FB: Presidents' Athletic Conference

Cleveland Cartel · September 06, 2006, 11:07:13 PM

Pat

Answer the question on how Whitworth moved ahead.

The forum doesnt care that our rival was beat by Salisbury or that Waynesburg was smoked by Wesley. How would the PAC not faring well effect the standings with a Thiel victory as compared to a Whitworth Team who was idle.

Thiel beat a team and Whitworth was idle and they moved up by a "Small Slice"

If we are being narrow minded Pat, Refresh us on why Thiel is where they are now and how Whitworth is in the 25th spot.

Pat Coleman · September 06, 2006, 11:10:07 PM

I already told you.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on September 06, 2006, 10:59:17 PM
Why Trinity and Whitworth? Those were the teams right behind Thiel in the preseason poll. And RIGHT behind Thiel -- by a total of eight points, less than one-third a spot for each voter!

There -- since you apparently missed it.

Cleveland Cartel · September 06, 2006, 11:11:51 PM

Pat,

Your orginal post:

quote]Guess you didn't look at who passed Thiel. I think those teams had a better week.[/quote]

You can look at the math and the particulars into the voting process, but with all aspects aside look at who had a better week:

Thiel vs Whitworth....

Thiel with a victory had a productive week. It came out of week 1 with a victory.

Whitworth being idle did not have a better week than a team with a victory.

Thiel had a better week. Answer to your first statement.

Pat Coleman · September 06, 2006, 11:13:19 PM

Well, the voters don't agree with you. That's your opinion. The collective opinion disagrees. Not every win is a good win.

Cleveland Cartel · September 06, 2006, 11:15:16 PM

Pat,

Look at this from an outsider view, and not with all the knowledge you have.

A Thiel Victory is better than a team who went idle.

A thiel Loss would be worse than a team who was idle

Pat Coleman · September 06, 2006, 11:16:21 PM

Ehh, no thanks. Not going to dumb things down. This is why our poll is better than the coaches' poll, week in and week out.

Cleveland Cartel · September 06, 2006, 11:22:02 PM

Pat,

Stop being a voter for 2 minutes and look at the head to head stats.

Pat Coleman · September 06, 2006, 11:46:40 PM

You're treating it like it's black and white. This is why they are called rankings, and those other things that are based solely on win/loss records are called standings.

roocru · September 06, 2006, 11:54:40 PM

Cleveland, I have very seldom taken a poster to task in my six years on this board, but you have riled me up.

Quote from: Cleveland Cartel on September 06, 2006, 11:15:16 PM
Pat,

Look at this from an outsider view, and not with all the knowledge you have.

Cleveland, This quote sums up your argument. You are saying that Pat should ignore his superior knowledge of D3 football and agree with your less knowledgeable and biased arguments. I went back and read all 199 of your posts and you have been on this gig about Thiel not getting the respect they desrve for a long while now. Why don't you give it up? Anyone can see that you are picking selected facts which you think support your side of the argument and are ignoring anything that does not support your side. Asking Pat to give up being the analyst and look at it from your side? Why should he do that?

Pat and I have disagreed at times but I have said my piece and let it go. You are acting like someone who figures if they argue long enough or say it enough times, it will become true. Let the season play out and don't sweat the small stuff.

Pat Coleman · September 07, 2006, 12:12:31 AM

Unfortunately, not the first argument he's had over rankings. Last year he tried to call the NCAA's quality of wins ranking OUR ranking, even though it clearly says on the quality of wins page that it's the NCAA's formula.

He also tried to take me to task for thinking Central would win the IIAC (not sure what his connection was). But I was right on that too.

Lots of smoke, very little fire.

roocru · September 07, 2006, 12:43:54 AM

Cleveland,

I received your personal message. In it you privately accuse me of having too much time on my hands and then make the same arguments all over again to me. I have played D3 college football, I have been a Texas High School Football Coach for twenty years, and an Athletic Director in Texas for fifteen more. My teams have won a state championship and have had to win the last game to keep from being o-fer. My son's team at UMHB lost out on a playoff spot on a very close call due to the rankings of the NCAA and most people felt they got screwed. They made up for it by playing Linfield in the Finals in Salem the next year. Actions speak louder than words. As the Linfield faithful are prone to say "Leave no doubt". Win by more than 7 and you don't have to worry about the things you seem obsessed with.

I guess I might be getting set in my ways, but your arguments remind me of those parents I have dealt with throughout my career who demand to know why their son/daughter is not getting playing time or starting and then refuse to listen to my explanations and just think I am biased against their kid for some reason. I am beginning to think you would argue with a fence post.

I have made my statement , I have backed it up with my evidence, including your own past posts, and like I suggested to you I am now going to let it go and let the other posters make up their own minds. You will not hear from me regarding this issue again.

AUPepBand · September 07, 2006, 09:19:52 AM

CC: You coming to Alfred for the game? Anyone from Thiel coming to Alfred?
After all, Alfred isn't the end of the world....although we can see it from here.

PittTBCW · September 07, 2006, 01:37:40 PM

CC, PAT, and ROO,

Great point of views by all of you. CC I agree with you that Thiel should not have dropped out. However, I agree with Pat and ROO's points as well. If Thiel is victorious this week and the following week they will get their respect and break back into the Top 25. If you look at D1 rankings over the years you see teams ranked all over it the first week and drop out after the first week. Heck you even see teams drop out or move before a game is played. What is great that D3 settles it on the field. If their ranked or not ranked they can still get in the playoffs which is different from D1.

Predictions tommorrow

OldPhart · September 07, 2006, 07:05:30 PM

While I agree with Pat "not every win is a good win" it is my view that Thiel's win over Geneva was a good win. When I voted in the "how will Thiel start the season poll" - I thought that Thiel would be 2-1 with the most LIKELY loss being to Geneva. I imagine that voters don't follow NAIA and may be less impressed than I am with the win.

But enough of Thiel. Any thoughts as to the Allegheny/W&J contest? While D3football poll voters (at this point) think it more likely for W&J to break its losing streak of 2 games than for W&J to to replace Pluto as the ninth planet - the voters favor this outcome by a mere 39 percentage points. Since Sirianni's tenure this board has not been graced with the entertaining musings

(I was trying to find the vomit emoticon) of W&J advocates expounding upon tizzles, fushizzles, rizzles, bedizzles and other "izzledom" that was popular in the smack talk days gone by. However, I am curious as to how those that follow the Presidents seriously think about the visit from the Gator's this weekend.

Reading the NCAC pick'em board Gheny is a 9.5 point dog to W&J. At this point I think W&J will cover the spread - especially with this game being under the lights at Cameron Stadium. The NCAC faithful - while not outright picking Allegheny to win - seems to be picking Allegheny to beat the spread at a 2-1 rate! I recognize that there may be some bias on the part of the pickers to pick the NCAC team - but I was surprised that the Gator's romp over an arguably weakened Westminster (loss of 11 starters from last year) last week would be enough to push more to Allegheny's side against a 9.5 point spread.

Any thoughts as to the President's chances?

Wes Mantooth · September 07, 2006, 07:21:25 PM

THIEL FANS CRYING ALREADY. CALM DOWN ITS WEEK ONE

Thiel fans you have a solid team which will go to the playoffs. In regards to that #24 Trinity is a way better team than Thiel as for Whitworth i am not familiar with them. I have however witnessed and been on the other end of Texas but whuppins @ W&J and they are far and away superior to teams in the great state of PA. Also plain and simple the NAIA stinks and is basically a glorified D3. Congrats to Thiel on their First game more than i can say for my alma mater.

Now for Predicitons.

Thiel -24 @ AU- 21

A battle that is won in the trenches. Thiel has the advantage in the trenches and in the backfield as Minton runs for 120 and two td's as Blankenship struggles again.

CMU - 31 @ GCC- 17
Wing T battle that CMU cruises in , as they run it alot better than GCC with their 250 pound wing backs with no speed.

Hiram 14 @ Bethany - 17

ANother ho hummer where no one cares. Bethany finally wins though.

Wooster - 28@ Waynesburgh- 17

Close battle where the jackets give the scots all they can handle. Qb play is the difference and Schafer is the difference as he throws for 2 tds and runs one in. Abels gets on track with 140 yds and two scores.

And now for the match up of the week.

Allegheny- 21 @ W&J - 24

W&J is soft and that is sad. Word is their manhood has been taken in the Mount Union Scrimmage and in the Salisbury game. Allegheny will test them with physical play and a solid running of Tarquinio. I look for W&J to bounce back and for Swallow to throw a lot against the Gators as there run D is solid. I do not think the gators are as good a team as Salisbury. Dont be surprised if the Gators spring an upset. Sidebotham FG is the difference.

Good Luck to All

GO WJ