FB: Ohio Athletic Conference

[Mr. Ypsi]

The decision might be about something other than football.

It's all about the Benjamin's for sure in this case! I think if it were for competitive purposes, they would wait around 8 years to try to improve before making the move down to D3.

Since the days of being 'grandfathered' are long gone, divisional status is for ALL sports now.  Pat may have been talking about the overall sports program, not just money (or football).

I know next to nothing about the PAC.  Geographically that would seem to be an option; IS it a viable option for Walsh and/or Malone?

[raiderpa]

I believe the best option for Malone is the one mentioning that Wilmington leave the OAC and Malone replace them.  They would be very competitive in all sports and would be a good fit for the OAC.  What about the OAC adding 2 or 4 teams and going back to a two division set up as they had in the '60's?

[Pat Coleman]

The decision might be about something other than football.

It's all about the Benjamin's for sure in this case! I think if it were for competitive purposes, they would wait around 8 years to try to improve before making the move down to D3.

Since the days of being 'grandfathered' are long gone, divisional status is for ALL sports now.  Pat may have been talking about the overall sports program, not just money (or football).

I know next to nothing about the PAC.  Geographically that would seem to be an option; IS it a viable option for Walsh and/or Malone?

Yes, that's what I was getting at, directly related to what ExTP said:

Anyways, putting the economics aside, it seems a little hard to buy that Walsh would have to move down because they're not good enough to compete where they are.  Last year they won four games and led undefeated Ferris State for 50-plus minutes in the season finale.  If the finances are an issue, OK, I get that.  But the on-field product hardly seems to be reason that they have to move down a division.

[ohiofan1954]

Interesting discussion about both Walsh and Malone. First if either did decide to drop down they would probably be playing their games in what would be the largest d3 stadium in the nation. Has either school actually showed any interest in moving down? For that matter has Wilmington actually showed any interest in leaving. One last question does the academic status of these schools match what the OAC would want? Walsh has certainly had more success also then some other Ohio d2 schools. Although Tiffin had a decent year in 14 that is certainly not their normal performance. It is true Ohio Dominican has had great success with their football program at the start but that is a deviation from the norm and it certainly hasn't translated to their other programs. Fine schools both Walsh and Malone but I can't see either school ever being serious about moving out of d2. Remember even if they are having competition problems they are still fairly new to d2 and they play in what is probably one of the strongest football conferences there is no matter what the division.  I would see Walsh or Malone stepping down to a lower d2 conference like the MEC before they would leave the GLIAC.

[ohiofan1954]

I find it amusing that Malone is searching for a level to compete in where they truly fit well. Their charter specifically prohibited football for decades. Come late to the game and struggle to catch up with other well established teams.....imagine that! Are they competitive in their other sports programs or is this football driven? Do you think Wilmington could beat them?

Malone is traditionally good at stuff like golf, track, CC, baseball.  They've been up and down in basketball.  They've been only down in football, but they'd still beat Wilm easily.  They're still a scholarship program so they do have some talent.  Just nowhere near enough to compete in the GLIAC every week.  I haven't seen them since they have been full blown D2, but my guess is they'd be BW-ish.

I'm pretty familiar with Walsh and Malone from growing up in Stark County and paying attention to them over the years. I also know a couple of recent Walsh graduates that played football. They both told me that they wouldn't be surprised if Walsh has to move to D3 as well within 5 years. Walsh has approximately 2,800 students, Malone has around 2,500 students and Mount Union is around 2,200. Now, thinking financially Walsh and Malone don't seem to get tons alumni donations or donations in general. How can they maintain full scholarships for these student athletes? I went to 4 Walsh games the past couple of years (they played Malone 2 of those times) and I would watch Mount the next weekend and there's no comparison and the players I talked to said the same thing. Walsh and Malone don't get the athletes and I'm afraid for their sake, that in the near future they will have a harder time when they won't be able to offer scholarships.

This is the way I put it when talking to my Walsh friends. Mount Union gets an average of around 3-4,000 per home game multiplied by $7 a ticket and you're around $20,000. You have 5 home games on average and that's around $100,000. This is why Mount CAN'T possibly move up to D2, we don't have the money. The donations that Mount does receive it goes into new facilities, and rightfully so with an amazing campus that now attracts many different types of students. When I went to the two Walsh/Malone games, there might have been a total of around 1,000 people there FOR THEIR RIVALRY!

Anyway, it looks like Walsh and Malone will be joining D3 sooner rather than later. Where could they possibly go?

Once again I will offer this as a possible spot for Walsh and Malone to move to. The MEC would be a good d2 fit, both Urbana and Notre Dame are both in that conference. True they would have traveling to West Virginia but that is no worse then Michigan especially Lake Superior State(sports other then football). Urbana is the school that needs looked at though as far as financial problems when it comes athletic funding by Universities. We all know of certain schools in Ohio that are having financial problems right now. Urbana though is the poster boy for those problems as they would have closed their doors last year if not bought out by Franklin University.

[Bishopleftiesdad]

For baseball the MEC already has 12 teams and 11 for Football. I cannot see them getting much bigger. They would probably have to split into divisions if they the MEX grows any bigger.

[ohiofan1954]

Thank you for that info bishopdad. I didn't know they already had that many teams. Just familiar with them because of Urbana, and Notre Dame. I must admit to not knowing a lot about the MEC otherwise.

[Dr. Acula]

Interesting discussion about both Walsh and Malone. First if either did decide to drop down they would probably be playing their games in what would be the largest d3 stadium in the nation. Has either school actually showed any interest in moving down? For that matter has Wilmington actually showed any interest in leaving. One last question does the academic status of these schools match what the OAC would want? Walsh has certainly had more success also then some other Ohio d2 schools. Although Tiffin had a decent year in 14 that is certainly not their normal performance. It is true Ohio Dominican has had great success with their football program at the start but that is a deviation from the norm and it certainly hasn't translated to their other programs. Fine schools both Walsh and Malone but I can't see either school ever being serious about moving out of d2. Remember even if they are having competition problems they are still fairly new to d2 and they play in what is probably one of the strongest football conferences there is no matter what the division.  I would see Walsh or Malone stepping down to a lower d2 conference like the MEC before they would leave the GLIAC.

There was an article in the paper saying that Malone was examining what they wanted to do.  It didn't say they wanted to move down or move at all, just that they were examining.

Wilm is presumably very happy in the OAC.  The idea of them leaving was purely a hypothetical I posed based largely on the fact that they'd come from the HCAC and from a geographic and competitive aspect in hindsight it was probably a better fit there.  I don't want them to leave, but of any member I'd think they were the most likely to do so. 

[ohiofan1954]

Thanks for the info Dr. I didn't know that Wilmington came over form the HCAC. Certainly a better fit. Quakers certainly can compete with some of the teams in that league. They play Bluffton the first game so that will an interesting result to look at.

[Dr. Acula]

Yeah, Wilmington joined sometime around 2000 so compared to their brethren in the OAC they're newbies still.

[skunks_sidekick]

Hello All You D-3ers!

The winter has been another crapfest, and I am hoping we will see the light (sun) somewhere soon here in Northeast Ohio.

I live less than a mile from Walsh, and happen to be friends/acquaintances with a few "in the know" folks over there.  I can confidently say that they have NO plans to move down at all.  They are working at finding their footing in all D-II sports, and have financial plans in place to continue to fund that standing, as well as keep enhancing more facilities.  If they can get a few other local homeowners to sell, I see them putting in an on campus stadium at some point.

Malone is a complete separate situation, and I think their spiritual direction might lead them down a different path as it concerns D-II/D-III.  I am unsure where exactly they would go in regards to conference affiliation if they choose to go D-III, so that might be a deterrent in the short term.

Spring is almost here (oh wait, it was SNOWING yesterday), so here's to a sunny warm day sometime soon.

[ExTartanPlayer]

Skunks, I'm with you on the weather...

I live in Pittsburgh and my GF teaches at Central Michigan U, so I've become a regular road visitor to NE Ohio (I've driven from Pittsburgh to Toledo and then up north eleven times in the past 8 months). I thought we were finally free of this nonsense last week with a couple of nice 50 degree days...and then it snowed again. Ugh.

[hsbsballcoach7]

Hello All You D-3ers!

The winter has been another crapfest, and I am hoping we will see the light (sun) somewhere soon here in Northeast Ohio.

I live less than a mile from Walsh, and happen to be friends/acquaintances with a few "in the know" folks over there.  I can confidently say that they have NO plans to move down at all.  They are working at finding their footing in all D-II sports, and have financial plans in place to continue to fund that standing, as well as keep enhancing more facilities.  If they can get a few other local homeowners to sell, I see them putting in an on campus stadium at some point.

Malone is a complete separate situation, and I think their spiritual direction might lead them down a different path as it concerns D-II/D-III.  I am unsure where exactly they would go in regards to conference affiliation if they choose to go D-III, so that might be a deterrent in the short term.

Spring is almost here (oh wait, it was SNOWING yesterday), so here's to a sunny warm day sometime soon.

I've heard rumors for years that Walsh was trying to put in an on-campus stadium, I just have a hard time buying it. I also know North Canton very well and know that some of those people will be stubborn in selling their homes and might put up a fight to not allow a stadium built by a housing development. North Canton Hoover H.S. has people complaining ALL the time about stadium lights, noise, etc.  However, like you mentioned, I could see Malone going to D3 before Walsh.

We've heard from the Mount Union fans about returning players, but what do others like John Carroll, Ohio Northern, Baldwin Wallace, etc return as far as contributors from last season?

[reality check]

2000 exactly.  Hiram was swapped out after the 1999 season.  Wilma came in after being near the top of the HCAC and was actually decent the first couple years in the OAC.  We were happy to unload a woeful Hiram football program on some other conference.  But the Quakers haven't sniffed .500 since their second year in the OAC (2001) and have 4 ZERO-win seasons in that time.

[ExTartanPlayer]

Riddle me this:

Heidelberg was obviously quite woeful in the mid-00's and got it going. I still remember reason the article on D3football.com's main page when they broke the 30-plus-game losing streak. A few years later they rose to near the top of the conference (no shows in big games the last 2 years aside).

Was this a case of Heidelberg being a sleeping giant (good location, school, facilities) that was underachieving and is just now doing what it really should be? Or was Heidi no better than anyone else, just got off the mat through blood, sweat and tears? Are the other down schools (Musky and Wilma) capable of the same transition? Or is there something inherent about the schools (small size, poor facilities, remote locale) that makes it especially difficult to draw talent?