FB: American Rivers Conference

[doolittledog]

It is the choices people make that lead them down their path. 

This is a fair point, but you also have to keep in mind that there are some people in this world that have far fewer choices available to them.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending people that break the law.  But when given the choice between knocking off a liquor store and starving, I'm going into that liquor store.  When my only options left are seeing my family kicked out of our home or selling some weed and coke, I'll be the guy on the street corner with the paper bag in his hand.  Is that an ideal life to lead?  Hell no.  But sometimes it is better than the alternative.

You could take your family to a soup kitchen to get a meal.  Department of human services for food stamps.  Job services to find a job.  Again, it comes down to choices. 

[KCDutch]

It is the choices people make that lead them down their path. 

This is a fair point, but you also have to keep in mind that there are some people in this world that have far fewer choices available to them.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending people that break the law.  But when given the choice between knocking off a liquor store and starving, I'm going into that liquor store.  When my only options left are seeing my family kicked out of our home or selling some weed and coke, I'll be the guy on the street corner with the paper bag in his hand.  Is that an ideal life to lead?  Hell no.  But sometimes it is better than the alternative.

You could take your family to a soup kitchen to get a meal.  Department of human services for food stamps.  Job services to find a job.  Again, it comes down to choices. 

Choices seem bountiful and easy when you don't have to make basic ones to survive.  Heck, I've going back and forth on the pros and cons of moving to a different locale, and I still am not sure if it is a good idea or not.  I can't imagine making $6 per hour, living paycheck to paycheck and trying to feed a couple of kids.  For most people on this board, did you grow up w/out a father and/or in a dangerous enviroment?  Probably not, i didn't either. 

[DutchFan2004]

It is the choices people make that lead them down their path. 

This is a fair point, but you also have to keep in mind that there are some people in this world that have far fewer choices available to them.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending people that break the law.  But when given the choice between knocking off a liquor store and starving, I'm going into that liquor store.  When my only options left are seeing my family kicked out of our home or selling some weed and coke, I'll be the guy on the street corner with the paper bag in his hand.  Is that an ideal life to lead?  Hell no.  But sometimes it is better than the alternative.

You could take your family to a soup kitchen to get a meal.  Department of human services for food stamps.  Job services to find a job.  Again, it comes down to choices. 

With all the signs on Casey's stores, and burger joints with starting wages at $9 an hour not a lot of money but 360 a week that is some money and with benefits from the government somehow I think there are legal choices to be made.  Might involve sweat and work though.

[KCDutch]

One of the biggest problems that I have with this is knowing what I know now.  After moving to Chicago, and traveling all the burbs for work, I now know where some of these students grew up. 

One student was from Wilmette, IL.  This a very exclusive community on the north shore, directly north of Chicago.  There are no poor people living in Wilmette, when the median housing price is in excess of $700,000(Single Family Home)!

Wilmette is the equivilent of West Des Moines on crack, so I have a hard time understanding how this dictates you you being from a diverse background. 

If you can afford that type of real estate, you can afford to pay for your childrens education, and if the parrents do not wish to pay, then they better have great grades, because its all coming out of pocket. 

I think this is a somewhat ridiculous argument.  I was lucky, my parents had the capability to write a check for my college education, but I still applied and sought out scholarships/grants to help w/ the costs (and I received some nice financial aide).  Personally, I think my parents appreciated efforts and helping to pay for school.  

If you could get a good education for free, you would NOT apply and try for a free ride?  Does this mean a d1 athlete (who's parents can afford school) should walk on and pass up the free ride?  

As doolittle said, life is choices and you chose to go to BV and pay the education.  Another person might chose BV b/c they can get a full scholarship, seems like a good decision and one doolittle wished more people would make.

[dutchfan1]

... That would get in the way of the facultys plan to "diversify" the campus.  Its a corn field in NW IA, your pushing a rope up hill trying to "diversify" it...

diversity = education = better life (hopefully)

1 in 9 black men age 20 to 34 are in prison
1 in 36 Hispanic men age 18 or older are in prison
1 in 100 women age 35 to 39 are in prison
1 in 106 white men age 18 or older are in prison
1 in 355 white women age 35 to 39 are in prison
Source: Time Magazine

I think it's interesting (and a little sad, honestly) that the term "diversity" gets brought up, and people automatically picture an African American man robbing a liquor store.

There are so many elements of diversity: ethnic origin, sexual orientation, religious affiliation, gender, whether you come from a single or a dual income household, whether you/your parents have a military background, and so on....the term "diversity" has become the dirty buzz word when people automatically think of race.

I guess to me, diversity stands for promoting a host of different ideas, no matter what the shade of your skin is. I see diversity in education especially adventageous.

If we must look at diversity on a racial ground, however, I'd like to share with you an article on White Privilege -- it's an interesting concept. it speaks to the advantages that many white people are afforded because of their skin tone. http://seamonkey.ed.asu.edu/~mcisaac/emc598ge/Unpacking.html

(Wow, sorry, that was rather academic for a Monday morning...)

[knightlife06]

TheOne,
   I'll be taking orders.  Hy-Vee is catering and they always have real good food.

[Klopenhiemer]

Dutch good point but that wasn't mine. A student affored a full ride for academics or athletics deserves it regardless of location,parrents money, or anything else if the school feels this student is worthy of the award.

Giving out money to a student who comes from a diverse background, or giving them money and stating is because they grew up on the wrong side of the tracks os okay with me to. They should be afforded that chance.
Finding out they grew up in plush burb with plenty of moolah and getting this scholorship is another thing.

It pisses me off seeing this happen. I argue I saw more diversity in my life, grew up in a much rougher area, and was given nothing.
I hope you can now see where I am coming from.

[KCDutch]

Dutch good point but that wasn't mine. A student affored a full ride for academics or athletics deserves it regardless of location,parrents money, or anything else if the school feels this student is worthy of the award.

Giving out money to a student who comes from a diverse background, or giving them money and stating is because they grew up on the wrong side of the tracks os okay with me to. They should be afforded that chance.
Finding out they grew up in plush burb with plenty of moolah and getting this scholorship is another thing.

It pisses me off seeing this happen. I argue I saw more diversity in my life, grew up in a much rougher area, and was given nothing.
I hope you can now see where I am coming from.

Klop-

I see what you are saying, but I think the resentment is often aimed at the wrong group.  Often times, people resent the individuals receiving the money, but shouldn't your resentment be aimed at the institution.  I can't blame students for using any potential financial support (regardless of how much their parents income) possible.  Again, based on being "pissed" on a  scholarship to somebody who doesn't need it financially and maybe hasn't earned it w/ grades or athletically, you should be "pissed" I received any support.  I think we just view this differently, which is OK in this great country.

[dutchfan1]

I guess each institution sets its own priorities, and doles out money (in the form of aid) accordingly. Central, for example, provides a host of aid opportunities to people of Dutch descent -- imagine that!

I went to school with a guy that grew up in urban, south-side Chicago. Even though he was as pasty white as I am, his upbringing was radically different from my farmer's daughter upbringing in Manchester, IA. We had some of the best discussions. He came home with me to check out the farm life, and I visited him in Chicago. I guess I would consider that diversity.

I also had a really good friend at Central that grew up in the northern Chicago suburbs. She was rather well off, and had every advantage growing up. She, too, was a great person to have conversations with because she brought something completely different to the table, even though she was also white. (She, by the way, was hilarious when she visited my world -- on the farm.) I guess I would consider this diversity as well. I learned a great deal about diversity from each of these people, regardless of their skin tone.

I would be interested in learning how BV defines diversity.

[DutchFan2004]

DF1- those are great points.  Diversity does not have to be skin tones.  I think until we accept Dr king's message about accepting people for the content of the character intsead of the color of their skin we all lose.  When we can finally accept people as people we will never get to an equal place. 

[warthog]

So, based on this discussion, if the only people I don't like  or trust    happen to be persons who own a pair of wooden shoes or whose last names start with Van, Vande, or Vander I'm probably a fairly good guy. 

[KCDutch]

So, based on this discussion, if the only people I don't like  or trust    happen to be persons who own a pair of wooden shoes or whose last names start with Van, Vande, or Vander I'm probably a fairly good guy. 

What about the Norse?

[sportsknight]

So, based on this discussion, if the only people I don't like  or trust    happen to be persons who own a pair of wooden shoes or whose last names start with Van, Vande, or Vander I'm probably a fairly good guy. 

Sounds good to me.

[doolittledog]

So, based on this discussion, if the only people I don't like  or trust    happen to be persons who own a pair of wooden shoes or whose last names start with Van, Vande, or Vander I'm probably a fairly good guy. 

What about the Norse?

4-4 against Central this decade.  7-1 against the Norse...winning mellows the hate a bit I guess!!!

Also Central has 6 IIAC football titles this decade to Wartburgs 3...that might have something to do with it.  

[DutchFan2004]

So, based on this discussion, if the only people I don't like  or trust    happen to be persons who own a pair of wooden shoes or whose last names start with Van, Vande, or Vander I'm probably a fairly good guy. 

Sounds good to me.

Fairly is the key word correct?