FB: American Southwest Conference

[Ralph Turner]

Cheddar, as someone who is a college administrator, I can tell you that the head coach has almost no say in who receives what scholarship--or even how much financial aid a student gets.  How much aid a student qualifies for is based on a standard, government-implemented formula that determines financial need.  With regard to scholarships being awarded, there are many factors at play, none of which is athletically based in any way, shape or form other than by pure coincidence--or by the student in question being so remarkably talented in the classroom that they qualify for true academic merit aid. 

To counter Ralph's statement, it's been my experience that coaches may get some latitude in admissions decisions, but even there they're not going to get a kid who's three notches below the average standard at the school admitted because he might be a good football player--not at the DIII level.  And admissions and financial aid are two completely different animals, so it's important not to muddy those waters by lumping them all together.

You're giving the head football coach (in this case) a lot more power than they really have.  At a DI school, you might be right.  But at the DIII level, their authority doesn't extend much past their own "kingdom"--and that applies even to Coach Keeling or Coach Fredenburg. 

+1 Josh, I am glad you jumped in here on this one!

I don't take your comment as a counter but rather an elaboration!  Thank you!

[Josh Bowerman]

You're still the man as far as I'm concerned, Ralph. 

We do need to touch base sometime soon to schedule some fall football road trips.

[cheddar8314]

I agree with everything that both of you are saying and I am sorry about jumping into the fire, but I just think that schools like SRSU have an uneven playing field due to the restriction given by the administration. In HSU and UMHB case coaches are allowed to give their input on who should receive scholarship, and SRSU administration will not allow the coaches to this. I guess you can say that the administration does not think outside of the box when it comes to what would be the best way to get the enrollment up.
Also Ralph, I know you know what you are talking about and sorry about the earlier comment.

[Ralph Turner]

I agree with everything that both of you are saying and I am sorry about jumping into the fire, but I just think that schools like SRSU have an uneven playing field due to the restriction given by the administration. In HSU and UMHB case coaches are allowed to give their input on who should receive scholarship, and SRSU administration will not allow the coaches to this. I guess you can say that the administration does not think outside of the box when it comes to what would be the best way to get the enrollment up.
Also Ralph, I know you know what you are talking about and sorry about the earlier comment.

Cheddar, No malice? No foul.

Josh has good working knowledge of a half-dozen NCAA schools.  I am inclined to believe Josh when he talks about the impact that coaches have (or don't have) on admissions procedures across D3 in general.  College presidents just will not jeopardize their jobs with an athletic issue.  In D1, they may need the athletics to generate the next $100 Million in endowment and funds from high profile fans/alums who want a national championship.  (cf. Alabama or Auburn) .  Please believe me, in D3, coaches and college presdients have a hard time getting 7-figure gifts for athletics from their patrons.

As we look at the "beauty contest" that is institutional prestige, the coveted exclusivity rate is "how many kids can you deny admission to make yourself look more 'exclusive' ".  By reputation as a state school, SRSU is not very "exclusive", as opposed to a "Trinity".   But, those two schools have different missions under the big "D3 Umbrella".

I don't see that SRSU has any excessively burdensome restrictions, and I would greatly appreciate any documentation to that fact.

In basketball in the Davalos era, SRSU was getting kids in there who apparently could "pass the basketball" and "pass the coursework".  I can see Coach Wright using his system to sell to potential recruits, without Mom and Dad going broke.  If the player can concentrate on education and athletics, then the kid will have a productive time at SRSU.

[fatboy]

"In HSU and UMHB case coaches are allowed to give their input on who should receive scholarship" not to start anything but to make this kind of accusation is pretty serious since it would be a NCAA violation!!

"I guess you can say that the administration does not think outside of the box when it comes to what would be the best way to get the enrollment up"   scholarships have little to do with getting enrollment up, my guess would be that location plays a big role as far as enrollment at SR, not big towns very close.  I would think it would be hard to convince a kid from Dallas Houston or SA to come all the way out to SR when so many other options put them closer to bigger cities.
A kid going to UMHB or HSU get the same amount of money as anyone else can get the only way the coaches can help is through their knowledge of what FA is out there.

HPU dad I don't believe that enrollment is a reflection on athletic achievement.  But again I think location is a major part of making the decision of what college to attend.  And I do think UMHB has the upper hand on this because it is within 2-3 hours of almost all major colleges in Texas.  This can factor in being that it will not put kids to far away from high school friends that are attending UT, A&M, TCU, SMU, Texas State, ect.

[Bill McCabe]

Pat,  It takes $17,000 to get to Alpine. 

[Ralph Turner]

42 hours of Tuition at SRSU $5676.00 for 2007-08.

42 hours academic credit = $6354 Tuition and Fees.

I haven't found any room and board more than about $6200 per year.  $12,500 per year is very inexpensive.

[Pat Coleman]

So I believe that the field is still lopsided, and you are ignorant to think other wise. (sic)

The 80% of Division III schools that are private schools would generally disagree with you.

[headlinesman]

Guys, this REALLY is a no brainer.  Between my two daughters and I, we have two bachelor degrees from HSU and one from HPU.  I have two graduate degrees from private institutions, and am working on a Ph.D. from a state school.  I can tell you direct experience:  there is no comparison of cost between private and state schools.  State schools are still not cheap, but they pale in comparison to what private schools have to charge to stay in business.

Besides, I've been to Alpiine.  It is a beautiful place with lots of recreational amenities very close by - just not very many other PEOPLE very close by.  SRU should get all the kids that can't play on UTEP, UNM and New Mexico State's level.

[Ralph Turner]

Former HSU QB Jordan Neal's Post Card from Sweden

A little off-season reading from the Abilene Reporter-News. 

[Ralph Turner]

Congratulations to former McMurry star DB, Larry Hoefer on being named Defensive Coordinator at Baylor.

[CNU85]

wow....glad to see the private vs public debate isn't limited to the USA South board. same things have been said on that board for years.

[minni]

cheddar,

There is an even playing field.  The fact remains if you want to get better keep your coachs and recruit your players.  El paso I would think could be a wonderful recruiting area for sul ross.  I mean they basically have that turf to themselves. 

Here is how I can compare this in my mind.  Weather you are the largest 3-A school in Texas or the smallest 3-A school in Texas, guess what you are still 3-A.  So weather you think Sully has the same admission requirements, money requirements, or whatever the administration does, the are still a DIII school and they are competing in the ASC.  Now if they think HSU and UMHB are doing the things they are doing and there is nothing wrong with it, then why dont they follow the LEADERS.  I cant speak for UMHB, but I do know that probably 80% of the football players at HSU when I played were paying for school themselves or mom and dad were paying.  You know people can complain all they want to but it just sounds like to me another excuse for being in the lower tier in the ASC.  You can complain location or it cost to much or enrollment numbers all you want to but if you truely want a good football team it starts at the top with the head coach and goes down to the lowest one on the depth chart. 

Just my .02 cents and i hope it made sense.

[Sender]

When does fall practices start around the conference?

[SR97]

When does fall practices start around the conference?

We report this Sunday, Aug. 12, at SRSU.