FB: Ohio Athletic Conference

[raiderpa]

The college rule for downing a football only recognizes the position of the ball.  The fact that the player is in the end zone has no bearing.  In the pros it is different, they player must be in the field of play to down the ball near the end zone.

[raiderpa]

I am looking at your projected brackets and wonder why you put WWW and MHB in the same semifinal?  I thought that due to the season-long rankings that Mount and MHB would be on the same side. 
Could you explain for an interested fan?
thanks

[Desertraider]

Congrats to Mount Union on the win, and finishing on their final drive.  The call to fake the read option and throw down the sideline was a great one. 

I'd be lying if I said I wasn't terribly disappointed by this loss, and the manner in which the game finished.  The rule is the rule, but this game is a great example of why it shouldn't exist.  As someone said earlier, what does that rule add?  It's not like a 10 second runoff to prevent a team from just committing a penalty to stop the clock.  It doesn't add any safety measures for the players.  It's simply a rule to cover the officials' collective a** and not put them in a position to have to make a difficult call.  What a disappointing end to what could have been a classic game.  It's terrible to see a game like that decided on what a quick Google search calls "one of the top five worst rules in college football."

I thought both defenses played pretty well.  Mount's for the first half in particular, and JCU's in the second half in particular.  Watching the ugly first quarter, I was hoping Myers and the offense would find their rhythm, and boy did they eventually.

One final note on the officiating and the final call.  Tim Gleason, if you read this board, you should be ashamed if that was the best crew you could put out there.  Both teams, and in particular JCU, got away with holding all day long (I think there was one holding call the during the entire game), they took away a clear fumble and recovery from John Carroll (tell your officials that if an offensive player is laying on top of another player without touching the ground with a knee, back, elbow, etc, and loses the football, without a whistle, he's not down), I still can't figure out how John Carroll's first drive started at the one when the player who downed the punt was physically laying with half his body over the goal line, I have no idea what the "facemask" was that continued the final drive (though I won't complain too much about it).

And after willfully ignoring all these rules all game long, they decide to go by the letter of the law to end the game.  Great crew.  Keep up the terrible work.

Congrats again to Mount on the big win.  They finished, JCU didn't.  I just hope Carroll can get past this and prepare for the playoffs.

Great Post Toph!  I was watching the Video Stream and it appeared JCU was holding a lot.  Also thought Meech was in the end zone when he downed Burke's punt and that MTU fumbled in the play you referenced.  Alas, I missed the last 2 minutes or so of the game when the Video Stream failed and I had to listen to JCU's last drive by calling the MTU Radio station and listening to the MTU student broadcasters yelling in my ear.

On the punt - I watched the replay last night and they showed one that was downed at the 1 yard line (I am assuming it is the same one). From the 2 or 3 angles they showed the Mount player (I thought it was Namdar) was on his stomach and touched ball to stop it at the 1. His head was over the goal line, but he was not touching the endzone (his left hand was literally 6 inches from the line). Then he seemed to take his hand off the ball and "point" to the ball - at that time his elbow went down in the endzone but he wasn't touching the ball. Then the other Mount player touched it. However I think the ball had already been ruled dead by the officials at that point. I got to see it from a few angles and in slow motion - and it was close but it was the right call. I did see alot of holding from both sides. The one that stands out was Lally getting pulled down by 2 JCU players - no call. Mount got away with some too though so I view that as an "even" - its not like only one team benefitted from it.

On the UMU student broadcasters via the phone - I thought it was hilarious. You could tell they have virtually no experience with a close game. They were talking in the 2nd quarter about the game being over at 21-0. So the excitement at the end was great. Yes they are broadcasters in training - but they are students as well. They were yelling and so excited - when the call was made that game was over I thought the guys were going to explode! Great call guys.

[HScoach]

OAC officiating has been horrid all season.  Makes me look forward to seeing the NCAC refs......

Regardless of the rule or not, what a shame the game ended the way it did.  Would have loved to have seen 1 more play.  Win or lose.

Hopefully JCU enters the playoffs pissed and focused and he'll bent on earning a return trip to Mount.  The OAC reputation could sure use the 2nd place team going on a deep playoff run ala 02, 05 and 06.

[skunks_sidekick]

WOW!  What a game!  I have finally recovered enough to post.

This won't be very popular on this board, but Mount's offensive & defensive lines don't look much (if any) better than they did last year.  This was their first big test, and in my opinion they failed.  Yes, they won the game, but in my opinion they didn't show enough to make me think they are ready for the cheese-eating scourge from Wisconsin.  Burke was running for his life all day, and the line repeatedly whiffed on JCU defenders.

HOPEFULLY, they can continue to improve if they move through the play-offs.  Skunk & I had a great time at the game, and as per usual there were "fired up" students from both schools yipping and yapping, and all of that should be taken for what it was:  a bunch of college kids with too much vim and vigor fueled by who knows what beverage.   

Here's hoping both teams make a deep run, and possibly meeting somewhere down the line in the play-offs.

[PurpleSuit]

I am looking at your projected brackets and wonder why you put WWW and MHB in the same semifinal?  I thought that due to the season-long rankings that Mount and MHB would be on the same side. 
Could you explain for an interested fan?
thanks

Travel.  Of the top four seeds, Wesley could bus to Mount but would fly to UWW.  It's possible that Wesley would be "seeded" higher than UMHB.

[Toph]

The college rule for downing a football only recognizes the position of the ball.  The fact that the player is in the end zone has no bearing.  In the pros it is different, they player must be in the field of play to down the ball near the end zone.

You are correct.  I confused the two rules, my mistake.  I am willing to admit that they might have gotten that one right.  My point still stands, however.  If that was the best the OAC has to offer, they need to seriously reconsider what officials they allow to call their games.

[HScoach]

WOW!  What a game!  I have finally recovered enough to post.

This won't be very popular on this board, but Mount's offensive & defensive lines don't look much (if any) better than they did last year.  This was their first big test, and in my opinion they failed.  Yes, they won the game, but in my opinion they didn't show enough to make me think they are ready for the cheese-eating scourge from Wisconsin.  Burke was running for his life all day, and the line repeatedly whiffed on JCU defenders.

HOPEFULLY, they can continue to improve if they move through the play-offs.  Skunk & I had a great time at the game, and as per usual there were "fired up" students from both schools yipping and yapping, and all of that should be taken for what it was:  a bunch of college kids with too much vim and vigor fueled by who knows what beverage.   

Here's hoping both teams make a deep run, and possibly meeting somewhere down the line in the play-offs.

You're being kind.   

The O-line got DOMINATED by a very "solid" JCU defense that has never been known for their physicality.  D-line got gashed by the JCU run game, yes JCU actually ran the ball this season (guess they learned their lesson from last year's playoff game), and Mount had very little pressure on Myers. Not a good sign moving forward if that's the O and D line play we can expect moving forward.

[formerd3db]

OAC officiating has been horrid all season.  Makes me look forward to seeing the NCAC refs......

Regardless of the rule or not, what a shame the game ended the way it did.  Would have loved to have seen 1 more play.  Win or lose.

Hopefully JCU enters the playoffs pissed and focused and he'll bent on earning a return trip to Mount.  The OAC reputation could sure use the 2nd place team going on a deep playoff run ala 02, 05 and 06.

Regarding the topic of officiating, since you guys are discussing it regarding yesterday's game, I am glad to hear that we in the MIAA are not the only ones who have complained about the officiating.  The officiating in the MIAA has been horrible also for the past 4-5 years.  IMO, it actually improved and was pretty good last year, however, unfortunately for this year, it has returned to the former poor level.  We all realize that officiating is an extremely difficult job and that, as humans, we all make some mistakes.  However, being able to make the basic correct calls, knowing the rules as well as being very astute observers as an official (and not letting blatently observed/continuous known occurring infractions such as holding) is simply an expected attribute that officials must have and do.  I do not doubt that in the majority of cases, the officials are trying to do their best and not intentionally being vindictive-although the latter certainly happens from time to time. Yet, sadly, many of today's officials are extremely lacking in these areas.   

Now, before anyone throws darts at me for these comments, I will admit that were I an official I'm sure that I would not be mistake-prone either, however, again, I believe I would be consistent as to not let things slide or look-the-other way as many of our officials have a tendency to do. Also, I won't even get into the discussion regarding instant reply here other than to say while I think it is great and appropriate to have that in college football when it is used, on the other hand, it still doesn't take the human element out of it and mistakes still made.

Anyway, it sounds like it was an exciting game to watch yesterday, as was our game, which didn't have any title riding on the outcome, yet was still a "big" game in the overall context of Hope and Kalamazoo's respective seasons.  Good luck to Mount Union and also JCU if the latter gets spot in the playoffs. 

[SaintsFAN]

WOW!  What a game!  I have finally recovered enough to post.

This won't be very popular on this board, but Mount's offensive & defensive lines don't look much (if any) better than they did last year.  This was their first big test, and in my opinion they failed.  Yes, they won the game, but in my opinion they didn't show enough to make me think they are ready for the cheese-eating scourge from Wisconsin.  Burke was running for his life all day, and the line repeatedly whiffed on JCU defenders.

HOPEFULLY, they can continue to improve if they move through the play-offs.  Skunk & I had a great time at the game, and as per usual there were "fired up" students from both schools yipping and yapping, and all of that should be taken for what it was:  a bunch of college kids with too much vim and vigor fueled by who knows what beverage.   

Here's hoping both teams make a deep run, and possibly meeting somewhere down the line in the play-offs.

You're being kind.   

The O-line got DOMINATED by a very "solid" JCU defense that has never been known for their physicality.  D-line got gashed by the JCU run game, yes JCU actually ran the ball this season (guess they learned their lesson from last year's playoff game), and Mount had very little pressure on Myers. Not a good sign moving forward if that's the O and D line play we can expect moving forward.

But the stats say the Mount D is better in 2014.

[rscl70]

Congrats to Mount Union on the win, and finishing on their final drive.  The call to fake the read option and throw down the sideline was a great one. 

I'd be lying if I said I wasn't terribly disappointed by this loss, and the manner in which the game finished.  The rule is the rule, but this game is a great example of why it shouldn't exist.  As someone said earlier, what does that rule add?  It's not like a 10 second runoff to prevent a team from just committing a penalty to stop the clock.  It doesn't add any safety measures for the players.  It's simply a rule to cover the officials' collective a** and not put them in a position to have to make a difficult call.  What a disappointing end to what could have been a classic game.  It's terrible to see a game like that decided on what a quick Google search calls "one of the top five worst rules in college football."

I thought both defenses played pretty well.  Mount's for the first half in particular, and JCU's in the second half in particular.  Watching the ugly first quarter, I was hoping Myers and the offense would find their rhythm, and boy did they eventually.

One final note on the officiating and the final call.  Tim Gleason, if you read this board, you should be ashamed if that was the best crew you could put out there.  Both teams, and in particular JCU, got away with holding all day long (I think there was one holding call the during the entire game), they took away a clear fumble and recovery from John Carroll (tell your officials that if an offensive player is laying on top of another player without touching the ground with a knee, back, elbow, etc, and loses the football, without a whistle, he's not down), I still can't figure out how John Carroll's first drive started at the one when the player who downed the punt was physically laying with half his body over the goal line, I have no idea what the "facemask" was that continued the final drive (though I won't complain too much about it).

And after willfully ignoring all these rules all game long, they decide to go by the letter of the law to end the game.  Great crew.  Keep up the terrible work.

Congrats again to Mount on the big win.  They finished, JCU didn't.  I just hope Carroll can get past this and prepare for the playoffs.

Great post!  I hate the way the game ended.  JCU deserved the chance to score and Mount the chance to stop them.  It should have been decided by the players, not by some obscure rule.

[purpled]

Don't know who posted regarding the conservative play calling in the second half on Mount but I agree. I didn't see the "go for the throat" offense. The short routes could have picked apart JC's coverage...the 3 step drop would have been more effective...BJ up the gut, IMHO, was totally ineffective. But as stated a win is a win and I too, would have loved one last play.

[reality check]

hscoach

You left '99 off your deep playoff second place teams list.  We gotta fight for the little scraps we got. 


Re: JCU/UMU fans/representatives

I know the new guy was talking about the superiority complex of some Mount fans and like it or not, there are definitely folks on this forum and in that fanbase (every fanbase for that matter) that can be less than likable.  And realistically, the more successful the program, the more likely there are bigger fan-jerks because winning breeds that sense of invincibility/superiority.  Every program has them.  Just like every program has level-headed, likable and gracious fans/posters (except for Thomas More)  .  And as an innocent bystander in this clash between Mount and John Carroll, I feel the point was already clearly proven in the roughly ten posts in either direction of the new guy's first entry in this forum.

[Kira & Jaxon's Dad]

Don't know who posted regarding the conservative play calling in the second half on Mount but I agree. I didn't see the "go for the throat" offense. The short routes could have picked apart JC's coverage...the 3 step drop would have been more effective...BJ up the gut, IMHO, was totally ineffective. But as stated a win is a win and I too, would have loved one last play.

Don't know if Coach Dartt has been talking to LK, but under LK the offense used to get VERY vanilla towards the end of the season as to not show too much on film for playoff opponents.

[mr_mom]

Regardless of the rule or not, what a shame the game ended the way it did.  Would have loved to have seen 1 more play.  Win or lose.

Fully agree.   A muddled, unfulfilling end to an exciting game.