FB: American Southwest Conference

[Ralph Turner]

Ralph,

the AA rule book says "Team A may not break its huddle with 12 or more players." [Rule 3 Section 5c]  It says nothing about Team B.

Rule 2.27.1 Team A is the team designated to put the ball in play.  Team B is the opponent.

[Toby Taff]

Ralph,

the AA rule book says "Team A may not break its huddle with 12 or more players." [Rule 3 Section 5c]  It says nothing about Team B.

Thanks, mhb8904.

In that case, does the handbook mean that Team A is the team with the ball, or having possesion of the ball, etc., or the "defense"?

thanks ralph, i couldn't find that last night.

[Ralph Turner]

Bill,

Agreed.  I however wish that whoever wins saturday will get pissed off enough that they crush everyone else in the region.

mhb8904, is the italicized word present in the Hebrew or the Aramaic texts there at Logsdon?   

No, but the KJV translates a Hebrew idiom that basically means "men" literally as the ones who pisseth on the wall.

The substitution clause is just below that one, and HSU was the wall that time!

[Bill McCabe]

The rule also says that a departing player must leave the huddle or his position within 3 seconds of being replaced.  The HSU player did not do that.  The rules do not allow the defense to have unlimited players on the field prior to the snap.  I think some criticism should be directed at HSU for not having the right personnel on the field.  Not to be overly critical, players and coaches get excited and make mental mistakes.  That was a mental mistake.

[Toby Taff]

I was about to post this...

Maybe this was the case:

After the ready-for-play signal, substitute B12 enters the huddle or
defensive formation and the departing player delays more than three
seconds before leaving the huddle or formation and departing the
field of play. RULING: Violation of the substitution rule. Dead-ball
foul. (Note: The referee is not required to warn a departing player to
leave the huddle immediately.)

2A interpretation

[Bill McCabe]

It is really a shame that the penalty was such a big play in the game.  2 officials immediately threw flags when the HSU player tried to run off of the field.  I believe HSU called time out to prevent the penalty, but it was too late.  They were not charged a time out as a result.

What was Coach Fred supposed to do?  Not question the ruling?  Obviously, he was right.

[Bill McCabe]

In all the excitement of the HSU-UMHB game, I almost overlooked the fact that my alma mater became bowl eligible for the first time in about 100 years.

[TX2OK]

That a way Cru.  Keep it goin one game at a time. 

[PA_wesleyfan]

 I think what you all might be missing here is that a huddle between the hashes even during a timeout is a huddle. The spirit of the huddle rules is to keep teams from deception. I.E. a player stepping on the field from the sidelines before a snap or a player running from the huddle to draw a defensive player with him. And recently they have included defense in that rule

[Bill McCabe]

It didn't seem like there was debate among the officials if it was a penalty.  I think the question was did HSU call time out before the penalty.

[Josh Bowerman]

12 men on the field can only be called in a live ball situation.  The ball was never snapped, ergo the distinction I made last night.

[Bill McCabe]

Josh, it's not 12 men on the field.  It was illegal substitution.  There is a difference.

[umhbalum]

I believe UMHB was called for the same thing earlier in the game.

[Josh Bowerman]

Yes, Bill, but based on the way I read the rule book, the "illegal substitution" infraction can only be called on the team "designated to put the ball in play".

I'm tired of arguing about it, though.  Good luck next week against W&J.

[Bill McCabe]

josh, that is not all of the rule.  Thanks for the good luck.  I hope the game goes like 2 years ago.