FB: Ohio Athletic Conference

[joelmama]

See I look at it differently.  Here is how I would break it down.

Chance to:
-win the game: .02%

-convert a 4th and 18: 15% (and you still have the ball then and all three timeouts to stop them again)

-punt and hope for a muff: 3% (MUC could have chosen not to catch a tough punt)

-block a punt: 5% (tough to say for me, I don't know how good STUs special teams are)

-punt and stop then from converting a 1st down: 50% (not knowing they would kneel the ball, and also knowing that they would punt again, and probably give you an additional 20 yards?)

-punt and force a fumble during that next MUC possession: 2%

I don't know, I'm taking the chance to convert on 4th, as the chance to do everything else is so slim, that first score is the most important one and you get your timeouts.  field position isn't going to mean that much with MUC punting again anyway.

I hope you're not a poker player.  Why take the 15% chance (even 15% seems generous) over the 50% chance?

Maybe that is why your logic is failing.  That 50% and 15% isn't to win the game, it is to get the ball back without using timeouts at some point on the field with the added task of stopping Mt. Union from getting a 1st down. 

And that isn't how poker works.  Do you take the 15% chance at a royal flush, or a 50% chance at 2 pair?

50% chance at two-pair.  This is what Caruso did. Just because you misinterpret his punt as a white flag, doesn't mean you get to call him classless once you realize your mistake.

I never called Caruso classless.  I played with him at Ithaca for 3 years.  He was my captain and a friend.  I love the guy.  Doesn't mean I think punting on 4th down is the right call, or grabbing the snap is the right call.

Back to the poker, you don't take the 2 pair if there are cards on the table which give you a 15% chance of winning big versus a small chance of winning with the 2 pair.

2 pair wins the pot, going to lose a lot of hands waiting for a royal flush.

I would love to play poker against you.  I assume that if you are going for two pair you have one pair.  In most poker hands (hold-em) one pair doesn't get it done  let's also define how many people are in the hand at that time.  If you are going to make these stupid comments I am in complete agreement lets make this discussion to an all time low.  On the subject of stupid conversations I do not think you can engage anyone more experienced than to me to have one with.

As for your comment that in the UWW Mount kept running to maintain their scoring average you are just trying to make idiotic comments to get a rise because nobody can be that dumb and still have the skills to operate a computer.

[Raider 68]

For those interested, the University bookstore at Mount has a good assortment of NC gear.
Make nice Christmas presents!

[rscl70]

For those interested, the University bookstore at Mount has a good assortment of NC gear.
Make nice Christmas presents!

The wife and I were just there.  Assortment is pretty well picked over.  They are expecting more gear in on Wednesday and Thursday.

[Raider 68]

For those interested, the University bookstore at Mount has a good assortment of NC gear.
Make nice Christmas presents!

The wife and I were just there.  Assortment is pretty well picked over.  They are expecting more gear in on Wednesday and Thursday.

rscl70,

Must be that pent up demand! The hats are due on Wednesday!

[tommiegun]

I find it interesting that the UMAC fan is the one defending Caruso here.

I know Caruso's belief is that they should never quit, and it had been a long time since I had been at a game St. Thomas lost, but I think a knee would have been wise. I could see the one timeout to bring his team over and have them recognize the moment ... but that's enough.

Who takes a knee when they're losing?  Are you suggesting Mount should have taken a knee on 3rd and 4th down with less than a minute to go?  Perhaps they were more concerned with winning by 3 scores, which is why they punted?

Mount already took a knee - twice - with less than a minute to go.

As two outsiders (UMAC for you, CCIW for me), I find it curious that you are defending the indefensible.  (I also feel strange defending the Mount! )  Attacking a 'victory formation', down three scores with under a minute to go, is utterly indefensible.  As has been noted, calling the first time out seemed like Caruso was calling them over to 'concede with grace' and forget the attack.  To me, to attack a second time (and call another time out), was utterly despicable (and was clearly on Caruso, not his players).

I have tremendous admiration for Caruso for what he has accomplished, but this was a HUGE blot on him.  As someone else said, hopefully he will learn 'integrity' from this.

again, it wasn't a victory formation situation.  You go into the victory formation when you are able to run out the clock.  Mount couldn't.

Without the time outs, they could.  Since even the announcers thought UST's earlier punt had been a 'concession speech', LK was gracious enough to go victory formation rather than try to score again.

Why are you trying to defend the indefensible?

I generally like your posts Mr. Ypsi, but I find it odd to cite espnU announcers as authority.

[Desertraider]

I find it interesting that the UMAC fan is the one defending Caruso here.

I know Caruso's belief is that they should never quit, and it had been a long time since I had been at a game St. Thomas lost, but I think a knee would have been wise. I could see the one timeout to bring his team over and have them recognize the moment ... but that's enough.

Who takes a knee when they're losing?  Are you suggesting Mount should have taken a knee on 3rd and 4th down with less than a minute to go?  Perhaps they were more concerned with winning by 3 scores, which is why they punted?

Mount already took a knee - twice - with less than a minute to go.

As two outsiders (UMAC for you, CCIW for me), I find it curious that you are defending the indefensible.  (I also feel strange defending the Mount! )  Attacking a 'victory formation', down three scores with under a minute to go, is utterly indefensible.  As has been noted, calling the first time out seemed like Caruso was calling them over to 'concede with grace' and forget the attack.  To me, to attack a second time (and call another time out), was utterly despicable (and was clearly on Caruso, not his players).

I have tremendous admiration for Caruso for what he has accomplished, but this was a HUGE blot on him.  As someone else said, hopefully he will learn 'integrity' from this.

again, it wasn't a victory formation situation.  You go into the victory formation when you are able to run out the clock.  Mount couldn't.

Without the time outs, they could.  Since even the announcers thought UST's earlier punt had been a 'concession speech', LK was gracious enough to go victory formation rather than try to score again.

Why are you trying to defend the indefensible?

I generally like your posts Mr. Ypsi, but I find it odd to cite espnU announcers as authority.

Nooooo! Time to end this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVIZYDuMY10

[sfury]

Kehres gets the Grantland treatment from one of my favorite writers, Michael Weinreb.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8757311/division-iii-mount-union-football-team-head-coach-larry-kehres

[skunks_sidekick]

Kehres gets the Grantland treatment from one of my favorite writers, Michael Weinreb.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8757311/division-iii-mount-union-football-team-head-coach-larry-kehres

Thanks Sfury....that is a great read, and really hit upon the essence that is LK, and in extension Mount football.

[MUC80]

Kehres gets the Grantland treatment from one of my favorite writers, Michael Weinreb.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8757311/division-iii-mount-union-football-team-head-coach-larry-kehres

Great article! Thanks for sharing.

[mtfan]

AO's defense of STU's tactics are misguided at best and plain idiotic at worst.  If Caruso was still playing to win, he has two options:
1.  Don't punt (by far the best option)
2.  Call timeouts immediately after Mount's first couple plays hoping his defense can force a quick 3 and out

But once Mount picked up the first down, the game was over.  Regardless of whether STU got the ball back again with a few seconds left or not.  I honestly don't have a problem with him calling the timeouts, he was just dumb in when he called them.  It's the submarining of O-line by the DT's that is cheap. 

We said on the broadcast that we assumed (wrongly as it turns out) that the timeout after the first kneel down was to calm his defense down and to play out the last few seconds with restraint and class.  However when they did it again on the 2nd kneel down that Caruso revealed his true character.   The first kneel down could have been the random act of a frustrated individual player.  The 2nd kneel down was obviously a coaching decision.   

Good thing I wasn't in LK's shoes as I would have run a jet route from the victory formation on 3rd down after the games Caruso pulled on 1st and 2nd down to score another one.

Bingo! My thoughts exactly!


Way to go Raiders, especially to all you seniors who have shown your perseverance and the will to get back atop the D3 throne and set a new standard for the coming underclassmen on what determination and commitment truly means!
Congrats also to STU on a terrific season, as you have accomplished over the past 4 years as a d3 powerhouse to be reckoned with. I expect, as most championship caliber teams evolve, we'll be meeting again.


For those that were able to join the tailgate, hope you all had a great time! Was really nice to see so many faces from the D3 board and Olinemom, you still got some killer brownies going! thanks for joining us! After about 30 lbs. of pulled pork, 300+ chicken wings, 5 dozen burgers, 6 dozen hot dogs, 4 dozen brauts, 5lbs of marinated meatballs, 8 lbs of marinated Keilbasa, an awesome salsa dip thanks to Wesleydad, 3 gallons of chili and numerous desserts by so many of the Mount faithful and Mount parents, it was a tremendous success and a wonderful time. Sorry I missed you Pat as i was grillin most the time, but I know Olinemom was searching you out and i'm sure found you in much need of some brownies. Thanks to HurfMUC, Wesleydad and the many others that also helped in getting the tailgate set up on a beautiful day in Salem, Virginia. And yes, even with the great time we had, it wasn't quite the same not having the Stone Station crew there as well but we expect we'll be back and see you next year

Wish everyone the very best this holiday season and keep all those who have suffered from the events this past week in our thoughts and prayers along with all those serving in our armed services here and abroad. Special thanks to Pat, Keith and the D3 staff for making this tremendous site for the D3 nation, 230+ strong, we can enjoy and chatter about all year long!

[Mr. Ypsi]

I find it interesting that the UMAC fan is the one defending Caruso here.

I know Caruso's belief is that they should never quit, and it had been a long time since I had been at a game St. Thomas lost, but I think a knee would have been wise. I could see the one timeout to bring his team over and have them recognize the moment ... but that's enough.

Who takes a knee when they're losing?  Are you suggesting Mount should have taken a knee on 3rd and 4th down with less than a minute to go?  Perhaps they were more concerned with winning by 3 scores, which is why they punted?

Mount already took a knee - twice - with less than a minute to go.

As two outsiders (UMAC for you, CCIW for me), I find it curious that you are defending the indefensible.  (I also feel strange defending the Mount! )  Attacking a 'victory formation', down three scores with under a minute to go, is utterly indefensible.  As has been noted, calling the first time out seemed like Caruso was calling them over to 'concede with grace' and forget the attack.  To me, to attack a second time (and call another time out), was utterly despicable (and was clearly on Caruso, not his players).

I have tremendous admiration for Caruso for what he has accomplished, but this was a HUGE blot on him.  As someone else said, hopefully he will learn 'integrity' from this.

again, it wasn't a victory formation situation.  You go into the victory formation when you are able to run out the clock.  Mount couldn't.

Without the time outs, they could.  Since even the announcers thought UST's earlier punt had been a 'concession speech', LK was gracious enough to go victory formation rather than try to score again.

Why are you trying to defend the indefensible?

I generally like your posts Mr. Ypsi, but I find it odd to cite espnU announcers as authority.

Nooooo! Time to end this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVIZYDuMY10

desertraider, I agree, but need one final rebuttal.  tommiegun, why would you think I was listening to the espn announcers when Pat and Keith were broadcasting?!

[SaintsFAN]

Craig Candeto is the new HC in Bexley.  Credit to Cap, they went outside the box on this hire.  I like it.  Although I'm not sure JK will like seeing a Midshipman in charge!

Cbus Dispatch

I will be very interested to see what offense Capital runs in week 1 next year.  Their opponent in Bexley is the Thomas More Saints.

[mtfan]

Kehres gets the Grantland treatment from one of my favorite writers, Michael Weinreb.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8757311/division-iii-mount-union-football-team-head-coach-larry-kehres

+K  great read!!

[Dr. Acula]

Craig Candeto is the new HC in Bexley.  Credit to Cap, they went outside the box on this hire.  I like it.  Although I'm not sure JK will like seeing a Midshipman in charge!

Cbus Dispatch

I will be very interested to see what offense Capital runs in week 1 next year.  Their opponent in Bexley is the Thomas More Saints.

That was my first thought as well, SF.  Wonder if we'll see the option?  I'm not sure what they run at the Citadel.

[pradierguy]

Kehres gets the Grantland treatment from one of my favorite writers, Michael Weinreb.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8757311/division-iii-mount-union-football-team-head-coach-larry-kehres

So neat to see Grantland pick up the Purple Raiders!