FB: Ohio Athletic Conference

[jdean]

Sorry, but I still don't think Jorris is getting the recognition he deserves.

And what recognition does a first year starter deserve? We'll see what the coaches think when the OAC announces the All-OAC. My guess is Jorris might get Honorable Mention with Pentello on the 1st team.

[HScoach]

I agree with Jdean on the Jorris thing (wow, was that hard to type ).   

Pentello - 1
Phillips - 2
Jorris -3

[e_lee]

I am with JK.  I do not think that Cap will get in at 8-2.  However, like rp, I think they deserve to be in(provided they beat Wilmington).  They are on a five game win streak and beat the other 8-2 teams head to head(I think that has been mentioned, not sure). 

Looking forward to making the drive to Columbus on Friday morning.  I may consider sticking around to watch Selection Sunday.

Playoffs or no playoffs it has been a good season for Cap so far.  Again I echo JK's sentiments. "F***ing Otterbein!!"

[smedindy]

I think the only way an second OAC team gets in is if there is an upset. I think these teams are ahead of any 2-loss team:

UMHB
Central
St. John Fisher
Concordia  - Moorhead
North Central
Hobart
Cal Lutheran

(Of course, DePauw would be ahead of Cal Lutheran, but they'll have 2 losses for sure after Saturday!!)

[rp]

"This is where I think the misunderstanding lies.  This isn't about whether or not another team from the OAC should get in (the argument can be made that all three teams should be in), it's whether or not they will get in"

Toph, you are wrong. THAT IS THE ARGUMENT/POINT I WAS TRYING TO MAKE!!!  All three teams don't deserve to be in, only Capital!!  Did you not read what I was writing?

It is not about whether Capital is going to get in. Re-read my posts.  My arguement was never about whether a two loss team from the OAC team will/will not get in, as I stated, "To be honest, I would love to see Cap go to the playoffs.  I don't know if it will happen..  if it does, great!!!  If not, that one loss to Otterbein really hurts..  Basically, whatever happens, happens.."..That is my exact statement.

My arguement was simply stating that "if" a two loss team would happen to get picked, Capital should be the pick, and I gave my reasons.  That was the point of the entire converstation!!!

Furthermore, I don't appreciate you putting words in my mouth..  If you are going to reply to my posts, that is fine, I love to share opinions and argue, but don't post things that are not true..  I would like you to cut and paste where I claimed, "Phillips is terrible."  Never did I say he was terrible.. as a matter of fact, I believe I even said he scrambled well and had nice touch. 

I think you need to actually read my posts and understand what I am saying instead of putting your own spin on things.  I never said Phillips was terrible and I never said Capital should go and/or deserves the playoffs...  However if a second place team in the OAC would happen to get picked, I think it should be Cap.

The misunderstanding is you.

[rp]

Toph,

Also, to answer your question, NO, Otterbein shouldn't get in they playoffs just because they beat Capital, because Otterbein has three losses.  Although Otterbein was better than Capital that day, they apparently weren't better than 3 other teams this season.  Therefore, a tie breaker doesn't even come into play for those two teams.  Capital has two losses, Otterbein has three. 

If Otterbein had only two losses, than yes, they deserve the pick, because they would have beat'n Capital in head to head.

I used the Big Ten analogy because it seemed like the simplest explination.

Can somebody help me out here.  Is it that hard to understand how one could pick Capital.  "If" and only "if" another team from the OAC was picked, wouldn't Capital be the likely choice because of the head to head against ONU/JCU?

[pios]

Capital at 8-2 has the advantage with wins over JCU and ONU but that Otterbein loss will haunt them.  I'll take nothing away from Otterbein, they've had a great year but that was a bit of a fluke win for them.  

I guess five fumbles in the second half by Capital makes this a fluke win for Otterbein.  I saw the Otterbein game last year when it took Cap a last minute TD drive to pull out the victory.  This year however, they weren't as fortunate.  When you have that many turnovers, you shouldn't win.  The Cap and Ott game is always tough and I personally would not call this year's win a fluke, but that is my opinion.  At the end of the season there are a ton of should have, could have, and would have's and JCU, ONU and CAP fans (or so it seems from the posts) are all expecting a win this weekend and already looking at the what if's.  Well, what if two of the teams lose this weekend, then there would be a clear cut second place team with a better argument.  The season isn't over.  Unfortunately if they all three win, I don't think any of the 3 8-2 teams get in because there is no clear cut team that is that much more deserving than the others.  Great arguments can be made in favor of all three teams, and if an unbiased person from the OAC, such as myself, would have a hard time choosing one, how could an NCAA committee reach an agreement to send one.  I just think that in the end all three will be sitting at home watching.  I would like to see any one of the three get in and make a run for the Stagg.

[jdean]

I agree with Jdean on the Jorris thing (wow, was that hard to type ).   

I'll consider this your annual "your an idiot" post. 

[theotherpurple]

Will the commitee take into consideration the back to back head to head wins for Cap over JCU and ONU, and will they take into consideration their regional rankings?  If they are having a difficult time choosing which second place OAC team to take (if they would consider it), would these things come into play?

[onyxrook]

Will the commitee take into consideration the back to back head to head wins for Cap over JCU and ONU, and will they take into consideration their regional rankings?  If they are having a difficult time choosing which second place OAC team to take (if they would consider it), would these things come into play?

Yes, they would. It however, is a mute point.  8-2 simply won't get in.  There are too many other teams to be considered.  If the losses came to two automatic qualifiers (and probably undefeated ones at that), I think the case could still be argued but it doesn't exist as such. 

I think the OAC is turning into another WIAC, where top to bottom most any team really can win.  Gone is the Cleveland area dominance.  It doesn't bode well for our playoff scenarios either since we'll probably end up with many more years of praying for muli-loss teams to get in

[cufan]

The Otterbein game is not only a killer for a playoff spot but Cap would be co OAC champs with MU.  The tough part is Cap is playing as well as anyone right now.....the defense has been playing lights out and O'Reily has allowed Caps offense to eat up the clock and give the D a break. 

Who knows what will happen on Sunday but who would of thought we would be having this discussion 5 or 6 years ago. 

[JK]

Again, I say take this for what it is worth...

Based on that conversation that I had with coach Welsh and his wife, it seems the OAC commissioner also seems to think that Capital is more deserving of the playoffs than either JCU or ONU...

[joelmama]

Let me chime in here.

According to the last analysis done here by Pat and his staff there were 7 pool c places up for consideration not yet taken.

Without upset losses

MHB St. John Fisher and North Central are in:

That leaves four:

If Depauw beats Wabash they are in with one loss.
If RPI beats Union then RPI gets the A bid and Hobart and Union both have one loss and at least one of them would get in.  If Union wins RPI is out and Hobart is a maybe with one loss but in any event likely to be evaluated higher than any of the 3 2 loss OAC teams.

Thus we are probably down to two bids.

Huntingdo only has one loss but they haven't  beat anyone with a winning record.  I would guerss that may leave them behind.  All of the Wisconsin teams beat each other up and none is likely to be ahead of JCU, ONU or CAP.  There are however a good sized handfull of two loss teams that would be thrown into the mix as being relatively equal with these three.  If there really is two berths available for 2 loss teams then I think one will go to an OAC team.  My guess as to who is highest on the list.  Just look at the regional rankings.  I think that would be CAP.

[JK]

Here it is...

Take these comments for what they are worth: Coach Welsh's wife said to me today that in a conversation that he (Cap AD Welsh) had with OAC Commissioner Tim Gleason, the commish says the same tiebreakers would apply to second place if it meant a playoff bid and that he (Gleason) thinks that the second place OAC team will get in.  What does that mean?  According to some further explaination it means that while the "Official" OAC records will show a three way tie for second, Capital, since they hold the head to head would be the team the Commish will push for a pool C bid, and again, he feels that with the expanded playoffs the second place OAC team will get in.

Pat,

I know you cited this in a reply soon after I posted.  Basically you said something to the effect that the OAC commissioner didn't have a clue as to what the tiebreaker is for, etc...

I didn't get that at all from the conversation.  Basically what I understood was that Mr. Gleason, who has been the commish of the OAC for a long time and thus I am sure understands the playoff selection process better than you or I put together, feels that the OAC #2 will get CONSIDERATION.  I also gathered that if someone on the selection committee, whom I am sure he knows several of them, asks his opinion of who, of the three 8-2 OAC teams tied for second, is the better of the three and should get MORE consideration, he will answer Capital based on the head to head.

That is all I gathered from those statements, not that the OAC is clueless...

[4u]

Toph,
As for your "shooting holes in rp's argument", I am not seeing too many victories for you.  Further, your attempt to put Otterbein into the mix (or take Capital out of it) based on an early season game is poor.  What I am troubled by is the fact that I can almost hear the whine of your voice in your posts.  I understand that you work for WUJC and attend Carroll but your blatant bias does not serve you well.  As someone who may aspire to work in broadcasting, I suggest you work on your impartiality.  I am a JCU alum and proud fan but have chosen on more than one occasion (this past Saturday included) to listen to the broadcast of JCU's games on the opponents network.  Although some of your posts seem well thought out, I am more often than not disappointed.  If you choose to be on here as a fan, be a fan.  Fandom does not include pointing out that you will be broadcasting the game.  If you want to be on here as the person who broadcasts the game, show a little more understanding.  You should follow Ric's example.  That would be a valuable (and free) lesson,
4u