Pool B

[ADL70]

Sorry Keith I missed the point.  Travel wasn't so much the problem for Rochester.  They were joint members of UAA and Upstate (now Liberty) in football and one or two others (as CWRU used to be with NCAC).  When that league expanded, it had to choose.  I think it was the scheduling issue which lead them to choose LL. 

If there is a travel issue, it would be for WUStL and Chicago who would have two more long trips under the NCAC lend-lease program.  I have no insight into the economics of the travel either.  As Keith suggests, maybe it doesn't make much difference.

I don't see any evidence that playoff chances have entered into the process for UAA football.

Thanx Gents for the discourse.  So much more civilized and intelligent than on that other board.   

And here's to CMU continuing to win!!

[Ralph Turner]

Outside of the ASC, Carnegie Mellon is my Cinderella this year.

[ADL70]

And inside ASC, Sul Ross?  Thought you were a McMurry guy.

[Ralph Turner]

And inside ASC, Sul Ross?  Thought you were a McMurry guy.

McMurry travels to Sully this weekend for Sully's homecoming.  McMurry head coach Joe Crousen is a Sul Ross grad.  I know that he would love to spoil Homecoming.

If we do spoil Homecoming, then Cinderella will have lost her shoe.

A bigger if... if we win the Abilene City Championship game against HSU on November 11th, then Cinderella will have lost her Cowboy boot.

Cinderella inside the ASC is the first South Region Stagg Bowl Championship since West Georgia in 1982.

[Bob.Gregg]

Updated after 10/21 games:

Here's what's left:  (In-Region Games in Bold)

1)  Wesley (7-0/4-0) 
@ Salisbury (3-4)
Chowan (0-7)
Morrisville State (1-6)

2)  Whitworth (7-0/6-0)  
Willamette (1-5)
@ Linfield (4-2)
Puget Sound (5-2)

3)  Washington & Jefferson (6-1/5-1)
Waynesburg (4-3)
Thomas More (5-2)
@ Bethany (3-4)

4)  Linfield (4-2, 3-1) 
Menlo (3-4)
Whitworth (7-0)
@ Lewis & Clark (0-6)

5)  Carnegie-Mellon (7-0/6-0)
@ Washington (MO) (5-3)
Bethany (3-4)
@ Thiel (4-4)

6)  Rockford (7-1/6-0)
Minnesota Morris (6-2)
@ Colorado College (3-3)
off

ADDING after this week (for discussion at least):

Thomas More (5-2/5-2)
Bethany (3-4)
@Washington & Jefferson (6-1)
Mt. St. Joseph (7-0)

Huntingdon (4-4) lost to Thomas More.  No longer under consideration.
Thiel (4-4) lost to Waynesburg.  No longer under consideration.

[Bill McCabe]

Bob.Gregg,  What would a Linfield loss to Whitworth do to their chances?

[K-Mack]

Bob.Gregg,  What would a Linfield loss to Whitworth do to their chances?

End them?

I'm not Bob.Gregg, but if Linfield is pushed into Pool B-plus four group and gets judged against Pool C teams, I don't like their chances with losses to Whitworth AND Hardin-Simmons and only five in-region wins. Right now there are well over a dozen one-loss teams for seven Pool B/C spots, so unless Linfield is one of the top four in Pool B (i.e. someone else would have to lose too), I don't think they can sustain a loss to Whitworth and make the playoffs.

[Foss]

K-Mack, thanks for your input. I have been wanting to ask that question but been afraid of what the answer would be. Part of me was blindly hoping that even with a 3rd loss, they might still be considered, especially with their reputation the last few years. I was also hanging my hat on the good fortune of a fellow conference team, Willamette, who in '04 got in with a very similar set of circumstances. The Bearcats also lost to a top ten ASC team (UMHB), a scholarship school (NAIA Eastern Oregon), and the NWC champ (Linfield). Yet, they squeaked in, and this when there were only 28 teams and without the (possible) influence of having just won a national championship two years earlier. However, as you point out there are plenty of one-loss teams this season, and I'm guessing Willamette might have caught a break in '04 in that there weren't as many teams with a lone blemish on their record. Also, Willamette played their ASC opponent much closer (losing in 2 OTs rather than by 2 TDs), and their having 10 games vs. Linfield's 9 probably helped, too.

So, I would have to agree with you that they need to win out, or else have very little to no chance of getting in.

A question for you. Not that this would necessarily increase their chances, but in reading your post Pool B teams are still technically eligible for Pool C spots, right? Out of curiosity, do you recall if a Pool B team(s) has ever been awarded a Pool C bid?

[Bob.Gregg]

Bob.Gregg,  What would a Linfield loss to Whitworth do to their chances?

Bill,  sorry for the delay in getting this back.  Updated my Pool B "What's Left" and then left myself for a few days (gotta do that this time of year).

In this year's Pool B picture, another Linfield loss, even to Whitworth, puts them "on the bubble" at best.  "B" is their only real chance, and unless "B" pulls a 2003-type collapse again, I don't see it happening.

[Bob.Gregg]

...Out of curiosity, do you recall if a Pool B team(s) has ever been awarded a Pool C bid?

Not yet, Foss, but as I always ask this time of year:

Is THIS the year a "B" gets a "C"

[Ralph Turner]

K-Mack, thanks for your input. I have been wanting to ask that question but been afraid of what the answer would be. Part of me was blindly hoping that even with a 3rd loss, they might still be considered, especially with their reputation the last few years. I was also hanging my hat on the good fortune of a fellow conference team, Willamette, who in '04 got in with a very similar set of circumstances. The Bearcats also lost to a top ten ASC team (UMHB), a scholarship school (NAIA Eastern Oregon), and the NWC champ (Linfield). Yet, they squeaked in, and this when there were only 28 teams and without the (possible) influence of having just won a national championship two years earlier. However, as you point out there are plenty of one-loss teams this season, and I'm guessing Willamette might have caught a break in '04 in that there weren't as many teams with a lone blemish on their record. Also, Willamette played their ASC opponent much closer (losing in 2 OTs rather than by 2 TDs), and their having 10 games vs. Linfield's 9 probably helped, too.

So, I would have to agree with you that they need to win out, or else have very little to no chance of getting in.

A question for you. Not that this would necessarily increase their chances, but in reading your post Pool B teams are still technically eligible for Pool C spots, right? Out of curiosity, do you recall if a Pool B team(s) has ever been awarded a Pool C bid?

Foss, one big thing is different this year from the Willamette team.

The 2004 UMHB loss did not count as an in-region game that year.
Thus the in-region won-loss percentage will be lower.

For newcomers to the site, non-D3 opponents do not impact primary criteria for selection by the committee.

Primary Selection Criteria

Please remember that Pat has annotated each team's schedule with "in-region" games.  And, margin of victory is not a criterion.

If Linfield runs the table, they get in.  As I see it now, one more loss puts them on the bubble, and IMHO, they will stay home.

[Ralph Turner]

...Out of curiosity, do you recall if a Pool B team(s) has ever been awarded a Pool C bid?

Not yet, Foss, but as I always ask this time of year:

Is THIS the year a "B" gets a "C"

Bob, if Linfield beats Whitworth and everyone else wins out, the I think that this is the year.

[Bill McCabe]

What if Whitworth beats Linfield?

[ADL70]

  And, margin of victory is not a criterion.

But I would like to see OT Ws and Ls treated differently as they are in the NHL and, I think, MLS. [Can't get my comment out of the "quote" box]

[Bob.Gregg]

What if Whitworth beats Linfield?

Good question, Bill.

If Whitworth beats Linfield, I think Linfield is out.

Wesley, Whitworth, W&J, & CMU get the "B"s.

Rockford? With THAT schedule?  and a loss on it...?


No "C" for a "B" this year if Whitworth beats Linfield.