FB: American Southwest Conference

[footballfan413]

As a former coach, I am rather amused at all the barbs being thrown at Coach Fredenberg from people who have not lived and worked with the staff and team inside and out since August.  Who knows his players better than he?!!

It is always easier to say what should have been done after the decision has been made and it did not work out.  His defense had stopped UWW the series before rather emphatically.  I know Pete and I know he took input from his staff  and his gut feelings about the game into consideration before he made the call.  Also he had less than one minute during the timeout to arrive at his conclusion.  Until you have been in that position I think you can wonder why he made the decision he did but not to the point of castigating him for it.  After all, he was one third down completion from perhaps seeming like a genius. 

UMHB fans need to remember all he has done for the program since beginning it sixteen years ago and getting it to eleven post seasons, (ten of those in a row) and seven seasons with twelve wins or more.  Compare those figures to any other new program in D3.

The other fans for other schools and conferences who are raking him over the coals should consider what it would be like for us to go on their boards and speak derogatory about their coach and team or just plain go away.

I know this is probably not a real popular post and my negative karma (which I am quite proud of being such a low percentage) may take some hits.  However, Pete was my son's coach and mentor and he is my friend, so I for one am going to stick up for him!  Hang in there Pete!!!

Plus karma from me.  Those stats are ridiculous when you think about the Crusaders relatively short D-3 lifespan! Class program from top to bottom!  Hope you and your family are well.

[umhb2001]

Feel terrible for the player that dropped that probable game winning touchdown.  That's one that I don't think you'll ever shake off.

Freshman who wasn't even on the 2Deep this week. Hadn't caught a pass all season long.

[umhb2001]

As a former coach, I am rather amused at all the barbs being thrown at Coach Fredenberg from people who have not lived and worked with the staff and team inside and out since August.  Who knows his players better than he?!!

It is always easier to say what should have been done after the decision has been made and it did not work out.  His defense had stopped UWW the series before rather emphatically.  I know Pete and I know he took input from his staff  and his gut feelings about the game into consideration before he made the call.  Also he had less than one minute during the timeout to arrive at his conclusion.  Until you have been in that position I think you can wonder why he made the decision he did but not to the point of castigating him for it.  After all, he was one third down completion from perhaps seeming like a genius. 

UMHB fans need to remember all he has done for the program since beginning it sixteen years ago and getting it to eleven post seasons, (ten of those in a row) and seven seasons with twelve wins or more.  Compare those figures to any other new program in D3.

The other fans for other schools and conferences who are raking him over the coals should consider what it would be like for us to go on their boards and speak derogatory about their coach and team or just plain go away.

I know this is probably not a real popular post and my negative karma (which I am quite proud of being such a low percentage) may take some hits.  However, Pete was my son's coach and mentor and he is my friend, so I for one am going to stick up for him!  Hang in there Pete!!!

No one is forgetting what Pete has done for our school.  We all recognize what he has done and thank him for it. But it is puzzling.

Newspaper quote says, "I didn't want them to get any momentum" in talking about them stopping us on 4 and goal, but then a couple paragraphs down it says, "Our D had really played well today...". To me, if the D is playing well, I like them in the loudest part of the stadium with their backs against the goal line. Way more stress and pressure with the chance for a safety or something. And when the young man was called to catch the pass, I don't blame him, but I do think Eric Nelson should have been called on for that catch. Got to have experience at that point of the game.

But, I will tell you, you are right, I haven't been there, and I totally respect the decisions that are made. I may not understand them, but I respect them. I'm proud of the team and my heart aches for them. I think it should be pointed out that the crowd is called upon to be there and is considered the 12th man, but then we we lose and question things, we are told to shut up and be quiet, that we have no say. As long as it is respectful, questions to leadership is a good thing.

Thanks for a great ride, Cru, I'll be back again for the ride next year.

[HSCTiger fan]

As a former coach, I am rather amused at all the barbs being thrown at Coach Fredenberg from people who have not lived and worked with the staff and team inside and out since August.  Who knows his players better than he?!!

It is always easier to say what should have been done after the decision has been made and it did not work out.  His defense had stopped UWW the series before rather emphatically.  I know Pete and I know he took input from his staff  and his gut feelings about the game into consideration before he made the call.  Also he had less than one minute during the timeout to arrive at his conclusion.  Until you have been in that position I think you can wonder why he made the decision he did but not to the point of castigating him for it.  After all, he was one third down completion from perhaps seeming like a genius. 

UMHB fans need to remember all he has done for the program since beginning it sixteen years ago and getting it to eleven post seasons, (ten of those in a row) and seven seasons with twelve wins or more.  Compare those figures to any other new program in D3.

The other fans for other schools and conferences who are raking him over the coals should consider what it would be like for us to go on their boards and speak derogatory about their coach and team or just plain go away.

I know this is probably not a real popular post and my negative karma (which I am quite proud of being such a low percentage) may take some hits.  However, Pete was my son's coach and mentor and he is my friend, so I for one am going to stick up for him!  Hang in there Pete!!!

I'm sure your coach is a great guy, mentor, friend and it's very obvious he's a very good football coach. His teams' records support that. But how does one's "gut" say we cannot get 3 yards BUT IF we get the ball back we'll get all the yards we will need to win?  Another poster said he read your coach was worried about a momentum shift if they did not score. He'd probably been better off without any time to think about it. Sounds like to me he over thought it.

I've seen plenty of people question and ridicule coaching decisions on other boards. I guess fortunately for UMHB your team seldom loses a game - so I doubt there's much more written on your coach or team other than accolades. Which they deserve.  But if they screw up and someone says something they are abandoning their team?  I don't think so.

By the way fans from other boards are always on other teams hoards this time of the year.

[emma17]

Great season UMHB and excellent game.  The D line was excellent even without your best player.

UWW caught a break with the dropped pass for sure.
As for the call, I will say I was thankful UMHB went for the field goal.  Of course, I don't know the team as well as Coach Pete does.

In his defense, I think there is at least a little more justification to his decision than has been presented.
IMO scoring a TD period, whether it is from 3.5 yards out or more is more difficult than gaining enough yardage to potentially kick a game-winning, wind-aided field goal.  There is more field to work with from a play design standpoint to move the ball into field goal position.  His D was playing very well and he had to assume UWW would stay conservative.  UWW would have to punt into the wind from somewhere around their 30, allowing UMHB to get the ball back around their own 40.  UMHB would have a 60 yard field to work with in order to move the ball roughly 30 yards to get into field goal position.

I understand that if UMHB had been stopped short from the 3.5 that UWW would have horrible field position and probably end up punting again into the wind.  But that still leaves UMHB with having to score a TD.   
In the final analysis, it's possible his decision came down to "what's more likely, 2 field goals in two trys or 1 TD in two trys". 
He chose the field goals. 
 

[Mr. Ypsi]

Great season UMHB and excellent game.  The D line was excellent even without your best player.

UWW caught a break with the dropped pass for sure.
As for the call, I will say I was thankful UMHB went for the field goal.  Of course, I don't know the team as well as Coach Pete does.

In his defense, I think there is at least a little more justification to his decision than has been presented.
IMO scoring a TD period, whether it is from 3.5 yards out or more is more difficult than gaining enough yardage to potentially kick a game-winning, wind-aided field goal.  There is more field to work with from a play design standpoint to move the ball into field goal position.  His D was playing very well and he had to assume UWW would stay conservative.  UWW would have to punt into the wind from somewhere around their 30, allowing UMHB to get the ball back around their own 40.  UMHB would have a 60 yard field to work with in order to move the ball roughly 30 yards to get into field goal position.

I understand that if UMHB had been stopped short from the 3.5 that UWW would have horrible field position and probably end up punting again into the wind.  But that still leaves UMHB with having to score a TD.   
In the final analysis, it's possible his decision came down to "what's more likely, 2 field goals in two trys or 1 TD in two trys". 
He chose the field goals. 

Or a third possibility, given the horrible field position UWW would have had if they don't get the TD: a safety and a FG.

Roocru, I haven't seen anyone attacking Coach Fredenberg in general (several of us, including me, have prefaced remarks with 'he's obviously an excellent coach'), but I doubt anyone could convince me that decision was not a huge mistake.  He was facing essentially a 2-point conversion; surely they have a play they are confident in.  And if it doesn't work, that defense he is so confident in has them in horrible field position.

Making it even worse is that he burned a timeout to reach that decision.  With THREE timeouts, UWW would need TWO first downs to run out the clock.  As it was, they effectively ran out the clock with just one first down.

I salute you for defending your friend and coach, but it wasn't necessary - no one is attacking him in general.  No one is perfect, everyone makes mistakes; IMO he made a doozy (but is obviously still a great coach).

[Mr. Ypsi]

Roocru,

No smites from me, but no applauds either.  Without second-guessing, and cross fertilization from other regions, this site would be among the most boring places on the internet!  Discussion of the good, the bad, and the ugly is why I LOVE d3boards.com.

[Bill McCabe]

We all have the benefit of deciding what should have been called with much more time than the coaching staff.  That being said, I thought the key play was going to the shotgun on 1st and goal at the 4.  Plus, we switched QBs.  We started that drive at the 20 and Miller, the fullback made 16 yards on 3 straight carries. Running out of the I.  Might have been a good idea to try that again or give it to Hudson up the middle. 

[Bill McCabe]

Whitewater had the ball for 34:31 in the game, probably because they converted 10-18 3rd downs.  In the 3rd quarter, Whitewater had the ball for 10:42.

[Bill McCabe]

Whitewater had 4 3rd down conversions in the 3rd quarter, but none in the 4th until the drive after our last field goal.  I can see why they might think we would get the ball back with a chance to kick the field goal.

[wildcat11]

Whitewater had the ball for 34:31 in the game, probably because they converted 10-18 3rd downs.  In the 3rd quarter, Whitewater had the ball for 10:42.

Along with many things this is what's impressive to me about UWW is that they can change their style of game in order to win.  Vs Linfield the Warhawks went uptempo to move the ball and get back in the game and last week they went ball control and moved the chains to help keep UMHB off the field.  Impressive.

[PurpleisBOLD98]

Great season Cru! It ended 1 week too soon... I had a lot of respect for Coach Fred and still do. Tough spot to be in for a coach for sure. We have to learn from this loss like we have done from losses in the past and take our play to another level. Can't wait for next season.

[crufootball]

We all have the benefit of deciding what should have been called with much more time than the coaching staff.  That being said, I thought the key play was going to the shotgun on 1st and goal at the 4.  Plus, we switched QBs.  We started that drive at the 20 and Miller, the fullback made 16 yards on 3 straight carries. Running out of the I.  Might have been a good idea to try that again or give it to Hudson up the middle. 

That was the big thing for me, I didn't like the QB change at that moment and even after the penalty I would vote for up to 4 running plays to get 9 yards. If we can't get those yards, you tip you cap to the UW-W defense and try to stop them.

No matter what, we had another great season and this years senior class goes out with an overall record of 50-4. What is keeping me upbeat is the hope that with the new stadium and another amazing year we can go out and get that one player that we have been lacking that can put us over the top.

[roocru]

I made my post earlier and it stands by itself.  I will add a couple of comments.  I never said we should not question the call, my son and I discussed it at length. I did feel that a couple of comments on this board by UMHB posters were getting perilously close to becoming attacks as were some drive-bys.  I posted my response here because I felt our board was the place for it, not as a response to some more derogatory posts on other boards.  Other boards, with very different manners and mores can say what they wish to there.

I know I am a little more sensitive to this having been in Pete's type of situation before.  I welcome discussion but I will always defend coaches decisions in wake of follow up attacks. That is it, I am moving on with comments on this situation

footballfan413,
My family is doing great, Thanks.  My son is the defensive coordinator in our town at the high school he played at and that I once worked for.  He has a beautiful wife and has blessed me and Mrs. Roocru with two wonderful grandchildren.  You are well aware I keep up with your son via the WIAC board and know that I am so happy that all our prayers for him are being answered.  Sorry I will not see you at the Stagg Bowl this year.  My daughter, who teaches English in Moscow, Russia, will be arriving for a three week visit on the day of the Stagg Bowl.

[emma17]

I made my post earlier and it stands by itself.  I will add a couple of comments.  I never said we should not question the call, my son and I discussed it at length. I did feel that a couple of comments on this board by UMHB posters were getting perilously close to becoming attacks as were some drive-bys.  I posted my response here because I felt our board was the place for it, not as a response to some more derogatory posts on other boards.  Other boards, with very different manners and mores can say what they wish to there.

I know I am a little more sensitive to this having been in Pete's type of situation before.  I welcome discussion but I will always defend coaches decisions in wake of follow up attacks. That is it, I am moving on with comments on this situation

footballfan413,
My family is doing great, Thanks.  My son is the defensive coordinator in our town at the high school he played at and that I once worked for.  He has a beautiful wife and has blessed me and Mrs. Roocru with two wonderful grandchildren.  You are well aware I keep up with your son via the WIAC board and know that I am so happy that all our prayers for him are being answered.  Sorry I will not see you at the Stagg Bowl this year.  My daughter, who teaches English in Moscow, Russia, will be arriving for a three week visit on the day of the Stagg Bowl.

Great post roocru.

I know you're done with the topic, I'll just add. 
If UMHB had won the game (in whatever way it took), it would be the WIAC board and UWW fans all talking about-and questioning the UWW coaching decision to be so conservative offensively. 
Good decisions when they work, questionable when they don't.  Life of a coach. 

I won't speak for Coach Leipold, but it wouldn't surprise me if he would have done the same thing Coach Fredenburg did. Take the easy points, play the field position game with the wind at his back, stop the O and win the game with a field goal.   I remember reading an article last week where Coach Fredenburg referred to the UMHB kicker as one of the best in the country (something very positive along those lines).  He made in-game decisions that reflected those very feelings.