FB: American Rivers Conference

[iaac72]

What about Clarke University in Dubuque? They just added football and 10-12 years ago was a d3 school.

[doolittledog]

Welcome to the board iaac72!

My guess is that with UD and Loras already in the conference, there would be no need for a 3rd team from the city. 

I've often wondered with Clarke and Loras within eyesight of each other, and both Catholic schools, if we might see a merger of the two schools sometime in the future. 

[AndOne]

We had a GA at NCC a couple of years ago who had gotten his BA from Clarke. From what I was able to gather at the time, while co-Dubuque residents Clarke and Loras share a religious connection, they view athletic engagement from fairly different perspectives.
However, you never know what, and how quickly things might change. And, remember that the primary driver of any possible future merge will likely be neither academic nor athletic philosophy, but finances. 💰 💵 talks. 

[sportsknight]

I've often wondered with Clarke and Loras within eyesight of each other, and both Catholic schools, if we might see a merger of the two schools sometime in the future.

If that move we're going to be made, it would have happened 40 years ago. Clarke and Loras were brother/sister institutions before either was co-ed. Women went to Clarke, men to Loras. I'm not sure when Clarke went co-ed, but I know Clarke was still all-female until 1980 or so.

I think it would be a fool's errand to try to talk any NAIA institution into giving up that designation to join D3. Once you can offer athletic scholarships, why would you ever go back to not being able to do so?

[AndOne]

We had a GA at NCC a couple of years ago who had gotten his BA from Clarke. From what I was able to gather at the time, while co-Dubuque residents Clarke and Loras share a religious connection, they view athletic engagement from fairly different perspectives.
However, you never know what, and how quickly things might change. And, remember that the primary driver of any possible future merge will likely be neither academic nor athletic philosophy, but finances. 💰 💵 talks. 

I've often wondered with Clarke and Loras within eyesight of each other, and both Catholic schools, if we might see a merger of the two schools sometime in the future.

If that move we're going to be made, it would have happened 40 years ago. Clarke and Loras were brother/sister institutions before either was co-ed. Women went to Clarke, men to Loras. I'm not sure when Clarke went co-ed, but I know Clarke was still all-female until 1980 or so.

I think it would be a fool's errand to try to talk any NAIA institution into giving up that designation to join D3. Once you can offer athletic scholarships, why would you ever go back to not being able to do so?

The lower bolded question was what I was getting at when I mentioned the higher bolded statement. 

[doolittledog]

Didn't the WIAC as well as the NWC go from NAIA to D3? Iowa Wesleyan went from NAIA to D3. The Iowa Conference was NAIA until the formation of D3.
I think a lot of families these days are influenced by what the total out of pocket cost is and that 4K athletic scholarship doesn't mean a whole lot if they are paying 25k to an NAIA school but that D3 school that doesn't offer an athletic scholarship will be 20k out of pocket.
There was talk of Graceland looking into D3 a few years ago. Their president thought that might work towards attracting more Iowa students.

[AndOne]

Didn't the WIAC as well as the NWC go from NAIA to D3? Iowa Wesleyan went from NAIA to D3. The Iowa Conference was NAIA until the formation of D3.
I think a lot of families these days are influenced by what the total out of pocket cost is and that 4K athletic scholarship doesn't mean a whole lot if they are paying 25k to an NAIA school but that D3 school that doesn't offer an athletic scholarship will be 20k out of pocket.
There was talk of Graceland looking into D3 a few years ago. Their president thought that might work towards attracting more Iowa students.

The bolded statement above is certainly true, Doo.
Unfortunately, also true is the fact that many kids view themselves as athletic "failures" if they don't get an athletic scholarship. They falsely believe that the best players always get athletic scholarships, and if they don't get one that means they are no longer one of the best players which, in most cases, they have been since they started playing football, basketball, baseball, or whatever sport. 
They also fail to consider that at a D1 or even a D2 they might be the last guy on the bench, but at a D3 they might be a star.

Do you want to go to college and PLAY           ball or WATCH           ball?

[doolittledog]

Didn't the WIAC as well as the NWC go from NAIA to D3? Iowa Wesleyan went from NAIA to D3. The Iowa Conference was NAIA until the formation of D3.
I think a lot of families these days are influenced by what the total out of pocket cost is and that 4K athletic scholarship doesn't mean a whole lot if they are paying 25k to an NAIA school but that D3 school that doesn't offer an athletic scholarship will be 20k out of pocket.
There was talk of Graceland looking into D3 a few years ago. Their president thought that might work towards attracting more Iowa students.

The bolded statement above is certainly true, Doo.
Unfortunately, also true is the fact that many kids view themselves as athletic "failures" if they don't get an athletic scholarship. They falsely believe that the best players always get athletic scholarships, and if they don't get one that means they are no longer one of the best players which, in most cases, they have been since they started playing football, basketball, baseball, or whatever sport. 
They also fail to consider that at a D1 or even a D2 they might be the last guy on the bench, but at a D3 they might be a star.

Do you want to go to college and PLAY           ball or WATCH           ball?

There's some truth to what both of us are saying.  My wife has a cousin who's son fell into the category of what you're saying.  He laughed at me when I mentioned D3 and her cousin shrugged his shoulders and said "he has to get a scholarship" It is also true that the majority of NAIA schools push the athletic scholarship part in their recruiting pitch and have no intention of ever moving from that.  Morningside is on record as saying they love the NAIA model.  But there are schools that will give a serious look at moving D3.  Graceland is one from our state that was on record as saying they were looking at it.  Iowa Wesleyan made the move.  It's not necessarily crazy talk to throw NAIA schools into the conversation.

Getting back to Clarke and Loras.  I think the only way you would see a merger of those two schools is if it was a financial consideration.  And even then, there is enough water under the bridge to make that sketchy.  It might be within the realm of at least speculating with the fact they are both catholic, they had at least a bit of cohesion when Loras was a mens school and Clarke was for women, they both have minuscule endowment figures.  With the coming birth dearth there will be even stronger competition for incoming students.  A merger seems unlikely, but I think those would probably be the only two schools you could mention a merger as a possibility.  Any other school in financial peril would likely just close their doors.   

[hazzben]

But there are schools that will give a serious look at moving D3.  Graceland is one from our state that was on record as saying they were looking at it.  Iowa Wesleyan made the move.  It's not necessarily crazy talk to throw NAIA schools into the conversation.

It's definitely not crazy talk. President Christy at Northwestern has some deep Simpson ties. I know he at least floated the question of D3, but I don't think it ever got off the ground. The trick for schools like Northwestern (or more recently Morningside) is that they've had athletic success at the NAIA level and it's hard to leave that history behind. It's part of what made PLU & Linfield's move so unique, but that involved an entire conference moving over.

For a school like Northwestern, with very successful men's and women's bball programs, the fact that the National tourney is driveable for both is a major draw. They love invading Sioux City for the women's national tourney (and they make it most years). Can't say that I blame them.

Imagine if Wartburg was still NAIA and the national wrestling tourney was held in Des Moines every year. That's a sweet draw, no matter how attractive D3 might appear to be them.

[5 Words or Less]

Lindenwood merges, drops NAIA sports. http://footballscoop.com/news/naia-program-cut-football-undergrad-programs/

The Board of Trustees at the Lindenwood-Belleville (NAIA – IL) campus have decided that at the conclusion of the spring semester in 2020, all traditional undergraduate programs at the campus will be cut and combined with the St. Charles, Missouri campus – which is located about 40 minutes away ... the online student publication for Lindenwood, notes that the Belleville campus had been operation at a $2.5 million deficit the last few years.

That means the NAIA sports programs at the school, including football, will be eliminated ... this season will mark their final season and many players will look to transfer mid-year. Lindenwood-Belleville notes in their FAQ's section that choices for student athletes include opportunities to try out and compete for a spot on the Lindenwood-St Charles (D-II – MO) team, and transfer immediately to another school with no restrictions from Lindenwood-Belleville.

[iaac72]

I saw this coming, they bought an old high school and tried to make it into a traditional college.

[iaac72]

Enrollment # for the ARC according to the ARC website. Smallest enrollment is Central with 1,100 and the largest is NWU with 2100. Are these # accurate??

[doolittledog]

The ARC page will have enrollment figures that are different from the D3football site, which are different from US News and World report college rankings, which are different from Wikipedia...it goes on and on.  Depends on who to believe, and who actually gets accurate head counts, and how you want to count enrollment.  On campus vs total enrollment can be two totally different numbers. 

I've read BVU has around 700+ on campus, but with their centers located across the state they get a count of 1800+
I've seen in Fitch ratings that Wartburg has 1300+ enrollment but most other sources say 1500+
Most sources I see show Luther 2300-2500.  2053 on the ARC site is lower than I had previously seen. 
A recent article in the Dubuque paper showed Loras enrollment around 1600-1700 compared to 1467 in the ARC site.
Central, Coe, Dubuque, NWU, Simpson seem to fall in line with what I have seen other places.   

[Pat Coleman]

Here is what we use for enrollment:
https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/

Figure if someone is putting a signature on it and sending it to the U.S. Department of Education, it must have some basis in fact. Plus, this lists full-time undergraduates, which seems most germane at the D-III level.

[Alfredeneumann]

🏆 🏆 🏆

The American Rivers Conference has concluded its 2018-19 regular season calendar. For the 17th-straight year, Wartburg College finds themselves atop the Combined All-Sports Championship Trophy standings, recognizing the conference's top overall program. The Knights also won the Marjorie Giles Women's All-Sports Championship Trophy for the 16th time in school history and the Elmer Hertel Men's All-Sports Championship Trophy for the 22nd time.


http://rollrivers.com/news/2019/5/20/baseball-wartburg-sweeps-american-rivers-conference-all-sports-trophies.aspx