FB: American Rivers Conference

[DutchFan2004]

Airbourne,

Will you get home soon?  Will you be able to attend a game if the Dutch can keep winning.  Keep safe and look forward to your return home.

[dutchlb]

Won't do much good posting congrats to the teams now, this is just a Central board now.

Not sure anyone saw the #1 seed coming, thanks to Bethel and the selection committee.  Must be that Central "LUCK" again.  I am sure it can't be recognition of hard work all season.

I have been watching IIAC football for 20+ years and this group of men has something special.  It is amazing to watch them play when they believe in themselves.

Props to the Defense - solid always!!!  Pick for Doud playing center field - Baethke creating havoc on the field - LBs - definately LB U - DLine what a beautiful thing to watch.  Anyone remember the series in the second half that went:  Sack, Sack, Sack, Punt into the endzone.

Offense - weapons on the outside, running, QB that controls the game. 

Balanced is what I call this TEAM!

Go Central - Skip made us a schedule that is ours for the taking!

DYNASTY

For those still reading from around the conference and country - the IIAC title comes through TULIP town - ALWAYS!

[dutchlb]

One parting shot for the crew from WB -

You have our permission to keep using the "Evil Empire" slogan.

We kind of think of you more as "mini me" - you want to be like us, but fall a little short.

I shutter to think what your team would have been without suckow??  We would let him transfer in for track season - pickup a title shot.

[DutchFan2004]

Few things from yesterday's game...

First and foremost, I think it is truly unfortunate that we are talking about questionable calls after such a well-played game.  Both teams made some great plays and every fan that was at the game got their four or five dollars worth.  I would have loved to see Wartburg win (sending both teams to the playoffs) and would have been happy to see Central win, but would much rather have had one team win more decisively. 

That said, I can't help but disagree with some of the calls that were made.  I'll be the first to admit that I didn't have the best view of Connell's arm on the last play (and don't know if I would have been focused on his arm even if I was closer) and I couldn't hear when the whistle sounded.  But it sure looked like a fumble to me.  And to the guy that said the Wartburg linemen were getting in a cheap hit on Connell by playing past the whistle, I'm guessing you never played defense, especially defensive line.  You're taught to play by sight on defense, and when you see the football fall out of a guy's hand in that situation, you're going to make a play for it.  The block in the back was a blown call.  I think that rule needs to be revisited to make a clear policy in regards to plays like that one where a player is blocked from the side.  From where I was at, I don't think I can disagree too much with the pass interference call, other than to argue whether or not you throw the flag in that situation. 

I've been a ref and an umpire before, and I know that you try to make your best judgement in some very tough situations, but I still say it is wrong to take the game out of the players' hands.  There were only 8 penalties called in that game.  That's probably the lowest number I've ever seen in a game.  Were more than that committed?  You can almost be sure of it.  So when the refs were letting them play for most of the game, why throw the flag in that situation?  You just made a kid a goat by calling that penalty.  As great a player as Nick Weber is, he will undoubtedly always look back on that game and wonder what might have happened if that flag doesn't get thrown. 

Weber made a couple of real nice plays, but at the end of the day, he just wasn't tall enough to cover Smith all the way.  I don't remember seeing any plays were Weber got "burned."  But its a game of inches, and when a WR is four or five inches taller than the CB, it creates a match-up problem that is tough to overcome.

Let's call a spade a spade:  Wartburg could have put the game out of reach by halftime.  As much as they were shutting down the Central offense in the first half and as good of field position as they had, Wartburg probably should have scored three times.  But you have to give a ton of credit to Central's defense for stiffening at the right times.  We joked on the air about there being an invisible wall at the 25 yard line that Wartburg couldn't get through.  Well, that wall was the Central defense.  Wartburg ran 24 offensive plays (not counting punts) in Central territory, and only six of those came from inside the 25.  Just three of those were inside the ten.

Like I said, well played game all around.  Both coaching staffs have a lot of respect for each other and the Wartburg guys will be rooting for Central to do well.  But its just a damned shame that the IIAC didn't get two teams in and that we have to spend so much time talking about the refs after a game like that.

Sportsknight,

I will take up the subject of officiating with you.  You are not there to take the game out of the hands of the players.  A ref is there to enforce the rules of the game and make calls regardless of the time on the clock or the out come of a call.  If there is an infraction he makes his call.  The comment about letting them play for most of the game and then calling it in the last minute is not a legit statement.  I don't think they got together at half time and said hey we have not thrown our flags enough lets tighten up the play.  They called what they saw and enforced the rules.  You need to take the orange shades off and think about accusing the refs of "cheating".  One thing I know as an official for over 10 years is that when the stripes are on the calls are all on the up and up.  There are no favorites when officiating.

[DutchHawk]

DF04 - I agree, I also think that the IIAC officials are very proficient in every game. The fact of the matter is that Wartburg made and illegal block, interfered with a pass and those undisciplined plays hurt them a lot, not cost them the game. I also dont know how Koehler has an issue with which team is better.

It feels to me as though there still hasnt been a lot of respect for Central the last 3 years even though they have earned it. People saying we are just lucky and so forth. I think that win up at Wartburg let loose a lot of emotions that have been pent up with the Dutch faithful. We just want to be recognized as the great team we are and will be for years to come! (Dutch JV beat Wartburg JV 24-3 this year I was told )

[Wartburg Fan]

One parting shot for the crew from WB -

You have our permission to keep using the "Evil Empire" slogan.

We kind of think of you more as "mini me" - you want to be like us, but fall a little short.

I shutter to think what your team would have been without suckow??  We would let him transfer in for track season - pickup a title shot.

Believe me ,  We don't want to be like you

[old school ENP Tiger]

Few things from yesterday's game...

First and foremost, I think it is truly unfortunate that we are talking about questionable calls after such a well-played game.  Both teams made some great plays and every fan that was at the game got their four or five dollars worth.  I would have loved to see Wartburg win (sending both teams to the playoffs) and would have been happy to see Central win, but would much rather have had one team win more decisively. 

That said, I can't help but disagree with some of the calls that were made.  I'll be the first to admit that I didn't have the best view of Connell's arm on the last play (and don't know if I would have been focused on his arm even if I was closer) and I couldn't hear when the whistle sounded.  But it sure looked like a fumble to me.  And to the guy that said the Wartburg linemen were getting in a cheap hit on Connell by playing past the whistle, I'm guessing you never played defense, especially defensive line.  You're taught to play by sight on defense, and when you see the football fall out of a guy's hand in that situation, you're going to make a play for it.  The block in the back was a blown call.  I think that rule needs to be revisited to make a clear policy in regards to plays like that one where a player is blocked from the side.  From where I was at, I don't think I can disagree too much with the pass interference call, other than to argue whether or not you throw the flag in that situation. 

I've been a ref and an umpire before, and I know that you try to make your best judgement in some very tough situations, but I still say it is wrong to take the game out of the players' hands.  There were only 8 penalties called in that game.  That's probably the lowest number I've ever seen in a game.  Were more than that committed?  You can almost be sure of it.  So when the refs were letting them play for most of the game, why throw the flag in that situation?  You just made a kid a goat by calling that penalty.  As great a player as Nick Weber is, he will undoubtedly always look back on that game and wonder what might have happened if that flag doesn't get thrown. 

Weber made a couple of real nice plays, but at the end of the day, he just wasn't tall enough to cover Smith all the way.  I don't remember seeing any plays were Weber got "burned."  But its a game of inches, and when a WR is four or five inches taller than the CB, it creates a match-up problem that is tough to overcome.

Let's call a spade a spade:  Wartburg could have put the game out of reach by halftime.  As much as they were shutting down the Central offense in the first half and as good of field position as they had, Wartburg probably should have scored three times.  But you have to give a ton of credit to Central's defense for stiffening at the right times.  We joked on the air about there being an invisible wall at the 25 yard line that Wartburg couldn't get through.  Well, that wall was the Central defense.  Wartburg ran 24 offensive plays (not counting punts) in Central territory, and only six of those came from inside the 25.  Just three of those were inside the ten.

Like I said, well played game all around.  Both coaching staffs have a lot of respect for each other and the Wartburg guys will be rooting for Central to do well.  But its just a damned shame that the IIAC didn't get two teams in and that we have to spend so much time talking about the refs after a game like that.

I would be that guy and yes I played the game and yes I played defense ( both ways) At ENP when you only have 30 guys Fr-Sr you play a lot.  Played D line.  Granted my level of play was not as high as college but I had a modest all district career.  I guess we learned to go till the whistle blows.  I've never dove at a spike play but it happens.  I actually thought you've done a great job on the games this year.  I haven't listened to the Wartburg game yet.  Actually felt sorry for you with all of the comments on play by play and such but here comes some more.  

I belived that you had a point on the few penalties in the game until I looked a little deeper.  I know for sure that you have not been apart of the broadcast team every game of the season but here are some facts for the flags.... 5 games this year for Central games have had 8 or fewer TOTAL penalties.  St Thomas (5).  Loras (6) Simpson (8) Coe (6) and of course Wartburg....If it was just yesturday yes you absolutely have a case.  But half of the season lends itself to style of play.  Also along that line Wartburg was the most penalized team in the conference.  Again just yesturday Orange nation has a case.  All season maybe not.

I'm glad to hear an official emply that they will /will not make a call based on what it says on the scoreboard.  Close game or not close game and what quarter it was.  I always had an issue with those guys reffing for Britt West Hancock.  They will forever be rememberd for ending old school ENP career.  Man those guys were fast....

[old school ENP Tiger]

uhh simpson was 8 on the last one

not to look past the first game but I still want that shot at the Johnnies.  I have a coworker that played for them in the  60s.  It's been a long year working with that guy....

[The Show]

Wow...hasn't Central gone to the playoffs the previous 2 seasons as well???

[Dsquared]

Ok let's get this out of the way first. The block was legal, it should have been a no-call, and he never had control of the ball to spike it.

Now, congrats to Central. They were not the better team,they just played better when it counted. I hope they reverse their playoff history and make a huge run.

And let me be the first to say.....

WIAT 'TILL NEXT YEAR!  LONG LIVE THE EVIL EMPIRE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sorry fbdaddy... Central was the better team today.  Neither team was ever ahead by more than 7 points... both defenses are the real deal and played like champions.

I don't remember who said that Connell isn't the MVP, but I don't know what game (or season) they have been watching.  He put the ball on the money to receivers, ran the ball extremely well... h*ll, he even set up his block perfectly for his receiving TD.  He is the heart and soul of that Central team.  It was very easy to see the team rally around him when it came right down to it.

Now... use that #1 ranking and shove it up Mt. Union's stupid a**es whenever you play them.  Bring home the gold for the IIAC!!!

[Dsquared]

PS... Who is #90 on Central's D-line?  That guy was a freaking animal out there!!

[DutchHawk]

Garret Hill I think, he had a hell of a game. The front 3 effectively stopped the run by taking up blockers and getting off blocks. It was a great game to watch.

Coach Mac always preached it was a 1 team schedule, now thats the truth. Focus on Olivet and put it away early, send a message to SJU/Redlands winner that we arent kidding around this year!

[DutchHawk]

One parting shot for the crew from WB -

You have our permission to keep using the "Evil Empire" slogan.

We kind of think of you more as "mini me" - you want to be like us, but fall a little short.

I shutter to think what your team would have been without suckow??  We would let him transfer in for track season - pickup a title shot.

Believe me ,  We don't want to be like you

You dont want to be Back to Back to Back Champions?

[sportsknight]

If there is an infraction he makes his call.  The comment about letting them play for most of the game and then calling it in the last minute is not a legit statement.  I don't think they got together at half time and said hey we have not thrown our flags enough lets tighten up the play.  They called what they saw and enforced the rules.  You need to take the orange shades off and think about accusing the refs of "cheating". 

First off, I never accused anyone of cheating.  I'm a lot smarter than that.  I just question the timing.  If you can honestly say that you've never officiated differently depending on the situation in which the play happens, then I applaud you.  But I think we all know that's not always the case.  Just the same way that you don't see ticky-tack fouls called in the last minute of a close basketball game, you shouldn't see a 50-50 PI call made in that situation.

Same goes for your statement that "if there is an infraction he makes his call."  I don't think anyone here is naive enough to think that every penalty that is committed gets called.  We all know that there is holding on just about every play of every football game played across this country, but how often does it actually get flagged?  In yesterday's game, there wasn't a single holding call made against either team.  Does that on every single play, not once did anyone from either team get a fistful of jersey?  To say that the refs call 'em as they see 'em is a nice thought, but it just isn't the case.

Like I said, I've been an official before, and I've had upset parents ask me why I made a call one way or another.  I was happy to lay out my reasoning for them.  They didn't always like what I had to say, but that's just the way it goes.  I still say that referees should be held just as accountable for blown calls as anyone else.  To act like they are totally beyond reproach is a load of crap.  Yes, they're human and human eyes make mistakes.  But part of being a man is standing up and saying "This is why I did what I did."

That's about all I'm going to say on this issue.  Saying anymore won't do any good.  Time to put yesterday's game in the past.  Hopefully Central can make the rest of the conference look good with their play on Saturday and beyond.

[Old Dutch]

Wow, lots of sour wine to be made from all the grapes in Waverly these days.  Come on guys, if you all hadn't been playing up the WB team compared to '03, a truly great team, and talking "class of the conference" up until Auggie, we woduln't be enjoying this so much.

I'll throw you a bone and be the first to say WB ought to be pre-season favorites next year.  Only 9 seniors on that team, wow.  Of course you'll miss a few key people like Weber, Duchman, Van Rees, and Suckow plus I'm sure a couple in the trenches, (those guys never get any recognition!).  I'm sure Koehler has a shopping list of guys on this year's film's to recruit!!!  (is that the sarcasm emoti-thingy?)

Seriously folks, Simpson, Coe and you guys had plenty of youth this year (and Cornell) to make their future look bright.  Luther w/o Sherden, DBQ w/o Jackson, BV w/o Hawkins, and a great group of Dutch grads may make the conference a bit softer next year.  Of course I think the Dynasty will re-load but it will be an uphill batttle.

Props to Sportsknight for the first half reflection.  Several of us were very relieved to get into the lockerroom at the half only down by 7.  another play where the 'Burgers could have made the game tougher for us to win it, a 25 yard kickoff after one OB with 2 minutes to play, that short field was almost gift wrapped.