FB: Ohio Athletic Conference

[Pat Coleman]

Right -- Alma might be a head-scratcher, possibly, but the other three are all to one program. So he hasn't beaten North Central yet.

[WRMUalum13]

listening to the post Stagg D3 podcast; other than the game, one of the talking points was "why would you ever fire someone with a 93.3% win percentage!?! Dartt has a 56-4 record!!"

Lets take a look at those 60 games

4 loses

- NCC in '21 (Semis) '22 (Stagg) and '24 (Stagg)
- Alma '23 (2nd rd)

56 wins
- JCU = 6
- Marietta = 5
- BW = 4
- Heidy, Muskie, Cap, Wilma, Ott, ONU = 26
- Westminster = 1
- W&L = 1
- JHU = 2
- Muhlenberg = 1
- Salisbury = 2
- Utica = 1
- Del Val = 1
- Wartburg = 1
- Alfred St = 1
- CMU = 1
- Ferrum = 1
- Defiance = 2

I get the % looks great, but where are the signature victories?

JHU? mighty Wartburg? something named Muhlenberg?

I'm not saying that a monkey could win 93% of their games at Mount, but....

Honestly any semi-finals win is a signature win in my book. Not sure why you're discounting Wartburg, did you forget the they had NCC on the ropes in 2023?

[D3fanboy]

but Mount played them in '22.  I guess that I just expect more from "The Standard" in a down period of D3FB.  Mount did a less than stellar job in the super senior COVID era, and nobody took advantage of that era more than NCC.

 

[bluestreak66]

but Mount played them in '22.  I guess that I just expect more from "The Standard" in a down period of D3FB.  Mount did a less than stellar job in the super senior COVID era, and nobody took advantage of that era more than NCC.

 

I think honestly it's taking for granted how great the Kehres era actually was. I don't think Mount has become less reasonably dominant. I think it's that when LK was coach, even spilling over into VK's tenure, Mount was unreasonably good. I think "The Standard" was a bar that was set too high. I think my take away is that Dartt is an amazing coach, by all metrics easily one of the best 5 in DIII at least, and he typically finds a way to win games a lesser coach may have lost. He is just not LK

[wally_wabash]

but Mount played them in '22.  I guess that I just expect more from "The Standard" in a down period of D3FB.  Mount did a less than stellar job in the super senior COVID era, and nobody took advantage of that era more than NCC.

 

Lame excuse.  Mount Union had really notable COVID seniors in 2023.  Guys that hold career records there that aren't going to get broken in a long, long time.  The continued harping on guys using permitted eligibility as if Mount Union isn't also leveraging the same rules as every other program is disingenuous. 

Not sure what "down period of D3FB" you're talking about.  The quality of depth in this division is better than it's been in decades.  Downplaying the division like that really kind of only serves to marginalize the great accomplishment its been to get to the final game twice in the last three years. 

If there's an opening (there won't be because adults are in charge there), what football coach in their right mind is going to take a job where 56-4 isn't good enough?  This is pure lunacy. 

[New Tradition]

Honestly any semi-finals win is a signature win in my book. Not sure why you're discounting Wartburg, did you forget the they had NCC on the ropes in 2023?

Talking to some prominent player's families in Houston over the weekend, they said that the thought among the team was that Wartburg was the toughest, most physical team they played last year.  Absolutely championship caliber. 

[D3fanboy]

but Mount played them in '22.  I guess that I just expect more from "The Standard" in a down period of D3FB.  Mount did a less than stellar job in the super senior COVID era, and nobody took advantage of that era more than NCC.

 

Lame excuse.  Mount Union had really notable COVID seniors in 2023.  Guys that hold career records there that aren't going to get broken in a long, long time.  The continued harping on guys using permitted eligibility as if Mount Union isn't also leveraging the same rules as every other program is disingenuous. 

Not sure what "down period of D3FB" you're talking about.  The quality of depth in this division is better than it's been in decades.  Downplaying the division like that really kind of only serves to marginalize the great accomplishment its been to get to the final game twice in the last three years. 

If there's an opening (there won't be because adults are in charge there), what football coach in their right mind is going to take a job where 56-4 isn't good enough?  This is pure lunacy. 

Career records are, as you say "lame".  a) playoff stats didnt count for many years b) imagine Kmic or KB having a 5th year instead of true freshman year, the numbers would be off of the charts. 

the "depth" was great because of 5th year seniors across the country and that only one program is standing on the top of the mountain.  The greatest dynasty known to man is pretty much a few recruiting classes that seemingly never graduate.   D3FB will likely go back to being 2-3 top teams each and every year

Mount is down, UWW is down, UMHB is whatever they are, the MN schools get pumped up by D3football but they arent on the St Thomas level, the WIAC no longer has a power.  Sounds like a down period to me.  Feel free to bring up analytics and such that say that D3 has never been better, but c'mon.  One team (with a generational class) has dominated.

[wally_wabash]

Mount is down, UWW is down, UMHB is whatever they are, the MN schools get pumped up by D3football but they arent on the St Thomas level, the WIAC no longer has a power.  Sounds like a down period to me.  Feel free to bring up analytics and such that say that D3 has never been better, but c'mon.  One team (with a generational class) has dominated.

If you're going to be stuck in a lane that only includes Mount Union, Whitewater, and UMHB that's on you.  The enjoyability and competitiveness of the division isn't inextricably linked to those three teams.  It's not 2012 anymore. 

FWIW, I don't think Mount Union is really down.  Mount Union is great.  They're just not quite as great as North Central right now.  Was Mount Union down when they were losing six out of seven to Whitewater?  I don't see the current situation as much different. 

[D3fanboy]

No, there were just two all time programs going back and forth each year for a decade back when most players only had 4 years of eligibility (5 in the WIAC).  UWW and Mount of that era blow any of today's teams away


Don't think Mount is down?  Nearly every "expert" picked Mount to disappoint and picked teams such as Salisbury or CMU to beat them lol

[wally_wabash]

No, there were just two all time programs going back and forth each year for a decade back when most players only had 4 years of eligibility (5 in the WIAC).

"They were going back forth each year" is a really creative way to interpret Whitewater winning six of the last seven championship games against Mount Union. 

[WRMUalum13]

No, there were just two all time programs going back and forth each year for a decade back when most players only had 4 years of eligibility (5 in the WIAC).  UWW and Mount of that era blow any of today's teams away


Don't think Mount is down?  Nearly every "expert" picked Mount to disappoint and picked teams such as Salisbury or CMU to beat them lol

Okay, key difference between perception and reality, maybe perception is down, but Mount did win those games and more

[wally_wabash]

Don't think Mount is down?  Nearly every "expert" picked Mount to disappoint and picked teams such as Salisbury or CMU to beat them lol

Three of seven panelists picked Salisbury.  Nobody picked Mount Union to lose to CMU or JCU or JHU.  I'm sorry that this doesn't fit the narrative you're desperately trying to paint. 

I'll reiterate that on the surface, this current 5-year stretch isn't a heck of a lot different for Mount Union than let's say 2009-2013/14.  It sounds different in here mostly because you're comfortable criticizing and nitpicking the current HC in a way that you wouldn't dare nitpick the HC back then. 

[WRMUalum13]

Don't think Mount is down?  Nearly every "expert" picked Mount to disappoint and picked teams such as Salisbury or CMU to beat them lol

Three of seven panelists picked Salisbury.  Nobody picked Mount Union to lose to CMU or JCU or JHU.  I'm sorry that this doesn't fit the narrative you're desperately trying to paint. 

I'll reiterate that on the surface, this current 5-year stretch isn't a heck of a lot different for Mount Union than let's say 2009-2013/14.  It sounds different in here mostly because you're comfortable criticizing and nitpicking the current HC in a way that you wouldn't dare nitpick the HC back then. 

Eh not sure that comp is all that similar. 2009 to 2014 Mount played in every Stagg Bowl and won in 2012, only 3 years from their 2008 win.

This 5 year run includes only 2 title game appearances, a semi finals loss and a second round loss but most importantly we're in the midst of biggest gap between titles since the run started in 1993. If we go back to 2019 we get another 2nd round loss (but it should have been a semi final loss... the committee botched that bracket)

[crufootball]

Don't think Mount is down?  Nearly every "expert" picked Mount to disappoint and picked teams such as Salisbury or CMU to beat them lol

Three of seven panelists picked Salisbury.  Nobody picked Mount Union to lose to CMU or JCU or JHU.  I'm sorry that this doesn't fit the narrative you're desperately trying to paint. 

I'll reiterate that on the surface, this current 5-year stretch isn't a heck of a lot different for Mount Union than let's say 2009-2013/14.  It sounds different in here mostly because you're comfortable criticizing and nitpicking the current HC in a way that you wouldn't dare nitpick the HC back then. 

Eh not sure that comp is all that similar. 2009 to 2014 Mount played in every Stagg Bowl and won in 2012, only 3 years from their 2008 win.

This 5 year run includes only 2 title game appearances, a semi finals loss and a second round loss but most importantly we're in the midst of biggest gap between titles since the run started in 1993. If we go back to 2019 we get another 2nd round loss (but it should have been a semi final loss... the committee botched that bracket)

They may have played in every Stagg Bowl but to use D3fanboy's logic who did you really beat?

In 2009, you beat Wesley in the semi's and you lost to UWW in the Stagg.
In 2010, Bethel was the semi-final opponent and you lost to UWW in the Stagg.
In 2011, you beat Wesley in the semi's and you lost to UWW in the Stagg.
In 2012, you did win it all but beat UMHB and St. Thomas neither of which had a won a Stagg Bowl at the time.
In 2013, you had very close games against Wesley in the quarters, NCC in the semi's and lost to UWW in the Stagg.
In 2014, you beat Wesley in the semi's and you lost to UWW in the Stagg.

That was a run 99% of D3 teams would love to have but if the measuring stick is having to beat Stagg Bowl worthy teams on the way to a National Championship then it wasn't much better.

[WRMUalum13]

Don't think Mount is down?  Nearly every "expert" picked Mount to disappoint and picked teams such as Salisbury or CMU to beat them lol

Three of seven panelists picked Salisbury.  Nobody picked Mount Union to lose to CMU or JCU or JHU.  I'm sorry that this doesn't fit the narrative you're desperately trying to paint. 

I'll reiterate that on the surface, this current 5-year stretch isn't a heck of a lot different for Mount Union than let's say 2009-2013/14.  It sounds different in here mostly because you're comfortable criticizing and nitpicking the current HC in a way that you wouldn't dare nitpick the HC back then. 

Eh not sure that comp is all that similar. 2009 to 2014 Mount played in every Stagg Bowl and won in 2012, only 3 years from their 2008 win.

This 5 year run includes only 2 title game appearances, a semi finals loss and a second round loss but most importantly we're in the midst of biggest gap between titles since the run started in 1993. If we go back to 2019 we get another 2nd round loss (but it should have been a semi final loss... the committee botched that bracket)

They may have played in every Stagg Bowl but to use D3fanboy's logic who did you really beat?

In 2009, you beat Wesley in the semi's and you lost to UWW in the Stagg.
In 2010, Bethel was the semi-final opponent and you lost to UWW in the Stagg.
In 2011, you beat Wesley in the semi's and you lost to UWW in the Stagg.
In 2012, you did win it all but beat UMHB and St. Thomas neither of which had a won a Stagg Bowl at the time.
In 2013, you had very close games against Wesley in the quarters, NCC in the semi's and lost to UWW in the Stagg.
In 2014, you beat Wesley in the semi's and you lost to UWW in the Stagg.

That was a run 99% of D3 teams would love to have but if the measuring stick is having to beat Stagg Bowl worthy teams on the way to a National Championship then it wasn't much better.

I don't subscribe to fanboys logic,, I just know I prefer championships and title game appearances to the alternative.