Around the Nation board

[Pat Coleman]

Something to keep an eye on in the losing streak department is the 34 varsity games lost in a row by Gallaudet. The Bison have been popping back and forth from club to varsity since 1995 or so and while they have certainly won games as a club team, they have not won a game when bound by NCAA rules since 1991.

Heidelberg will pass 34 before the end of the season if it doesn't win one of its remaining games, but Gallaudet will pop back into the list next September.

[Knightstalker]

am I the only one reading this stuff? thought someone would post this by now... from SI.com writer Pete McEntegart's The 10 Spot

"...Up in New England on Saturday, meanwhile, Williams (Mass.) College -- the 10 Spot's Official Division III team -- ended Trinity's 31-game winning streak with a convincing 41-16 home victory. Congratulations to coach Mike Whalen and the Ephs."

I got five on it that he says nothing when Amherst beats them.

I know he has mentioned them losing in previous columns.  He actually seems to be able to poke fun at things that deserve it, including himself at times.

[K-Mack]

Knight,
that's cool.

Over on the blog, people are keeping with the theme of the week.

VOJ Says:
The 6th of October, 2006 at 9:58 am
Keith...once again your bias against SJU comes out..."St. John's hasn't overwhelmed in either of its MIAC games."...I guess 60-0 against Augsburg doesn't count...of course Augy just pushed Concordia to overtime before losing...And believe it or not Carleton beat Bethel and then SJU overwhelmed them in the second half...with a second string QB. I can't remember the last time I read anything positive from you concerning SJU...maybe I am wrong and if I am my bad...but maybe I'm right

I don't know why people assume conspiracy theories first, without considering any other explanation. Maybe it sounds cooler when you write in. But when trying to keep track of 234 teams, mistakes happen. I certainly don't have time to pick out teams and hate them.

While I do think St. John's and Rowan teams get a lot of early respect in the polls off name-recognition most years (both tend to back it up though), I didn't skip the Augsburg win as a way to get in a subtle dig at the Johnnies fans savvy enough to pick up the mistake. I just missed it.

I was aiming to say they hadn't overwhelmed at all really, but I used the MIAC qualifier because the Johnnies did smoke UW-River Falls ... and I glazed right over the Augsburg game. My mistake ... it's been pointed out three times now.

I don't know where you folks come up with some of this stuff, but as far as the tone of the responses ... you get the amount of respect you give.

There's another one from Mount St. Joseph's and some more in the inbox for later.

[K-Mack]

OK,
Last one for now. And all the ATN e-mail isn't this crazy, but a lot of it is. I like to share it and my responses in hopes that it will answer some questions some other folks may have and deter additional accusatory e-mails.

From:   "South, John" <John_South@xxxxxxxxxx>
To:   <keith@d3football.com>
Subject:   First no love, now no respect?
Date:   Fri, 6 Oct 2006 11:29:09 -0400 (EDT)   

Sir,

We communicated briefly last year in regard the to the schematics of the then
upcoming playoff system. I am now writing in due regard to your lack of respect
for the College of Mt. St. Joseph. First we see no love in the d3 poll, even
though the coaches tend to see us as the 19th best school in the country, but
then you fail to mention us in the recent around the nation news brief. What am
I talking about? I am talking about the list of unbeateans. MSJ is currently
heralding an unbeaten record of 4-0 and will see 5-0 come this Saturday at
Hanover. Yes the same Hanover that made our win streak come to an abrupt end
last year, but presumably so, "who cares about some small catholic college in
Cincinnati?" I do. We not only deserve the love on the d3 poll, but we demand
the respect amongst the nation. Do you think our top-notch defense stands for
nothing? Do you think we rank amongst the nation's best for nothing?

Show some love to MSJ,

John R. South

John,
I appreciate the e-mail, if not the tone.

Coach Huber has e-mailed in the past, and although we have never met, he seems like a good guy. I wish your program continued success, I don't know why being a Catholic school from Cincinnati would make me against you; most D3 schools are small and off the beaten path. We are the ones who respect you in spite of that.

The coaches are entitled to their opinion(s). Every last one of them knows football better than I do, but they also have their own teams to worry about. The AFCA poll tends to be heavily weighted on wins and losses.

I, like other D3football.com pollsters (including the coaches who vote in our poll, I'd guess) tend not to view all wins as equal. And in the Lions' case, their chances to impress the national voters comes in their non-conference schedule. Beating Wilmington, Rose-Hulman and Illinois Wesleyan (an upgrade from Kzoo) with Thomas More to finish the season ... well, that's not as impressive as, say, losing to Rowan and beating Mary Hardin-Baylor and Salisbury. With regard to MSJ, I know it can only beat the teams on its schedule, and that alone can get you into the top 25 discussion. But the top 25 is an elite group. With double the number of teams, it's roughly equivalent to a Division I-A top 12. MSJ is not playing a single non-conference powerhouse. The last games against power teams were 49-6 in last year's playoffs (MUC) and 31-7 against Wheaton the year before. I understand those are previous years, but non-conference results help us shape our opinions of conference strength, and until Franklin beat Wabash earlier this year, only Hanover had any elite opponents that I can think of (W&J and Bridgewater) and the results weren't always pretty.

So I'd be doing you and the rest of our readers a disservice if I told you MSJ was No. 19 overall. I don't think they're better than the top three teams in the OAC.

This "love" from us that everyone seeks, it's not given away on whims. It's earned. When MSJ shows us it can beat, or at least hang with, an elite opponent, I am certain our voters will take notice.

[Warren Thompson]

K-Mack:

Consider yourself lucky. At least Mr. South didn't directly accuse you of an anti-Catholic bias .... 

[Knightstalker]

K-Mack:

Consider yourself lucky. At least Mr. South didn't directly accuse you of an anti-Catholic bias .... 

You mean there are actually people out there that don't like Bingo and Bake Sales?

[Preto]

MIAA football budgets, as reported to the NCAA:

Albion     $269,194
Alma       $255,740
Hope       $217,750
Adrian     $202,250
Olivet      $173,500

How does this compare to other D3 schools.

sorry if this has already been posted and discussed.

[frank uible]

$269,000 gets you half a year's (or less) salary (excluding fringes) for several DIA HFCs.

[WIACPOWER]

Coe is the 25th ranked team in d3football.com.  Of their 5 wins the opponents have a combined 6 wins.  Is Coe that good? 

[Pat Coleman]

Better than your math.

This is the info the voters got on Coe this week. I count eight wins, not five.

No. 25 Coe (5-1):
Sep 02   AWAY   Illinois Wesleyan (1-4)   W   21-34
Sep 09   HOME   Aurora (1-4)   W   45-0
Sep 16   AWAY   Luther (1-5)   W   10-16
Sep 23   HOME   Buena Vista (2-3)   W   41-17
Sep 30   HOME   Loras (3-2)   L   30-32
Oct 07   AWAY   Dubuque (3-3)   W   23-37

[religion_major]

I guess to most here complaining about their school's position in the poll I am going to sound like I am rubbing salt in a wound.  I believe that the d3football.com poll is well researched.  By Mid-Season voters have started to figure out where the think teams belong as conference play is heating up.  Remember that in the Preseason and first few weeks poll position is established.  After that a team from the outside must do something impressive (ie beat an established national powerhouse) to get "love" from the pollsters.  Another thing to remember is that their is one way for a team to force the pollsters to take notice of it, win some playoff games.  When a team wins playoff games it shows that it is at the top of the divison.  Teams that consistantly win playoff games tend to get the benefit of the doubt in the polls even on down years.   

[Ron Boerger]

Better than your math.

This is the info the voters got on Coe this week. I count eight wins, not five.

No. 25 Coe (5-1):
Sep 02   AWAY   Illinois Wesleyan (1-4)   W   21-34
Sep 09   HOME   Aurora (1-4)   W   45-0
Sep 16   AWAY   Luther (1-5)   W   10-16
Sep 23   HOME   Buena Vista (2-3)   W   41-17
Sep 30   HOME   Loras (3-2)   L   30-32
Oct 07   AWAY   Dubuque (3-3)   W   23-37

That said, Pat, those are pretty unimpressive results for a team ranked in the top 25.  They lost to one .500 team, marginally beat another, and have a six point win against a 1-5 Luther squad.   There are one loss teams out there with arguably better results against better competition. 

Good for Coe getting some recognition, it'll all work out later in the season. 

[Pat Coleman]

That's true -- but it's only the No. 25 spot, it's not like they're ranked No. 9. Coe only has 53 points. They're not exactly blowing away the field.

They have Wartburg and Central at home coming up. We'll have more data then.

[K-Mack]

MIAA football budgets, as reported to the NCAA:

Albion     $269,194
Alma       $255,740
Hope       $217,750
Adrian     $202,250
Olivet      $173,500

How does this compare to other D3 schools.

I'd like to know your source for these numbers. If reporting to the NCAA is required, we'd be able to compare other conference's reports to these MIAA numbers. As of now, I don't know whether these numbers are good or bad, but I'd imagine they are average or low-end of the average. I'd bet the best budgets come from schools with strong traditions and/or alumni bases ... I'm pretty sure donation-gathering booster programs are permitted.

I also know road trips can cost well into the tens of thousands and years when new jerseys or new equipment is purchased can be very expensive. There are lots of unseen expenses too ... this is a great story idea.

[Pat Coleman]

That info is actually reported to the U.S. Department of Education -- at least that's where I think I've seen it. Only schools required to submit Title IX-relevant data send that in. (Not single-gender institutions, not schools which don't accept federal financial aid such as Grove City, etc.)