Around the Nation board

[K-Mack]

The Music City Miracle was a re-incarnation of the SMU-Texas Tech game in 1982 to preserve SMU's #2 ranking.  That highlight is at the end of this 3 minute clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx1PccepNHQ

Of course, though, you must realize that SMU's payroll rivaled this year's Houston Texans!!

No!  Any SMU payroll went out the window in 1987!

A not-very-bold prediction...

If Alabama did not warrant the death penalty with their infractions from earlier this decade, then the NCAA will never give the death penalty again!

Since the death penalty at SMU, the Southwest Conference has dissolved, SMU has disbanded its most successful team sport (Men's indoor and outdoor track), and we have seen the WAC, the Mountain West and Conference USA go thru all sorts of configurations.   

The Athletic Department is floundering as the 6th most important D-1 athletic program in the DFW market.  (UT, A&M, OU, Texas Tech, TCU, SMU)

I believe they fired their football coach today as well.

Not to add insult to injury or anything.

I forget the details surrounding the death penalty for SMU, but it's been a generation, right? I mean, Craig James is in the booth these days. Time to let SMU creep back into normal life, right?

[Ralph Turner]

SMU is not a good match anywhere these days.  Is the Conference-USA West a real threat in anything?  UTEP, Tulsa, SMU, Rice, Houston, Tulane?  Rice plays baseball, but SMU hasn't had baseball for 40 years.  SMU's mens' soccer team has been in the Missouri Valley and now competes in the C-USA.

The sport profile now at SMU is 6 men (FB, BB, Soccer, Golf, Tennis and Swimming) and 11 women's sports.  I guess the Women's Basketball team is probably the most competitive over the last decade.

I don't even think that they could find a home in D-III.  They are not a research university, thus no UAA.  They are much bigger than the SCAC schools.

Maybe C-USA is the right place.  They have led the C-USA in the Director's Cup for the past several years.  (Wooo-hooo.  Especially since UTexas is in contention to win the whole thing some years.)   The West rivals are familiar to SMU fans, but things have certainly changed since 1987.  And, they seem to have passed SMU by in athletics.

[K-Mack]

Yeah,
I agree with most of that.

I guess a lot of the perception revolves mostly around football (especially in Texas). Generally speaking, although there are exceptions, when football's going well, everything else seems to go well.

Then also I sometimes wonder why we are obsessed with championships and such.* To me, that's the mark of a competitor, of someone who's hungry for a challenge, but I bet SMU has to sell the opposite, as do many D3s ... You play for the sheer experience of playing.

_{* I reserve the right to explain myself with regard to the die-hard opposition to the BCS/lack of a playoff in D1A. If you're going to play for the joy of playing, don't try to shove a severely flawed "championship" system down our throats. Do it right or don't do it at all. Simple, right?}

[redswarm81]

. . . I sometimes wonder why we are obsessed with championships and such.<sup>*

*</sup> I reserve the right to explain myself with regard to the die-hard opposition to the BCS/lack of a playoff in D1A. If you're going to play for the joy of playing, don't try to shove a severely flawed "championship" system down our throats. Do it right or don't do it at all. Simple, right?

There is a tiny, negative karma-besieged, yet intellectually and philosophically consistent minority out there who asks the question

In college athletics, why is a national championship necessary?

Sure it's fun, but how does it improve the quality of the education over the benefits derived from participating in a regular season and maybe local conference championships?  Isn't this a question that, at minimum, ought to be addressed before national championship tournaments are organized?

It is a helluva good time, though.

[Ralph Turner]

The need for a national championship has been addressed, and is still being considered.

The "secessionists", the D-IV'ers or whatever you want to call them are proposing these types of changes in the "Future of D-III" debate.

I refer you to the voluminous contemporaneous debate on the Future of D-III message board.

However, as it stands now, only the NESCAC, and in only one sport, has held true to that principle.

[HScoach]

Maybe we should just quit keeping score all together since it's simply for the joy of competition that we play the game......

I've never understood the mindset of those that don't want to compete to see who's the best.  If being the best isn't important, I wonder if these schools are going to quit keeping track of GPA's too?   Wouldn't want the lesser students to feel slighted by not finishing top in their class.

Dumb.  Just plain dumb.

[repete]

However, as it stands now, only the NESCAC, and in only one sport, has held true to that principle.

Well, only a "certain kind" of true, right? Don't NESCAC teams go to postseason in other sports?

[redswarm81]

Maybe we should just quit keeping score all together since it's simply for the joy of competition that we play the game......

I've never understood the mindset of those that don't want to compete to see who's the best.  If being the best isn't important, I wonder if these schools are going to quit keeping track of GPA's too?   Wouldn't want the lesser students to feel slighted by not finishing top in their class.

Dumb.  Just plain dumb.

I don't understand what you're saying, coach.  If we don't keep score, then it's not a competition--so where's the joy of competition when there's no competition?

I think you're addressing an issue that hasn't been raised.  I fear that you're misinterpreting the question of why we need national championships in college athletics, and answering your misinterpretation.

Maybe you are addressing the question, but if so, you skipped a few steps between "national championship" and "keeping score."

As for competing to see who's the best, of course students compete with each other to be the best, and furthermore, the colleges compete with each other to provide the best education, because that's what colleges are selling-education.  But colleges aren't awarding degrees for athletic prowess.

For example, does anyone think that a degree from the University of Houston (called "Cougar High School" by Houstonians) is more valuable than it otherwise would be, just because their basketball team played in the Final Four three years in a row?

[redswarm81]

The need for a national championship has been addressed, and is still being considered.

By the NCAA?  I'd love to hear their explanation.  Is it as compelling as their explanation of why American Indian-related nicknames and imagery must be stricken from NCAA-member schools?

The "secessionists", the D-IV'ers or whatever you want to call them are proposing these types of changes in the "Future of D-III" debate.

I refer you to the voluminous contemporaneous debate on the Future of D-III message board.

However, as it stands now, only the NESCAC, and in only one sport, has held true to that principle.

And the NESCAC takes a lot of heat on these message boards for their steadfast adherence to principle (albeit in only one sport).

[smedindy]

The Music City Miracle was a re-incarnation of the SMU-Texas Tech game in 1982 to preserve SMU's #2 ranking.  That highlight is at the end of this 3 minute clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx1PccepNHQ

Of course, though, you must realize that SMU's payroll rivaled this year's Houston Texans!!

No!  Any SMU payroll went out the window in 1987!

I meant THAT SMU payroll rivals today's Houston Texans. However, it is sad when what should be their glory days, all you can think of is how much they cheated. I don't think I've ever heard Craig James talk about that scandal.

Perhaps SMU should join the Southland or something, and scale back to 1-AA football?

[Ralph Turner]

The Music City Miracle was a re-incarnation of the SMU-Texas Tech game in 1982 to preserve SMU's #2 ranking.  That highlight is at the end of this 3 minute clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx1PccepNHQ

Of course, though, you must realize that SMU's payroll rivaled this year's Houston Texans!!

No!  Any SMU payroll went out the window in 1987!

I meant THAT SMU payroll rivals today's Houston Texans. However, it is sad when what should be their glory days, all you can think of is how much they cheated. I don't think I've ever heard Craig James talk about that scandal.

Perhaps SMU should join the Southland or something, and scale back to 1-AA football?

SMU's endowment went over $1Billion this year.

They are raising lots of money, but it doesn't translate into any type of academic respect.  The feature story at the beginning of school was about alcohol use/abuse on the campus. 

As for going 1-AA, their academic peers are not Sam Houston State or McNeese.

They could drop football.  The Dallas Morning News Sports Day section would win a prize for the feature coverage of the story.  It would be news for a week, and then forgotten.

It is really sad.

But, I have moved on to D-III! 

[redswarm81]

SMU's endowment went over $1Billion this year.

As for going 1-AA, their academic peers are not Sam Houston State or McNeese.

They could drop football.

It is really sad.

But, I have moved on to D-III! 

Mind those prepositions.  Up to D-III!

I recall reading an article circa 1991, discussing SMU's football future, post-death penalty.  In that article, the D-III option was mentioned, and it even mentioned that SMU might be competing against the likes of Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute.  Since the article was in a Texas paper (I remember not which one), I was surprised to see the RPI mention.

[Ron Boerger]

Since the article was in a Texas paper (I remember not which one), I was surprised to see the RPI mention.

Hey, we 'uns here in Texas ain't all dumb hicks. 

The author probably either wanted to cast SMU against a "comparable" elite D3 school back east or was an alumnus.   No self-respecting Dallas or Houston writer is going to do anything as gauche as compare SMU to a Texas D3 school because obviously SMU is way superior (and actually, they probably are - though I will note that Trinity, half the size of SMU, has 80% of their endowment). 

[old ends]

I am really enjoying the knowledge that those on these post have. When I lived in New England for a few years I would attend some Empire 8 and Liberty League games not knowing anything about D3sports in general. Went to a John Hopkings basketball game the begining of this year an a parent who I never saw before started taking to me about Div III. Told me about D3hoops which lead me to here.  thanks

[Ralph Turner]

Since the article was in a Texas paper (I remember not which one), I was surprised to see the RPI mention.

Hey, we 'uns here in Texas ain't all dumb hicks. 

The author probably either wanted to cast SMU against a "comparable" elite D3 school back east or was an alumnus.   No self-respecting Dallas or Houston writer is going to do anything as gauche as compare SMU to a Texas D3 school because obviously SMU is way superior (and actually, they probably are - though I will note that Trinity, half the size of SMU, has 80% of their endowment). 

The reference to RPI was probably in the context of RPI alumnus and member of the RPI Hall of Fame, Erik Jonsson, the former Dallas mayor, a pioneer at Texas Instruments, and a major player in the creation of the DFW International Airport.

As for the use of the preposition, the word "on" more accurately describes the nature of the migration.