FB: Presidents' Athletic Conference

[Bob.Gregg]

WJ68, that's very true. 
That was CMU's choice following the 1989 season.
And, following that choice, W&J went to the NCAA in 20 of the next 25 seasons.
CMU took nearly 20 years to make it after that choice.

W&J has now won six of the last seven between the two, however long it's been.
And, to be fair, CMU is the ONLY current PAC member who has played W&J more than a dozen times and holds a winning record against them.

[ExTartanPlayer]

Outstanding game in Washington today (yesterday, by now...)

I'll post more of a recap later, after I get some sleep.  Really an outstanding Division III football game, even with both teams just about out of the title picture having already lost to Thomas More...both teams absolutely left it all out there.  The game had it all - big momentum swings, key special teams plays...just an all around fantastic game.

[WashJeff68]

Saw some pictures on FB from yesterday's homecomimg activites. Roger Goodell took some time to come back for his 35th class reunion.

[E.115]

Saw some pictures on FB from yesterday's homecomimg activites. Roger Goodell took some time to come back for his 35th class reunion.

Just read your post and very cool.  I didn't realize Goodell went to W & J.

[ExTartanPlayer]

We are really set up for an interesting stretch run, are we not?  Here's how I'd rank the teams today:

1) Thomas More has run the gauntlet and looks well-positioned to finish undefeated in league play.

2) Case Western is undefeated and largely untested to date.  Last year they were in this position also and certainly showed very well, beating W&J before falling in a very close one vs. Thomas More, then losing a shootout to Carnegie Mellon in the Academic Bowl.  As we've been saying all along, the possibility does exist for a pair of undefeated teams in league play...however, our 4th and 5th teams might have something to say about that yet.

3) W&J survived a test from Bethany last night...I don't really have a good explanation for that one other than possible malaise.  Bethany does have some good athletes, but having seen both teams live against CMU, that should have been a blowout win for the Presidents, or at least a comfortable shootout victory instead of a one-point win.

4) Westminster is in a nice spot at 5-1 with three games coming up against the other quality teams: W&J, @CMU, CWRU.  Sweeping all three of those would actually give them an outside shot at a playoff berth...the Titans made major progress last year, this is a chance to really establish themselves firmly as a top-tier league contender.

5) Carnegie Mellon is at 3-3 with three very close losses to three very good teams (overtime vs. 5-1 SAA leader WashU; 20-16 against Thomas More; overtime against W&J).  I look for the Tartans to nose their way over the .500 mark next week vs. Thiel, then they'll have a pair of very interesting games with Westminster and Case Western.  Similar comment to Westminster: really nice season last year, need to capture at least one of the CWRU or Westminster games to establish that they firmly belong in the "top echelon" of the league.

As I posted on the Pool C board earlier today, the TMC / CWRU situation creates some intrigue with all of the down-ballot games, so to speak.  I can't totally parse it out just yet but any result between W&J  / Westminster / CMU has the potential to matter, as well as games for the rest of those teams (i.e. it would have helped Case greatly if Bethany actually beat W&J, because right now the biggest problem Case will have is the possibility that W&J finishes alone in third place in the league; if that happens, by my reading of ADL70's tiebreaker rule post, I think TMC gets the tiebreaker by virtue of being 1-0 against the third-place team while Case will be 0-0.  Similarly, it would have helped Case if CMU had beaten W&J).

That's pretty clearly the top echelon of the league.  Beneath that there's a pretty big step down...

6) St. Vincent is probably the best of the rest, but with two decisive losses against Case and Westminster, I don't think they are a serious threat to TMC or W&J in the next two weeks.  However, they certainly have a chance to make their statement and prove they belong in that discussion with the top five teams above.

7) Waynesburg has rebounded a little from last year's disappointment, but still remains well below the program standard.  Didn't even stay close in the games against the league's top dogs, and eked out close wins against GCC and Geneva.  Gotta beat Thiel and St. Vincent if they want to show genuine progress this season.

8) Geneva has a pair of wins...I hadn't paid much attention to this team until I watched some of the stream against CMU last night.  Really weird team offensively.  I love the triple option offense, but it seems like they have nothing else to turn to (how do you lose a relatively competitive / close game, 29-10, that was 17-10 in the third quarter...without any sort of passing game to turn to in the fourth quarter?  The lead grew to 20-10 and then 27-10 and Geneva, who only had about 100 yards of total offense in the entire game, still had to stay with the triple option! Just a strange game).

9) Thiel seems to have made some progress from last year.  They're scoring some points, and they've been much more competitive this year than most of last season.  Should have a chance for at least 2 more wins.

10) Bethany is a high-ceiling, low-floor team.  I'll never be able to figure out how these guys can take W&J to the wire in the same season that they lost to both Geneva and Thiel.  Lots of athletes, lots of offense, terrible discipline, no defense.

11) Grove City is still in the basement for now.  Defense can't stop anybody.  They will have their best chance(s) for a win in the last three games.

[E.115]

I've been happy to see Coach Debs focused more on letting younger players play than trying add extra scores once the game in solidified.

Check out the box scores these past two games for the 4th quarter:

SCORING                                 1    2     3    4   FINAL
Thiel (2-4)                               3     6    6    6    21
Case Western Reserve (6-0)     13   14   21   0   48


SCORING                                 1   2   3   4   FINAL
Case Western Reserve (5-0)     7   13   17 0    37
Bethany (1-5)                         7    0    0   7    14

I don't believe Cuda has played in the 4th quarter either of the past two games.  Interesting to note, freshman QB Julian Kinard has played in all six games this season, alongside other young prospects on both defense and offense.

On that note, I'm looking forward to how Case Western Reserve responds in these last four games, which will test the starters for four quarters. 

The week eight matchup against 1-loss Washington University at St. Louis is beginning to look increasingly interesting.

[E.115]

Case Western Reserve feature by Joe Sager...injuries have definitely been a bummer:

New look for CWRU, but strong results

Case Western Reserve is right where it wants to be at this point in the season – unbeaten and tied atop the PAC standings with Thomas More.

LINK http://www.d3football.com/columns/around-the-region/greatlakes/2016/new-look-strong-results-case-western-reserve

[ExTartanPlayer]

The week eight matchup against 1-loss Washington University at St. Louis is beginning to look increasingly interesting.

Yes, but it's actually the least important game remaining for CWRU.  Spartans will have to beat CMU and Westminster to secure a share of the PAC title.  And, make no mistake, those teams are every bit as dangerous as WashU.

Although...winning the WashU game would be a critical piece of an at-large resume if TMC would win the tiebreaker (it's hard to imagine an undefeated team ever being left out in Pool C; but a 9-1 CWRU with zero wins over regionally-ranked opponents would be very vulnerable).  10-0 matters, and holding a win against a regionally-ranked WashU team would be a nice thing to have in your back pocket.  Which means that you need WashU to otherwise run the table and share/win the SAA title, too.

[SaintsFAN]

The week eight matchup against 1-loss Washington University at St. Louis is beginning to look increasingly interesting.

Yes, but it's actually the least important game remaining for CWRU.  Spartans will have to beat CMU and Westminster to secure a share of the PAC title.  And, make no mistake, those teams are every bit as dangerous as WashU.

Although...winning the WashU game would be a critical piece of an at-large resume if TMC would win the tiebreaker (it's hard to imagine an undefeated team ever being left out in Pool C; but a 9-1 CWRU with zero wins over regionally-ranked opponents would be very vulnerable).  10-0 matters, and holding a win against a regionally-ranked WashU team would be a nice thing to have in your back pocket.  Which means that you need WashU to otherwise run the table and share/win the SAA title, too.

This. 

Question for EXTP or Pat - has there ever been a 10-0 non auto qualifier?  I don't think its happened in the D3 era.

[jknezek]

The week eight matchup against 1-loss Washington University at St. Louis is beginning to look increasingly interesting.

Yes, but it's actually the least important game remaining for CWRU.  Spartans will have to beat CMU and Westminster to secure a share of the PAC title.  And, make no mistake, those teams are every bit as dangerous as WashU.

Although...winning the WashU game would be a critical piece of an at-large resume if TMC would win the tiebreaker (it's hard to imagine an undefeated team ever being left out in Pool C; but a 9-1 CWRU with zero wins over regionally-ranked opponents would be very vulnerable).  10-0 matters, and holding a win against a regionally-ranked WashU team would be a nice thing to have in your back pocket.  Which means that you need WashU to otherwise run the table and share/win the SAA title, too.

This. 

Question for EXTP or Pat - has there ever been a 10-0 non auto qualifier?  I don't think its happened in the D3 era.

I think we looked at this a few years ago when Centre went 10-0 against a very weak schedule and decided it hadn't happened.

[wally_wabash]

The week eight matchup against 1-loss Washington University at St. Louis is beginning to look increasingly interesting.

Yes, but it's actually the least important game remaining for CWRU.  Spartans will have to beat CMU and Westminster to secure a share of the PAC title.  And, make no mistake, those teams are every bit as dangerous as WashU.

Although...winning the WashU game would be a critical piece of an at-large resume if TMC would win the tiebreaker (it's hard to imagine an undefeated team ever being left out in Pool C; but a 9-1 CWRU with zero wins over regionally-ranked opponents would be very vulnerable).  10-0 matters, and holding a win against a regionally-ranked WashU team would be a nice thing to have in your back pocket.  Which means that you need WashU to otherwise run the table and share/win the SAA title, too.

This. 

Question for EXTP or Pat - has there ever been a 10-0 non auto qualifier?  I don't think its happened in the D3 era.

Not that I'm aware of.  Certainly plenty of 10-0 non AQs that have come from non-qualifying leagues (as was the case with Centre and the SAA a few years ago) or independents (Wesley, a bunch of times).  A 10-0 Pool A conference co-champion isn't a thing that I recall having ever happened. 

@ WashU, @ Westminster, vs. CMU is a tough stretch to end on.  CWRU isn't anywhere close to in the barn yet. 

[SaintsFAN]

45-7 Thomas More leads SVC with 6:58 left.  Time for the reserves. 

Very good win at SVC after the close game last year, which was also at SVC.

[WashJeff68]

Watched most of the Westminster/W&J game. W&J won two very close games in a row. No magic today. Westminster shut down W&J's offense with six sacks, limited W&J's ground game to 71 yards and intercepted Coughlin three times. W&J's defense kept them in the game but gave up 233 yards rushing and 337 total yards.. Westminster improves their record versus W&J to 3-32 lifetime.

Spent some time on Westminster's web site. They have improved dramatically under coach Scott Benzel and I predict if he sticks around they will become a force not only in the PAC but regionally and perhaps even nationally. They have 128 on their roster of whom 85 are freshmen. They have 24 players from Florida alone and are recruiting heavily in the DC area and who knows where else. I can see CWRU and CMU having broad based recruiting because they are larger schools with a national footprint but I'm not aware of any other PAC school that compares with Westminster when it comes to recruiting geography.  Even Thomas More sticks pretty close to home.

So the PAC has evolved from years of domination by one school, a period where there were two schools dominating, to today where their are 5 quality programs in the conference. Life in the PAC could get very interesting going forward.

Westminster has CMU and CWRU coming up. As Ex Tartan said, both are in for a real test. W&J needs one more win to have it's 33rd consecutive winning season. They finish with St Vincent, Geneva and Waynesburg so it looks like they will continue the streak. I'm sure Sirianni and his staff will will get them motivated every week.

[SpartanMom_2016]

What is the south Florida connection?  Westminster has a bunch of kids from around Miami and Fort Lauderdale including American Heritage (my kids school).  One of the Westminster freshmen was a team mate of my younger two sons (lacrosse).  Other than Walter I don't know any of the other Westminster players but some pretty good players come out of this area. 

I am surprised to see so many FL on a D3 roster.  So many kids around here have a D1 or bust attitude.  It could mean good things of Westminster's future. 

[ADL70]

Nail biter in Cleveland.  Geneva controlled the ball and throttled Burke's rushing. Spartan D had a CB playing S and another playing OLB, don't know if from injury, or best personnel to defense the triple option, GTs took opening KO and drove 75 yds on 15 plays in 8:48, but didn't score again until the closing minutes.

Cuda was limited to short passes by 22 mph winds.

PAC Commish was interviewed during the broadcast and said that coaches voted before the season and tie first breaker is "W/L % of teams you beat."  Assuming he meant conf w/l, all you have to look at is the team you didn't play. If CWRU and TMC win out, and W&J has better record than Geneva, then TMC gets AQ,  if Geneva, then CWRU gets AQ.