FB: Ohio Athletic Conference

[02 Warhawk]

I think the fact that ONU is on Mount's schedule, and at home, is why 70's said they would be a serious challange.  I guess someone would have to be choosen as Mount's toughest game. 

I just don't get it.  Why is ONU considered a serious challenge if Oshkosh is not.
The stats for the 2010 games are monstrously in favor of Oshkosh being a tougher challenge- without even considering what each team brings back.  ONU gained 183 yards to Oshkosh's 436.  ONU scored 0 points, Oshkosh put up 28 points- twice as much as any other team except the other WIAC team Mt played.  Oshkosh brings their offensive stars and defensive backfield back this year. 
Must be an OAC thing. 

Probably b/c Mount fans are more comfortable when their team is playing in Alliance than Ada?

[Raider 68]

I think the fact that ONU is on Mount's schedule, and at home, is why 70's said they would be a serious challange.  I guess someone would have to be choosen as Mount's toughest game. 

I just don't get it.  Why is ONU considered a serious challenge if Oshkosh is not.
The stats for the 2010 games are monstrously in favor of Oshkosh being a tougher challenge- without even considering what each team brings back.  ONU gained 183 yards to Oshkosh's 436.  ONU scored 0 points, Oshkosh put up 28 points- twice as much as any other team except the other WIAC team Mt played.  Oshkosh brings their offensive stars and defensive backfield back this year. 
Must be an OAC thing. 

emma17,

Since 1994, the Raiders have lost only 4 home games, 2 regular season 1994 B-W 10-23, 2005 ONU 14-21,
Playoffs  1995 UW-LAC 17-20, 2005 MHB 35-38. Their record for regular season games was over 100 before
the loss to ONU in 2005, and it is over 100 and counting for away regular season.

The numbers just say the ONU away could be their toughest game this fall, it does not mean that UW-Osh
will do poorly against them.

[emma17]

I think the fact that ONU is on Mount's schedule, and at home, is why 70's said they would be a serious challange.  I guess someone would have to be choosen as Mount's toughest game. 

I just don't get it.  Why is ONU considered a serious challenge if Oshkosh is not.
The stats for the 2010 games are monstrously in favor of Oshkosh being a tougher challenge- without even considering what each team brings back.  ONU gained 183 yards to Oshkosh's 436.  ONU scored 0 points, Oshkosh put up 28 points- twice as much as any other team except the other WIAC team Mt played.  Oshkosh brings their offensive stars and defensive backfield back this year. 
Must be an OAC thing. 

Home field advantage + ONU has a defense. IIRC they held Mount to 27 points last year, which Oshkosh had (and probably still has) no hope of doing. Oshkosh will score points, I just don't think they'll be able to slow Mount down again at all.

Thanks for the reasonable replies as I was beginning to think you all were just being stubborn.  I'm not asking Mt fans to jump on the Oshkosh bandwagon, only that you give some credence to the possibility of a tougher game given the facts.  I understand the homefield advantage idea, that may indeed play a part- not sure if it is the difference between blow out and close game though. 
A few more points to consider in thinking about the Mt vs Oshkosh game:
-The general consensus is Oshkosh has a weak defense and ONU is strong.  Facts:  Mt gained 172 yards rushing vs Oshkosh and 202 vs. ONU.  Oshkosh finished 2nd in WIAC in pass defense.  Oshkosh returns 8 defensive starters.
-Common opponent:  River Falls.  Oshkosh won 43-15- Oshkosh outgains RF 420-239.  ONU won 35-21- ONU outgains RF 375-361. 
-ONU's toughest opponent (or closest game) last year (other than Mt and NCC)- River Falls.  Rivers Falls was 1-9. 
-Oshkosh returns 2nd team all conference QB and receiver.
-Oshkosh opens up against Central prior to playing Mt.

Nobody thinks Oshkosh has at least a chance to be a tougher opponent for Mt than ONU?

[seventiesraider]

The fact that the OAC has a traveling squad size is one factor in my statement. That I expect ONU to be ranked at the end of the season and don't expect to see Oshkosh there is another. Playing on the road is another and former Mount player/ONU coach Dean Paul rounds it out.

I expect any season opener to be closer than if we played the team 6 weeks later

[seventiesraider]

A chance to see CSIII and Kyle Miller on the tube tonight

[emma17]

The fact that the OAC has a traveling squad size is one factor in my statement. That I expect ONU to be ranked at the end of the season and don't expect to see Oshkosh there is another. Playing on the road is another and former Mount player/ONU coach Dean Paul rounds it out.

I expect any season opener to be closer than if we played the team 6 weeks later

Thanks Seventies- I think there are intangibles that you would be much more aware of than me- and no doubt they have an impact.
Regarding your last comment, I though about that too- and then I checked the scores of Mt's previous opening games.
Lastly, and with all due respect, based on all information i know of, I wonder how ONU earned the post season ranking it got.

[02 Warhawk]

The fact that the OAC has a traveling squad size is one factor in my statement. That I expect ONU to be ranked at the end of the season and don't expect to see Oshkosh there is another. Playing on the road is another and former Mount player/ONU coach Dean Paul rounds it out.

I expect any season opener to be closer than if we played the team 6 weeks later

Thanks Seventies- I think there are intangibles that you would be much more aware of than me- and no doubt they have an impact.
Regarding your last comment, I though about that too- and then I checked the scores of Mt's previous opening games.
Lastly, and with all due respect, based on all information i know of, I wonder how ONU earned the post season ranking it got.

One loss in the second toughest conference in DIII. That's why, I'm guessing.

[Pat Coleman]

For UWW- Coppage no doubt was diiference, Brekke played well enough at QB, so Blanchard would probably
               not contributed more than Coppage and/or Brekke

I saw Blanchard once and Brekke twice last year. Blanchard was significantly better.

[reality check]

I think the fact that ONU is on Mount's schedule, and at home, is why 70's said they would be a serious challange.  I guess someone would have to be choosen as Mount's toughest game. 

I just don't get it.  Why is ONU considered a serious challenge if Oshkosh is not.
The stats for the 2010 games are monstrously in favor of Oshkosh being a tougher challenge- without even considering what each team brings back.  ONU gained 183 yards to Oshkosh's 436.  ONU scored 0 points, Oshkosh put up 28 points- twice as much as any other team except the other WIAC team Mt played.  Oshkosh brings their offensive stars and defensive backfield back this year. 
Must be an OAC thing. 

Home field advantage + ONU has a defense. IIRC they held Mount to 27 points last year, which Oshkosh had (and probably still has) no hope of doing. Oshkosh will score points, I just don't think they'll be able to slow Mount down again at all.

Thanks for the reasonable replies as I was beginning to think you all were just being stubborn.  I'm not asking Mt fans to jump on the Oshkosh bandwagon, only that you give some credence to the possibility of a tougher game given the facts.  I understand the homefield advantage idea, that may indeed play a part- not sure if it is the difference between blow out and close game though. 
A few more points to consider in thinking about the Mt vs Oshkosh game:
-The general consensus is Oshkosh has a weak defense and ONU is strong.  Facts:  Mt gained 172 yards rushing vs Oshkosh and 202 vs. ONU.  Oshkosh finished 2nd in WIAC in pass defense.  Oshkosh returns 8 defensive starters.
-Common opponent:  River Falls.  Oshkosh won 43-15- Oshkosh outgains RF 420-239.  ONU won 35-21- ONU outgains RF 375-361. 
-ONU's toughest opponent (or closest game) last year (other than Mt and NCC)- River Falls.  Rivers Falls was 1-9. 
-Oshkosh returns 2nd team all conference QB and receiver.
-Oshkosh opens up against Central prior to playing Mt.

Nobody thinks Oshkosh has at least a chance to be a tougher opponent for Mt than ONU?

Look I've been sitting back reading most of the banter but I had to chime in.  ONU's toughest opponent was River Falls?  Is this just your opinion?  I'd put OAC opponents OTT (ranked 18 at the time) or BW higher than UWRF in terms of toughest on paper and I'd still have to give #9 Wittenberg the edge over RF as well.  UWRF played tough against ONU but they wouldn't go down as toughest after NCC and Mount in my opinion.



As for ONU in 2011, I have my concerns but I am always optimistic given the state of the program.  I think I would still put them near the top but in replacing Donley and Simmons, the offense has some challenges to address.  I think the Polar Bears are a reload-type team as opposed to a rebuild-team but BW has a ton coming back and finished strong last season.  I'd slot them slightly ahead of ONU given the turnover and expect OTT to be right there in the conversation as well. 

[B.W. jacket]

very well stated ONU.

[emma17]

Hold on there a second Reality Check- lets not put words in my mouth. 
I added a claryifying comment in parenthesis - (closest game).  To be clear, I am not attempting to claim that River Falls was better than all the other OAC teams- I don't think that.  The point I'm making is, whether we like the facts or not, River Falls gave ONU its closest game- in terms of points than any other team besides Mt and NCC.  It's one of the reasons I don't see why ONU is so highly regarded this year and why they were so highly regarded last year.  I am only bringing the point up because I am trying to support the idea that Oshkosh may present a bigger challenge to Mt than ONU does.   

Objectivity is hard when you're used to standing alone atop the mountain.  I have presented a whole bunch of hard numbers, not just opinions. 

02- As long as I'm going to take the beating, The second toughest conference in DIII-Really 02?  Based on what?  Wins and losses?  It gets difficult to measure conferences when some can only play one non-con game.  I think Wesley and Case Western Reserve were the two good teams the OAC took on in non conf games. ONU beats River Falls and all OAC teams not named Mt and that gets them a #8 final ranking? Ahead of Linfield, Trine and Wheaton?  Really?   

From the perspective of having at least 3 teams that can play with just about anybody in the country, I'll give you five conferences that I feel rank ahead of the OAC from 2010: 
CCIW (in my opinion they will send a DIII champion soon)
MIAC
ASC
IIAC
WIAC-Wins and losses are skewed mostly because of the competition it plays-(in 2010- ONU, Trine, St. Thomas, Central, Mt Union, Wheaton, North Central, St. Johns, Mary Hardin-Baylor, E. Texas Baptist, Willamette, NAIA Campbellsville).

OK, have at me, but come with facts please.   

[02 Warhawk]

02- As long as I'm going to take the beating, The second toughest conference in DIII-Really 02?  Based on what?  Wins and losses?  It gets difficult to measure conferences when some can only play one non-con game.  I think Wesley and Case Western Reserve were the two good teams the OAC took on in non conf games. ONU beats River Falls and all OAC teams not named Mt and that gets them a #8 final ranking? Ahead of Linfield, Trine and Wheaton?  Really?  


OK, have at me, but come with facts please.    

If you insist.....

D3football.com conference rankings.

[emma17]

BoBo,

Regarding your Stagg Bowl question " I've been thinking since last December how different the Stagg would've played out had if teams #1 were in the game. What do you think?"

I think the Raiders would have prevailed with a couple points win.

For UWW- Coppage no doubt was diiference, Brekke played well enough at QB, so Blanchard would probably
               not contributed more than Coppage and/or Brekke

For Mount- Seaman was so consistant all year, and Piloto came into that game as his first as a starter. Some
                key INT's for him and lack of game time exposure hurt him in the end.

Both defenses played very well as they usually do, therefore Seaman's loss for that big game would have,
IMHO changed the result.

Now we are in a new year so we will see, but a great question! +k

68- I really want to believe you meant to add the wink emoticon to this post- right?  
If not, I'd like to explain it this way.  Take the defenses out of the discussion.  
In the game, Mt's strength on offense was its passing attack- 323 yards and 2 touchdowns.  Mt's weakness was its run game-45 yards (ouch).  If you replace Piloto with Seaman, you replace strength for strength, doing nothing to improve the horrific run game.

UWW's strength was the run game- 312 yards.  UWW's weakness was the passing game- 121 yards.  When we replace Brekke, we do so with a QB that threw 21 TD's to 1 INT, and a guy that keeps drives alive with his running ability.  We replace weakness with strength in the passing game, and maintain strength in the running game.  

Here's a set of numbers for you, Mt scored 3 times (once when Brekke threw a pick to your D End that went to the 1)- they ran a total of 8 plays for the 3 scores (2.6 plays per scoring drive).  UWW scored 5 times, they ran a total of 32 plays (6.4 plays per scoring drive).  Most coaches want multi play drives that result in scores.  The game was much closer than it should have been in reality.  It also shows just how reliant Mt had become on the big play.    

[emma17]

02- As long as I'm going to take the beating, The second toughest conference in DIII-Really 02?  Based on what?  Wins and losses?  It gets difficult to measure conferences when some can only play one non-con game.  I think Wesley and Case Western Reserve were the two good teams the OAC took on in non conf games. ONU beats River Falls and all OAC teams not named Mt and that gets them a #8 final ranking? Ahead of Linfield, Trine and Wheaton?  Really?  


OK, have at me, but come with facts please.    

If you insist.....

D3football.com conference rankings.

Ahh, so if DIII said it, then...
Curious if you have any thoughts of your own to support OAC as the second toughest conference in 2010?

[02 Warhawk]

02- As long as I'm going to take the beating, The second toughest conference in DIII-Really 02?  Based on what?  Wins and losses?  It gets difficult to measure conferences when some can only play one non-con game.  I think Wesley and Case Western Reserve were the two good teams the OAC took on in non conf games. ONU beats River Falls and all OAC teams not named Mt and that gets them a #8 final ranking? Ahead of Linfield, Trine and Wheaton?  Really?  


OK, have at me, but come with facts please.    

If you insist.....

D3football.com conference rankings.

Ahh, so if DIII said it, then...
Curious if you have any thoughts of your own to support OAC as the second toughest conference in 2010?

I think the top 3-4 teams in the OAC are better than just about any conference's top 3-4 teams...including the WIAC (with the exception of UWW of course  ).

However, there's isn't a conference in DIII that's more competitive from top to bottom than the WIAC. I will take the bottom half of the WIAC over any other conference's bottom half. That's what separates the WIAC from the rest of the pack, IMO.