FB: American Southwest Conference

[jknezek]

To be honest, we don't need a facilities arms race in D3 like we've seen in other divisions. I'd prefer D3 to keep the focus on students, not athletes. My own school recently improved their facilities and I have no doubt it has helped in W&L's football upswing. The old stadium was substantially unchanged since the 50s and the locker rooms/weight room were a disgrace when I was there. All that being said, D3 just doesn't need the arms race. I'd prefer the money be spent in other areas.

[Warren Thompson]

It's a daunting combination and not one that many D3 college administrators/ADs have the desire (admin)/resources(ADs) to overcome.

Perhaps it's a good thing that there aren't many other UMHB-like venues in DIII.

I'm not really sure what your beef is. Do you hate UWW and MU for their success? I think UWW has been great in football and basketball. Should they be booed for being great? I don't like that we haven't beat them, but I don't want to leave because of that. I'm really confused at the hatred for UMHB. They've worked hard to achieve what they have done. I'm not saying other schools have to be like UMHB, be your self, create your own dynamics, be great at what you do. Don't hate. I don't like the Yankees, but, man, they've done what they had to do to be productive. Someone please explain this to me.

You didn't respond to my previous response to your post, either.

Hold on, man. I have no "beef" with UMHB, nor do I "hate" it. I merely offered some personal sentiments. By the way, I wasn't aware that you'd responded to my earlier post (you mentioned Pat and some "sages" -- and I'm neither).

[Warren Thompson]

To be honest, we don't need a facilities arms race in D3 like we've seen in other divisions. I'd prefer D3 to keep the focus on students, not athletes. My own school recently improved their facilities and I have no doubt it has helped in W&L's football upswing. The old stadium was substantially unchanged since the 50s and the locker rooms/weight room were a disgrace when I was there. All that being said, D3 just doesn't need the arms race. I'd prefer the money be spent in other areas.

Amen.

[Pat Coleman]

To be honest, we don't need a facilities arms race in D3 like we've seen in other divisions. I'd prefer D3 to keep the focus on students, not athletes. My own school recently improved their facilities and I have no doubt it has helped in W&L's football upswing. The old stadium was substantially unchanged since the 50s and the locker rooms/weight room were a disgrace when I was there. All that being said, D3 just doesn't need the arms race. I'd prefer the money be spent in other areas.

Well, it is happening. Maybe not with stadiums in this level, but a decade ago, it was weight rooms. Now it's video boards and locker rooms. These things are happening.

[Warren Thompson]

To be honest, we don't need a facilities arms race in D3 like we've seen in other divisions. I'd prefer D3 to keep the focus on students, not athletes. My own school recently improved their facilities and I have no doubt it has helped in W&L's football upswing. The old stadium was substantially unchanged since the 50s and the locker rooms/weight room were a disgrace when I was there. All that being said, D3 just doesn't need the arms race. I'd prefer the money be spent in other areas.

Well, it is happening. Maybe not with stadiums in this level, but a decade ago, it was weight rooms. Now it's video boards and locker rooms. These things are happening.

I fear you're correct, Pat, and it can be to the detriment of the institution.

[Toby Taff]

To be honest, we don't need a facilities arms race in D3 like we've seen in other divisions. I'd prefer D3 to keep the focus on students, not athletes. My own school recently improved their facilities and I have no doubt it has helped in W&L's football upswing. The old stadium was substantially unchanged since the 50s and the locker rooms/weight room were a disgrace when I was there. All that being said, D3 just doesn't need the arms race. I'd prefer the money be spent in other areas.

That's my point. this has all been about the students. When Dr. Bawcom came to UMHB it was not in the best financial shape. The University worked hard under his administration to reverse that. Part of his vision was creating a campus where students wanted to be and through improving facilities, adding sports, and creating new traditions they have done that. I agree we don't need a d3 facilities race, but at the same time there's no reason a school shouldn't take advantage of every opportunity it has. UMHB is not designing or building the new stadium without the relationship with Drayton McLane. If you ever experienced the Maybee Gym before the mayborn center was built, you know what the facilities were like. UMHB needed better facilities for the students.

[Toby Taff]

To be honest, we don't need a facilities arms race in D3 like we've seen in other divisions. I'd prefer D3 to keep the focus on students, not athletes. My own school recently improved their facilities and I have no doubt it has helped in W&L's football upswing. The old stadium was substantially unchanged since the 50s and the locker rooms/weight room were a disgrace when I was there. All that being said, D3 just doesn't need the arms race. I'd prefer the money be spent in other areas.

Amen.

I would add that UMHB is spending plenty on non-athletic improvements: 20M for a new nursing  building, 30M for a new Student Union Building, 5M for a new visual arts building, + the new resident facilities that have opened.

[jknezek]

That's my point. this has all been about the students. When Dr. Bawcom came to UMHB it was not in the best financial shape. The University worked hard under his administration to reverse that. Part of his vision was creating a campus where students wanted to be and through improving facilities, adding sports, and creating new traditions they have done that. I agree we don't need a d3 facilities race, but at the same time there's no reason a school shouldn't take advantage of every opportunity it has. UMHB is not designing or building the new stadium without the relationship with Drayton McLane. If you ever experienced the Maybee Gym before the mayborn center was built, you know what the facilities were like. UMHB needed better facilities for the students.

I've never been to UMHB and never even seen pictures of the facilities. My comment was more just a general commentary on the state of D3. To my mind this conversation derived from an early thought about UMHB dominating the ASC (in football) because they perhaps have budgeted resources in a more aggressive manner. I don't know if this is true or not, and I don't particularly care.

What I do know is that in the deep south and the west especially, D3 is rather sparse. Conferences aren't so much "mission and values" oriented as they are "travel and situation" oriented. That is very different than in other areas of the country. The south and west can easily lead to a situation where it may not be a good idea to devote resources in excess of your conference mates regardless of whether you have the means or desire to do so. Your options for finding a new AQ home, should you tick off your current one, are not very good.

You can't blame teams that don't want to budget resources the way you do, and the flip side is true as well. However, if you are the one sticking out, and the others are of a like mind, you might just be the one getting the shaft. In other words, if you dominate your conference by some perceived advantage that the conference doesn't want to accomodate, it is possible you will find yourself on the outside looking in.

[umhbalum]

I have a feeling that UMHB won't be in Div III 5 years from now....

[jknezek]

I have a feeling that UMHB won't be in Div III 5 years from now....

That would be sad. D3 is in a tough spot in the south and west. There just isn't a critical mass of teams that allow for the varying desires/needs of D3 schools. So you have marriages of convenience instead of good fits. I hope that the problem is eventually solved by MORE schools joining D3 rather than some outliers leaving.

[Toby Taff]

I have a feeling that UMHB won't be in Div III 5 years from now....

That would be sad. D3 is in a tough spot in the south and west. There just isn't a critical mass of teams that allow for the varying desires/needs of D3 schools. So you have marriages of convenience instead of good fits. I hope that the problem is eventually solved by MORE schools joining D3 rather than some outliers leaving.

that may be true. I hope not, but it could happen.

[crufootball]

To be honest, we don't need a facilities arms race in D3 like we've seen in other divisions. I'd prefer D3 to keep the focus on students, not athletes. My own school recently improved their facilities and I have no doubt it has helped in W&L's football upswing. The old stadium was substantially unchanged since the 50s and the locker rooms/weight room were a disgrace when I was there. All that being said, D3 just doesn't need the arms race. I'd prefer the money be spent in other areas.

Well, it is happening. Maybe not with stadiums in this level, but a decade ago, it was weight rooms. Now it's video boards and locker rooms. These things are happening.

Also its not just with athletics, non-atheles now want/demand bigger and better. Private schools especially need every student so they have to have the latest and greatest options. Financial aid is great, but if you don't have the latest fad a student will walk away.

[umhb2001]

To be honest, we don't need a facilities arms race in D3 like we've seen in other divisions. I'd prefer D3 to keep the focus on students, not athletes. My own school recently improved their facilities and I have no doubt it has helped in W&L's football upswing. The old stadium was substantially unchanged since the 50s and the locker rooms/weight room were a disgrace when I was there. All that being said, D3 just doesn't need the arms race. I'd prefer the money be spent in other areas.

When someone donates money for a specific item, it has to be spent that way.

[umhb2001]

To be honest, we don't need a facilities arms race in D3 like we've seen in other divisions. I'd prefer D3 to keep the focus on students, not athletes. My own school recently improved their facilities and I have no doubt it has helped in W&L's football upswing. The old stadium was substantially unchanged since the 50s and the locker rooms/weight room were a disgrace when I was there. All that being said, D3 just doesn't need the arms race. I'd prefer the money be spent in other areas.

That's my point. this has all been about the students. When Dr. Bawcom came to UMHB it was not in the best financial shape. The University worked hard under his administration to reverse that. Part of his vision was creating a campus where students wanted to be and through improving facilities, adding sports, and creating new traditions they have done that. I agree we don't need a d3 facilities race, but at the same time there's no reason a school shouldn't take advantage of every opportunity it has. UMHB is not designing or building the new stadium without the relationship with Drayton McLane. If you ever experienced the Maybee Gym before the mayborn center was built, you know what the facilities were like. UMHB needed better facilities for the students.

I totally agree. I did see the old place. It was quaint. The new facilities are all about students.

[LaCollegeFan]

What no one has mentioned is money only takes a football program so far. UMHB is good because they have a lot of TALENT. They have the will to win. Anyone can throw money at a program, but without the proper players, coaches, etc. then money will not really matter. So don't say UMHB has dominated the ASC because they spend more than other schools. They are just really good. As a LC fan, I am really looking forward to hosting #2 UMHB, so hopefully we can show the nation that the ASC has more than one great team.