FB: American Rivers Conference

[DutchFan2004]

Pat,

Thanks for giving insight on how you came up the the 99%.  I didn't research and wasn't aware that Drake played Platteville.  That makes complete sense on what you said then.  Central was competive with UWW.  If UWW walked over Plattville then I totally agree with what you said.  I have stated before thanks for all you do for D3 you are more informed than most and know what you are talking about. 

[BoBo]

Central was competive with UWW. 

If a 34-14 loss is being competitive, then I guess Central was competitive. Sure it wasn't a 63-28 pasting the warhawks laid on Platteville earlier that season, but it was a blowout nevertheless.

[Pat Coleman]

It's OK -- I threw out the last two years to try to make my point, to be sure.

[DutchHawk]

Ive never considered a 20 point loss a blowout by any means, not exactly a close game but Central did a hell of a lot better than Wesley in the National Semifinals!:) Either way comparing Whitewater to Platteville is like comparing prime rib to mcdonalds. Bottom line is Drake gets beat by Wartburg and Central 99% of the time.

[BoBo]

I can agree with you.

[insrb]

A good Drake team will win the Iowa Confernce handly.  Ask Coe about how good a football team UW-Platteville is?  UWP blasted Coe last year in the intersquad.  In 2006 when UWP was terrible, they still competed with the Kohawks in the intersquad.  That aweful 2006 1-9 UWP team rolled Dubuque 26-0, the same year UD beat Loras.  The 2007 5-5 UWP team ran the football and beat UD handly, the same year UD beats Wartburg.

You underestimate how many good non-scholarship(D3 players) that Drake has has in it's quality program.  They would be in the IIAC race annually, and be mid-to-upper pack of the WIAC.  The IIAC in not what it was in the 70's, 80's and 90's    

[sc_stormchaser]

You'll never convince me that Central/Wartburg would beat Drake 99% of the time. I'll ask again, has anyone watched a Drake game recently? If you have, I guarantee you wouldn't think Central and Wartburg would beat Drake the majority of the time. I'm certainly not saying the games wouldn't be competitive, but to say 99% is just plain crazy.

[doolittledog]

A good Drake team will win the Iowa Confernce handly.  Ask Coe about how good a football team UW-Platteville is?  UWP blasted Coe last year in the intersquad.  In 2006 when UWP was terrible, they still competed with the Kohawks in the intersquad.  That aweful 2006 1-9 UWP team rolled Dubuque 26-0, the same year UD beat Loras.  The 2007 5-5 UWP team ran the football and beat UD handly, the same year UD beats Wartburg.

You underestimate how many good non-scholarship(D3 players) that Drake has has in it's quality program.  They would be in the IIAC race annually, and be mid-to-upper pack of the WIAC.  The IIAC in not what it was in the 70's, 80's and 90's    

I think Drake would do better than losing 99% of the time to Central/Wartburg and would be a title threat more often than not...BUT...Drake would not be winning the IIAC handily every year.  I also would not put a lot of stock into how well a team does against another team in an intersquad.  And to talk up a 1-9 UWP beating up UD in the same year UD beat Loras...Loras was 2-8 in conference and 3-7 overall that year so I don't really see your point. 

[footballdaddy]

From what I've seen,the IIAC big three have made a bigger commitment  to football as an institution than Drake has. Coupled with the equal quality of education available,this should draw superior players to Central,Coe or Wartburg.That they could beat Drake 99% of the time may be a little optimistic,but I believe that the IIAC would win more often than not.

[DutchFan2004]

Trying to use preseason scrimmages as a guideline is useless in my opinion.  So much depends on how much number one units play and if the number one unit is an intact number one unit and not a blend of number ones and twos.  The season games are a better guideline.  From the point that Pat made I'd give the edge to Pat.  Now maybe 99% is strong but I do think the type of athletes that the top IIAC teams recruit are every bit as good or better than the Drake ones. 


Saying that Drake would be a middle of the road WIAC team is not big accomplishment either. 

[Pat Coleman]

Couple things at work here -- people pouncing on my use of the usual 'exaggeration to make a point' strategy and coming on the heels of a really good year by Drake which may be a statistical outlier.

If they have a couple more really strong years -- and isn't there a coaching change coming here -- then I'll re-evaluate.

[Pat Coleman]

Of course, I don't know exactly how good Drake has been anyway. Their site has performed a little bit of revisionist history on the 2004 game with Platteville.

http://www.godrakebulldogs.com/SportSelect.dbml?SPSID=71158&SPID=8123&DB_OEM_ID=15700&KEY=&Q_SEASON=2004

Platteville won that game 33-23. For some reason Drake would like to think it won.

[HoosierinIowa]

I haven't seen Drake play recently.  I do know when they played Simpson in the early 90s Drake did very well.  I believe the series was called the "Golden Circle Game" or something along those lines.  I can only go off of the Central teams I saw in that time period compared to the teams of the last few years to say that the Central teams of the early 1990s were better than the ones of today and the Simpson teams obviously were better than the Simpson teams of today.  If Drake has remained at that level I think Drake would be very competative in the Iowa Conference.

[knightlife06]

I got to see Drake play a game last year and they looked better than in the past, even though it was against Upper Iowa.  I will agree with some of you and say that they would be competitive in the IIAC and probably be in the top 3rd of the conference.  Not quite sure they would be able to beat the Centrals and Wartburg's but they would be tough.

[davedevine]

I had no idea that a Pioneer Coach was now at Stanford.. going from the  Pioneer to Pac 10 is a HUGE Jump..

As far as a DIII head coach going straight to a D-1 coaching job(not D1-AA) I will predict it's never happened.  Pat, can I get a witness?

As far as Drake's recruits, do they get that many from Iowa?   Over the last 5-10 years, it would be interesting to see how many shrine bowl players every year go to Drake compared to Wartburg or Central?   
   I guess we need to ask Coach Niemann since he has coached both in the IIAC and Drake, he would be the expert on this topic. It would be interesting to hear his perspective on it.

SC, When UNI plays Iowa or ISU, they're getting $300K+ for just showing up.  It was $250k in 97 when UNI was thrashed @  kinnick. That's a lot of cash.   The 1-AA schools don't have anywhere near that kind of cash to give to drake to fill a spot.
Also, the Top Tier 1-AA can be(are)  very competitive with a lot of the D1's.  (not talking about the top 25 teams) 
UNI gives ISU all they can handle the last few meetings. 
In my opinion,  There's a much larger difference comparing drake's(or WB or Central's)  talent level to the Gateway Champion compared to UNI vs ISU, etc.  Speed & quickness,  not necessarily size is the biggest difference at every position. 

I would also agree with the comment that comparing inter squad scrimmages for comparison sakes is silly.  most of the time, they are a glorified touch football game.