up your own mind.  I am entitled to my opinion.  Pat is entitled to his.  Really after all of this...that's all this is.  His opinion, my opinion and yours too.

As Pat correctly states, I don't know what he's thinking.  That swings both ways.  He doesn't know what I'm thinking. (At this moment, it's In-n-Out, Double-Double, no spread, fries...)   

I wasn't talking about an 0-9 team scheduling an NAIA team vs. a WIAC team.  The fact that Pat brought up the WIAC motivated me to observe that Pat seems to think in terms of those teams first. 

I was referring to teams (really one in particular) that needed to win non-conference games because there was a reasonable doubt they would win a conference game.  Going 0-10 as a coach is bad for long term employment expectations.  Therefore I think it is easy to see that a given coach would be highly sensitive to each of those non-conference games and that in fact, it could be seen as the difference between keeping a job and losing a job.

[Purple Heys]

When records tail, coaches bail

Coach K ... 8-2, 10-1, 10-2, 12-1, 9-2, 8-2, 5-5
Coach H ... 4-6, 6-4, 6-4, 6-4, 2-8, 5-5
Coach B ... 0-8, 0-8, 1-7, 2-8, 6-4, 7-3, 2-8
Coach N ... 6-4, 9-2, 5-5, 3-7, 4-6
Coach D ... 2-8, 2-8, 0-10, 2-8

Fixed it.