FB: American Rivers Conference

[DutchFan2004]

I don't think any D-III team could beat a "I-A" team, but of course they beat "I-AA" non-scholarship teams all the time and I am sure they could beat many "I-AA" scholarship teams as well.

I was going to get around to responding to the D3 vs. D1-A, D1-AA, D1-AA(NS), DII etc.

Pat, didn't you or Keith track a running total of the D3 vs. the others?  How many D3 vs. D1-AA and D1-AA(NS) games were there last year?

Locally USD is one of the top D1-AA(NS) teams in the country...but when they venture out to play a D1-AA Scholarship team like a 4-7 UC Davis, USD gets beat.  Two years ago, at 11-0, they lobbied  to get into the top 16 1-AA payoff pool but were denied...rightfully so after dropping the game to a sub .500 UC Davis

I think 1-AA(NS) is not too far removed from D3...it's there so teams can play other sports at the D1 Scholarship level.

I think the upper tier UW-W's and MUC's of the world would be top D1-AA(NS) teams too.

Dutch Fans:  How do think Central would do against Drake?

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Drake=Coe.

I would think that Central would go 7-3 against Drake in a ten game series maybe 8-2.  I would say that Drake would compete with Coe, Central, and Wartburg.  UD would have been able to compete with Drake the last couple of years as well. 

[Klopenhiemer]

I believe that D3 is what the NCAA is talking about when they say "Most NCAA athletes go pro in something other than sports".

I agree to a point with this.  Think of how many football players at the d1 level there are.  10,000 round numbers.  With only 1600 NFL jobs that leaves a lot of D1 players doing something other than sports.  Then you have to consider the other sports like track, swimming, gymnastics, there are not to many pro spots for those athletes.  Then consider D2 and D3 on top of that there are not to many NCAA athletes going on to professional sports. 

Just remember that Tom Brady would not have gotten his shot at Michigan if Drew Henson would have not turned to pro baseball.  I do see some validity in this argument, but I do not think we fully understand how many all-state caliber players in large states such as FL, CA, and TX are given a full ride only to ride the pine for 5 years.  

Take a look at Blake Larson at Iowa.  I think it would be fair to say he would have been a dominating force playing on Beaver o-line and did not amount to much at Iowa.  

[5 Words or Less]

When we last left our hero ...

26 - Cornell's average ACT
27 - Returning IIAC All-Conference
28 - Inches, circumfrence (long side) football
35 - Years of NCAA D3 (organized 1973)
36 - Highest possible ACT score
36 - IIAC conference games played annually
37 - Letters spell IIAC
37 - Letters spell NCAA
38 - Years since Luther's Stagg Bowl - 1970
40 - Seconds, play clock (new 40/25 rule)
42 - Floridians on UD's 2007 roster
50 - Yards, width of football field
52 - Demolished homes for Coe's expansion
'53 - IIAC is first all-NCAA aligned conference in nation
58 - Points, Central's worst defeat
62 - Toilets in "The W"
64 - Dorm rooms overlook "The M"
80 - Coe's visitor bleacher seating capacity
80 - Coe's "view obstructed" seats in visitor's bleachers
97 - Buttons on my keyboard

[New Storm]

When we last left our hero ...

26 - Cornell's average ACT
27 - Returning IIAC All-Conference
28 - Inches, circumfrence (long side) football
35 - Years of NCAA D3 (organized 1973)
36 - Highest possible ACT score
36 - IIAC conference games played annually
37 - Letters spell IIAC
37 - Letters spell NCAA
38 - Years since Luther's Stagg Bowl - 1970
40 - Seconds, play clock (new 40/25 rule)
42 - Floridians on UD's 2007 roster
50 - Yards, width of football field
52 - Demolished homes for Coe's expansion
'53 - IIAC is first all-NCAA aligned conference in nation
58 - Points, Central's worst defeat
62 - Toilets in "The W"
64 - Dorm rooms overlook "The M"
80 - Coe's visitor bleacher seating capacity
80 - Coe's "view obstructed" seats in visitor's bleachers
97 - Buttons on my keyboard

That was amazing  Coe visitor seating 80 might be a little high 8) 8) 8)

[doolittledog]

I wondered where "5 Words or Less" had run off to!!!

Strangely enough, I mentioned on another message board just today that there was a poster on here with that screen name and guess what???  He shows back up...hmm!!!

[davedevine]

I agree with Pat, UWW or and D3 school for that matter would not beat Buffalo or Duke. 
They probably could beat a fair number of 1-AA schools though.  I would say probably not any in the top 25 however.  that's my opinion

as far as the transfers go, it sounds good that they are coming in from a bigger school, but just because someone was at Iowa or ISU and transfers into the IIAC doesn't make them an instant stud.  Give them  3-4  games &  you'll be able to tell what kind of impact they will/should have.   

drake is a glorified D3 school and I would love to see them start playing WB or Central on a regular basis.
I took a visit there so I could get out of school for a day and I felt Simpson and WB were superior to what they had to offer.

as far as scholarships go, d1 is full or nothing.  they don't do partial scholarships for football.  they have 85 and that's what they use. 

1-aa has 63 and they definitely split their's up.  UNI will normally try to get 2 in-state kids for the price of 1 scholarship.  They will use a full ride on out of state skill guys, etc.  If you look at their roster over the years, they get the OL and some DL from IA and rb, db, wr types from IL, WI, MN,KC, etc.

I believe the D2 is 36 or 24 depending on the conference they are in.  they most definitely try to stretch their $ as far as they can to get kids into camp. 

[footballdaddy]

I believe that D3 is what the NCAA is talking about when they say "Most NCAA athletes go pro in something other than sports".

I agree to a point with this.  Think of how many football players at the d1 level there are.  10,000 round numbers.  With only 1600 NFL jobs that leaves a lot of D1 players doing something other than sports.  Then you have to consider the other sports like track, swimming, gymnastics, there are not to many pro spots for those athletes.  Then consider D2 and D3 on top of that there are not to many NCAA athletes going on to professional sports. 

This ratio stays the same from high school to college also. Maybe 10% move up at each level. That makes the four A-P players in the NFL such an abnormality.

[dutchfan1]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Drake=Coe.

I agree -- Central and Wartburg (and some days any other school in the conference) could take Drake.

[DBQ1965]

This is what I have so far.  I'm not sure about a couple of spellings since they came from "secondary sources" ... If your name is missing, let me know on here.

IIAC FAN BASE
UD:  doolittledog, DBQ1965, Spurrier, WillieU, Keith45

Central:  dutchFan2004, Dutchfan1, Klompen, KCDutch, Dutchlb, oldbeake, Airborne Dutch

Wartburg:  Walston Hoover, sportsknight, Wartburg Fan, footballdaddy, TheOne89.1

Luther:  Ram2

BV:  The Show, Klopenheimer, BeaverOfYore

Coe:  Charlie Kohawk, coocooforcokohawks, Kohawk Krazy, the_mayne_event, Kohawk Remedy

Cornell:  Purple Hayes, Ash Park

Loras:

Simpson:  Storm-what?, sc-stormchaser, New Storm

[New Storm]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Drake=Coe.

I agree -- Central and Wartburg (and some days any other school in the conference) could take Drake.

Does Drake get fans to the game these days? They used to have less than a high school game there and every one left early

[dutchfan1]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Drake=Coe.

I agree -- Central and Wartburg (and some days any other school in the conference) could take Drake.

Does Drake get fans to the game these days? They used to have less than a high school game there and every one left early

I think they draw a pretty small crowd. Some of my SA buddies played for Drake, and they always complained about the attendance being limited to moms and girlfriends. (I just smiled because my team in Pella draws a decent crowd every Saturday it seems.)

Brings to mind an interesting question: Central, Wartburg and Coe always seemed to draw a decent crowd. UD and Loras used to have the smallest fan base, and everyone else seemed to fall somewhere in between. It always seemed that the teams that won the most had the most fans in the stands. Is this still the case? Is fan support based on the W's on the scorecard?

[footballdaddy]

I would agree wioth that. Everyone loves a winner- see Iowa, and to a lesser extent, Iowa State fans. It was the same thing with Drake basketball, no one showed up until they started winning (and the local media begged people to come out).

[doolittledog]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Drake=Coe.

I agree -- Central and Wartburg (and some days any other school in the conference) could take Drake.

Does Drake get fans to the game these days? They used to have less than a high school game there and every one left early

I think they draw a pretty small crowd. Some of my SA buddies played for Drake, and they always complained about the attendance being limited to moms and girlfriends. (I just smiled because my team in Pella draws a decent crowd every Saturday it seems.)

Brings to mind an interesting question: Central, Wartburg and Coe always seemed to draw a decent crowd. UD and Loras used to have the smallest fan base, and everyone else seemed to fall somewhere in between. It always seemed that the teams that won the most had the most fans in the stands. Is this still the case? Is fan support based on the W's on the scorecard?

I think winning certainly helps in putting butts in the seats.  But, support from the school and getting people excited about the team also helps.  Going back to the late 80's and early 90's Wartburg and Luther drew decent crowds at their place and they weren't at the top of the conference at that time.  Central, for that matter was the only team that brought a noticable away crowd with them while I was at UD.  When I was at UD, the administration could not have cared less about football, and it just trickled down from there.  From profs to the students there was a lack of passion for the team.  If the Hawkeyes were on TV we would stay in the dorms and watch that game and just peek our heads out of the window from time to time to see what the score was over at Chalmers.  Now, while UD has been winning more, which is good, you also have an administration that has figured out it's a good thing to push the football team as a rallying point for the whole school.  Get the fans excited for the football team and you get them excited for the whole school in general.  

[doolittledog]

I would agree wioth that. Everyone loves a winner- see Iowa, and to a lesser extent, Iowa State fans. It was the same thing with Drake basketball, no one showed up until they started winning (and the local media begged people to come out).

I shouldn't but I will.  To a LESSER extent ISU???

I guess I take exception to the notion that Iowa has bandwagon fans while ISU has true fans.  I have been in Kinnick stadium when the team stunk and the place was sold out.  I have been in Jack Trice when it was less than half full. 

The smallest crowd I have ever seen at Iowa was 53,000 for an early season non-con against a MAC team.  The Hawkeyes lowest season average has been 61k and change going back to 1999.  I have been in Jack Trice when there wasn't over 20k in the stadium.  And that was in 1985 when they were 4 years removed from being a bowl team!!!  ISU has averaged between 37k and 46k dating back to 1999 with Iowa averaging between 61k and 70k.  They have both had a 9k range in averages, but percentage wise Iowa would be the more consistant.   

Oh never mind, you can't change peoples opinions. 

[sc_stormchaser]

I have a different take on the Drake vs. IIAC. Before I say this, please remember I love the IIAC conference, played at SC for four years and attend multiple SC games in a given year. I can speak to watching both Drake and Simpson in the same year. And before I hear the argument - "well, Simpson has been down the past few years" - I watched Simpson hang with a very talented Central team last year and watched Drake play within a few weeks of that. If you have attended a Drake game in the past few years, I have a hard time believing you would think they would go less in 9-1, 8-2 in the IIAC almost every year. Are they a glorified DIII team, probably so. But I think you can really see a difference in the speed of play.

In the past four years, Drake is 11-0 versus NCAA II, III and NAIA teams and they are 1-8 versus I-AA scholarship teams. Of course, 4 of those losses are to UNI.

As for the "no one attending the Drake games," it's all relative. You have to rememeber that Drake Stadium seats over 14,000, so it's going to look somewhat empty. If I remember correctly, Drake averages 4-5,000 at their home games. That's on par with Wartburg and Central, right?