FB: Ohio Athletic Conference

[Small but Slow]

A 60 minute game usually comes down to several key plays that ultimately determine the outcome of the game.  This time UWW made more of those big plays than Mount.  Beaver's long run at the end of the first half was a huge play, as was the fumble recovered in the end zone, his long run on their last TD drive.  Both teams played on a level field, both teams used the same wet slippery balls.  Fortunately for UWW more of the breaks went in their favor.  That being said, I am a believer that people and teams make their own breaks and little that truly matters is a result of luck.

[formerraider]

There are so many problems with what you said, I don't even know where to begin.  Stating that lk has always been quiet and classy would suggest that you knew him when he was young, but then again you are the same as age as vince, so you couldn't have known him then. 

OK, in the true literal sense, that would be the case...if you want to argue semantics.  I guess to word it properly, I should say that every time I had the opportunity to talk to LK, he has been quiet and classy.  No wait, that's not right either, because that doesn't account for the time that I wasn't speaking to him, so that COULDN'T be ALWAYS, now could it.  I guess I would have to reword it to say that "Despite growing up in the Alliance area, with a mother who has been involved with MUC since she graduated in LK's class in 1971 and a father who was a local football coach, it would SEEM that LK is quiet and classy, though I may be wrong, since I can't definitively say how he is ALL THE TIME."  Perhaps I should have been more clear, but I didn't think I needed to spell it out in crayon for you.  Sheesh, I didn't think anyone would get so upset about a compliment of LK.

You say you didn't like him, when you "interacted" with him at a high school dance?  My guess is that he probably didn't like you either.  big deal! 

If we want to get very particular, I didn't say "A" HS Dance, I said "a couple," but that is neither here nor there.  The point is that rather than just saying I didn't or don't like VK and having my credibility attacked for "not knowing him," I thought I would give some background as to why I didn't/don't like Vince.  I don't know/ care if Vince ever liked me or if he likes or dislikes me right now.  I'm sure he doesn't lose sleep over it.  I know I don't.  He has been successful in what he wants to do and I have been successful in my chosen path as well.  I have a great wife and an 18 month old son.  His wife, Lindsey, is a great girl (I know her from HS/ college as well).  I am pretty sure Vince cares what I think about him as much as I care about what he thinks about me...ZERO.  So, you are right, big deal!

And his mouth on the field?  If that was the case why didn't you call out BJ Payne and Mark Black too?  Now those guys had a mouth!

OK, If you want me too.  Both were smack talking jerks on the field, but they were two of the best I ever played against.  Vince wasn't even in the top 10.  Besides, this isn't about them, so why bring them up?

My guess is that you are probably jealous of vk, he stole your girlfriend in high school and beat you every time he played you in college.  You'll just have to get over it!

I'm not jealous of VK.  I'm jealous that he is still involved in the game I love so much and I am not so much anymore, but not of any of the other stuff.  Sure, MUC whipped our azzes every time we played them.  I fully expected that, though.  I mean, I always played to win, and believed we could, but I was also a realist, and reality was that we weren't very good at Cap and MUC was.  You don't have to go to an NCAC school to add that up.  And by the way, neither girl from Alliance that I dated liked Vince much either, so I sincerely doubt that he stole my girlfriend.  If he did, oh well.  I didn't marry either one, so it's not like I am getting "seconds."

All this said, I understand the emotions.  Did Vince have a legit beef with the non-call?  Maybe.  Did he need to throw a hissy fit?  NO.  Did his 15 yarder impact the outcome of the game?  NO, but that doesn't excuse it.

To prove to you that I am over it, I have changed my mind.  I do hope Vince becomes the HC at MUC one day.  I know you can't be a successful DC without doing the work, and everyone is entitled to their own successes.  Doesn't mean I have to like the guy.

I said in my original post that I didn't care what the backlash was for my comments.  I still don't.  I thought Vince was an arrogant, always wanted to get his way, and didn't know how to react if he didn't.  I know it was one on-field blowup in a big game, but it seems from that, to still be the same.

You are right, you don't have to like him.  What you said has nothing to do with football.  It has nothing to do with the game. It was a personal attack from 10-15 years ago.  For someone you don't really care for, he sure seems to have had a big impact on your life!

[Toph]

There are so many problems with what you said, I don't even know where to begin.  Stating that lk has always been quiet and classy would suggest that you knew him when he was young, but then again you are the same as age as vince, so you couldn't have known him then. 

OK, in the true literal sense, that would be the case...if you want to argue semantics.  I guess to word it properly, I should say that every time I had the opportunity to talk to LK, he has been quiet and classy.  No wait, that's not right either, because that doesn't account for the time that I wasn't speaking to him, so that COULDN'T be ALWAYS, now could it.  I guess I would have to reword it to say that "Despite growing up in the Alliance area, with a mother who has been involved with MUC since she graduated in LK's class in 1971 and a father who was a local football coach, it would SEEM that LK is quiet and classy, though I may be wrong, since I can't definitively say how he is ALL THE TIME."  Perhaps I should have been more clear, but I didn't think I needed to spell it out in crayon for you.  Sheesh, I didn't think anyone would get so upset about a compliment of LK.

You say you didn't like him, when you "interacted" with him at a high school dance?  My guess is that he probably didn't like you either.  big deal! 

If we want to get very particular, I didn't say "A" HS Dance, I said "a couple," but that is neither here nor there.  The point is that rather than just saying I didn't or don't like VK and having my credibility attacked for "not knowing him," I thought I would give some background as to why I didn't/don't like Vince.  I don't know/ care if Vince ever liked me or if he likes or dislikes me right now.  I'm sure he doesn't lose sleep over it.  I know I don't.  He has been successful in what he wants to do and I have been successful in my chosen path as well.  I have a great wife and an 18 month old son.  His wife, Lindsey, is a great girl (I know her from HS/ college as well).  I am pretty sure Vince cares what I think about him as much as I care about what he thinks about me...ZERO.  So, you are right, big deal!

And his mouth on the field?  If that was the case why didn't you call out BJ Payne and Mark Black too?  Now those guys had a mouth!

OK, If you want me too.  Both were smack talking jerks on the field, but they were two of the best I ever played against.  Vince wasn't even in the top 10.  Besides, this isn't about them, so why bring them up?

My guess is that you are probably jealous of vk, he stole your girlfriend in high school and beat you every time he played you in college.  You'll just have to get over it!

I'm not jealous of VK.  I'm jealous that he is still involved in the game I love so much and I am not so much anymore, but not of any of the other stuff.  Sure, MUC whipped our azzes every time we played them.  I fully expected that, though.  I mean, I always played to win, and believed we could, but I was also a realist, and reality was that we weren't very good at Cap and MUC was.  You don't have to go to an NCAC school to add that up.  And by the way, neither girl from Alliance that I dated liked Vince much either, so I sincerely doubt that he stole my girlfriend.  If he did, oh well.  I didn't marry either one, so it's not like I am getting "seconds."

All this said, I understand the emotions.  Did Vince have a legit beef with the non-call?  Maybe.  Did he need to throw a hissy fit?  NO.  Did his 15 yarder impact the outcome of the game?  NO, but that doesn't excuse it.

To prove to you that I am over it, I have changed my mind.  I do hope Vince becomes the HC at MUC one day.  I know you can't be a successful DC without doing the work, and everyone is entitled to their own successes.  Doesn't mean I have to like the guy.

I said in my original post that I didn't care what the backlash was for my comments.  I still don't.  I thought Vince was an arrogant, always wanted to get his way, and didn't know how to react if he didn't.  I know it was one on-field blowup in a big game, but it seems from that, to still be the same.

You are right, you don't have to like him.  What you said has nothing to do with football.  It has nothing to do with the game. It was a personal attack from 10-15 years ago.  For someone you don't really care for, he sure seems to have had a big impact on your life!

Can we drop this already?  When did this become the Vince Kehres Post Patterns?


Next week on "As Vince Turns..." Vince goes to a restaurant, but leaves less than a 15% tip...is Vince a bad human being?  Will the waitress be able to recover?  Does the fate of Mount Union football hang in the balance?  Tune in next week!

[Knightstalker]

There are so many problems with what you said, I don't even know where to begin.  Stating that lk has always been quiet and classy would suggest that you knew him when he was young, but then again you are the same as age as vince, so you couldn't have known him then. 

OK, in the true literal sense, that would be the case...if you want to argue semantics.  I guess to word it properly, I should say that every time I had the opportunity to talk to LK, he has been quiet and classy.  No wait, that's not right either, because that doesn't account for the time that I wasn't speaking to him, so that COULDN'T be ALWAYS, now could it.  I guess I would have to reword it to say that "Despite growing up in the Alliance area, with a mother who has been involved with MUC since she graduated in LK's class in 1971 and a father who was a local football coach, it would SEEM that LK is quiet and classy, though I may be wrong, since I can't definitively say how he is ALL THE TIME."  Perhaps I should have been more clear, but I didn't think I needed to spell it out in crayon for you.  Sheesh, I didn't think anyone would get so upset about a compliment of LK.

You say you didn't like him, when you "interacted" with him at a high school dance?  My guess is that he probably didn't like you either.  big deal! 

If we want to get very particular, I didn't say "A" HS Dance, I said "a couple," but that is neither here nor there.  The point is that rather than just saying I didn't or don't like VK and having my credibility attacked for "not knowing him," I thought I would give some background as to why I didn't/don't like Vince.  I don't know/ care if Vince ever liked me or if he likes or dislikes me right now.  I'm sure he doesn't lose sleep over it.  I know I don't.  He has been successful in what he wants to do and I have been successful in my chosen path as well.  I have a great wife and an 18 month old son.  His wife, Lindsey, is a great girl (I know her from HS/ college as well).  I am pretty sure Vince cares what I think about him as much as I care about what he thinks about me...ZERO.  So, you are right, big deal!

And his mouth on the field?  If that was the case why didn't you call out BJ Payne and Mark Black too?  Now those guys had a mouth!

OK, If you want me too.  Both were smack talking jerks on the field, but they were two of the best I ever played against.  Vince wasn't even in the top 10.  Besides, this isn't about them, so why bring them up?

My guess is that you are probably jealous of vk, he stole your girlfriend in high school and beat you every time he played you in college.  You'll just have to get over it!

I'm not jealous of VK.  I'm jealous that he is still involved in the game I love so much and I am not so much anymore, but not of any of the other stuff.  Sure, MUC whipped our azzes every time we played them.  I fully expected that, though.  I mean, I always played to win, and believed we could, but I was also a realist, and reality was that we weren't very good at Cap and MUC was.  You don't have to go to an NCAC school to add that up.  And by the way, neither girl from Alliance that I dated liked Vince much either, so I sincerely doubt that he stole my girlfriend.  If he did, oh well.  I didn't marry either one, so it's not like I am getting "seconds."

All this said, I understand the emotions.  Did Vince have a legit beef with the non-call?  Maybe.  Did he need to throw a hissy fit?  NO.  Did his 15 yarder impact the outcome of the game?  NO, but that doesn't excuse it.

To prove to you that I am over it, I have changed my mind.  I do hope Vince becomes the HC at MUC one day.  I know you can't be a successful DC without doing the work, and everyone is entitled to their own successes.  Doesn't mean I have to like the guy.

I said in my original post that I didn't care what the backlash was for my comments.  I still don't.  I thought Vince was an arrogant, always wanted to get his way, and didn't know how to react if he didn't.  I know it was one on-field blowup in a big game, but it seems from that, to still be the same.

You are right, you don't have to like him.  What you said has nothing to do with football.  It has nothing to do with the game. It was a personal attack from 10-15 years ago.  For someone you don't really care for, he sure seems to have had a big impact on your life!

Can we drop this already?  When did this become the Vince Kehres Post Patterns?


Next week on "As Vince Turns..." Vince goes to a restaurant, but leaves less than a 15% tip...is Vince a bad human being?  Will the waitress be able to recover?  Does the fate of Mount Union football hang in the balance?  Tune in next week!

That cheap Bastage 

[PimpInTheChat]

JK-

I'm glad to see your jealousy is not limited to VK and you actually have enough to spread around to other local players.

I'd love to say that I didn't like you in Highschool or College and that I'm not surprised that you run your mouth in here, because that is the kind of guy you are.

I just can't do that, because I didn't and don't know you.

I don't like you for your posts, that's all I know about you.

.....I guess I'm supposed to say...OUT?

[Small but Slow]

Good to see the forum moving away from mudslinging and character assassination.  We have a presidential election to fill that void.  A coach can implode any of the other 14 games and nobody would have said a word, but on national tv it comes under public scrutiny.

[seventiesraider]

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

[Redtooth]

I just watched yesterday's episode of "As Vince Turns" on my DVR...the one with the questionable tipping.  I slowed down that scene and you can see a "beaver"  illegally pushing Vince in the back as he attempts to place correct change on the table for the tip......the quarter in question fell onto the floor and was recovered by a rather large bus boy that used to play oline for some school called Dub Dub....

[JK]

OK, let me attempt to put this to bed, because I do think it's silly.  That being said, I did expect reprisals, albeit not the personal attacks and "I bet he stole your girlfriend" stuff, which I felt I had to defend myself against.

Pimp, formerraider: sorry for the personal attacks back, they were uncalled for.

Anyway, I never said I HATED VK, just that I didn't like him then based on personal interaction then and current opinions formed from afar, the most recent of which was his penalty in the Stagg.  I guess I could have said that "based on my personal previous history with VK, I wasn't surprised by his reaction" and left it at that, which was really my point.

The cause of my dislike is probably silly and it IS 15 years old.  Some people have attitudes/ ideas that don't mesh with mine.  I'm sure we all have people we met that we don't like.  For me, Vince is one of those guys.  It doesn't mean I think he is a bad person.  It's not like he beats up grandmas or kills puppies or anything like that.  I know I have matured over time, as I am sure Vince has.  I certainly don't know him as well as some of you guys, his former teammates, do.  His body of work as DC at MUC speaks for itself.  I never intended to make it seem like I don't respect what he has done there in that capacity.  I have said repeatedly that I wish him nothing but success.  That remains true.

Truce?  Like the Ex- Olinemen we are (and Pimp and especially formerraider were certainly great olinemen), can we forget about it like the last play?

[Frank Rossi]

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

Hate to break up this "Quotathon" but this board is getting harder to read than the LL board, (and less interesting).

Who ever thought I'd try to be the voice of reason?

What on Earth, do you mean, seventies?  That's rediculusly simple to read.  Stop getting exited -- it's still two days til Saterday.

[JK]

I mentioned in one of my previous posts that BJ Payne and Mark Black were two of the 10 best players I lined up against, which got me to thinking... Who are the 10 best I played against?  This is a decent discussion to begin the offseason, so encourage others to come up with your 10 best you played against.

Mine are:

1) London Fletcher (LB- JCU)
2) Jason Hall (LB- MUC)
3) BJ Payne (DL- MUC)
4) Scott Greenawalt (LB- MUSK)
5) Mark Black (LB- MUC)
6) Chris Anderson (LB- JCU)
7) Mark Evans (DL- ONU)
8 ) Mike Guy (LB- MAR)
9) Rafiq Vaughn (LB- HIRAM)
10) Jim Shambre (LB- HEID)

I qualify this by saying that I was a two year starter (95-96) as an o-lineman.  As such I limited my choices to guys I had to block (or try to) so that eliminated all DBs and anyone from 93 or 94 (like Mike Hallett, who I think was the best DL during my time in college), when I primarily played special teams.

(edit)
Man, looking through the all OAC lists from those years brings to mind some more really great players... Pete Matthews from MUSKY was a beast of an LB. Same for Jason Ochs from BW.  MUC's got crazy good guys not on my original list like Jim Eismon, Brian Wervey, Jeff Starkey, and Matt Liggett.  Marietta had two I remember distincly: Brian Martindale and Jason Olivea.  Scott O'Donnel lfrom JCU used to give me as many fits as trying to block Fletcher.  Wow... memories.  I might have to rethink my original 10.

[JK]

Pimp-

check your personal messages.  I promise it has nothing to do with VK.

Thanks

[rocketraider]

Long-time reader, first time responder so I hope I do this right. My son just finished his career at Mount Union on sort of a downer--BIG understatement! Anyway, I just wanted to write what a great experience it was for him to play for LK, to be recruited by VK and to be a part of some outstanding teams. I was always a DI guy and knew very little about the great football and fans in DIII before his time. Our Mount boys got beat by a better Whitewater team on Saturday. Forget about any missed calls etc. But the one thing that will always stick with me is this: The kids at Mount Union are the absolute most competitive kids I've ever, in my life been around. They compete hard against each other on the football field, intramural basketball court, weightlifting, beer pong (of course, not MY boy) and to be the best young men they can be. Their parents are great too. Years from now the things that they learned while playing will make them great parents, employees and friends. It might be hard for them to understand this now but in time they will. Congratulations Warhawks and always, GO MOUNT.

[HScoach]

Long-time reader, first time responder so I hope I do this right. My son just finished his career at Mount Union on sort of a downer--BIG understatement! Anyway, I just wanted to write what a great experience it was for him to play for LK, to be recruited by VK and to be a part of some outstanding teams. I was always a DI guy and knew very little about the great football and fans in DIII before his time. Our Mount boys got beat by a better Whitewater team on Saturday. Forget about any missed calls etc. But the one thing that will always stick with me is this: The kids at Mount Union are the absolute most competitive kids I've ever, in my life been around. They compete hard against each other on the football field, intramural basketball court, weightlifting, beer pong (of course, not MY boy) and to be the best young men they can be. Their parents are great too. Years from now the things that they learned while playing will make them great parents, employees and friends. It might be hard for them to understand this now but in time they will. Congratulations Warhawks and always, GO MOUNT.

Well said and welcome to the board.

Send a "Congrats" to your son.  He was a good one and will definitely be missed!

[Frank Rossi]

Long-time reader, first time responder so I hope I do this right. My son just finished his career at Mount Union on sort of a downer--BIG understatement! Anyway, I just wanted to write what a great experience it was for him to play for LK, to be recruited by VK and to be a part of some outstanding teams. I was always a DI guy and knew very little about the great football and fans in DIII before his time. Our Mount boys got beat by a better Whitewater team on Saturday. Forget about any missed calls etc. But the one thing that will always stick with me is this: The kids at Mount Union are the absolute most competitive kids I've ever, in my life been around. They compete hard against each other on the football field, intramural basketball court, weightlifting, beer pong (of course, not MY boy) and to be the best young men they can be. Their parents are great too. Years from now the things that they learned while playing will make them great parents, employees and friends. It might be hard for them to understand this now but in time they will. Congratulations Warhawks and always, GO MOUNT.

What you've said here really encapsulizes virtually all D3 teams and players -- something that a lot of folks in the D1 ranks don't always understand.  That's what motivates a lot of people like the D3football.com folks and everyone around each individual program to go the extra mile whenever we can to promote the student-athletes since 99% of them in this case will not see meaningful action at any next level.  Be proud, as you are, of your son and his colleagues across the nation.