FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[shepherd]

If Wheaton doesn't  Monkey Stomp the Bennies then the entire CCIW should be called into question.

Wheaton has more respect than that for every team they face.  This "monkey stomp language is not what d3 is all about.  Its about the "love of the game."

[Dr. Acula]

It's not about respect.  It's about talent.  I would assume a 10-0 CCIW team would have such a talent advantage that a "monkey stomp" of a team like Benedictine would be unavoidable.  It's not that Wheaton would be running it up, it's just that their players are a lot better.  No harm in that.  Just the way it is.

[USee]

I agree that the QB situation is unique and won't likely happen anytime soon but the problem is still, and has been, prevalent. For every year I can remember there have been at least 15 players on the 2nd team all conference list and many years where there are as many as 17 players. 2 Qb's on the 2nd team is a regular occurrence. We even had a few years with 2 first team AC Kickers AND a punter. First team votes have been a little better but the number has been 12-14 players virtually every year. Some of that is a product of multiple formations (2 Rb's vs 1, 3 WR v 2, etc) but there have only every been 5 OL on the field for as long as I can remember yet we have had years with 6 OL as AC players. I think that is the part of the system that seems broken to me.

1. Re: a position like the OL with 5 guys, supposing that two or three guys get the same number of votes for the last position, is it really that crucial to you that the tie be broken so there are exactly 11 players on the first-team offense, exactly 11 players on the second-team offense, and no more?

2. Assuming that it is that important to you (because you wouldn't be posting otherwise) - what's the solution for breaking that tie?  Coaches submit their votes, we find out that Players A, B, C, D, and E are the consensus first-team OL's while players F, G, H are clear second-team choices (i.e. have the next-most votes) and for the last two OL slots, players I, J, K, and L have all received the same number of votes for the last two second-team slots.  Break the tie.  Go.  Let's hear it.

First, I don't think there has to be exactly 11 players on each team. I already conceded that there are multiple formations on offense and defensive structures. For offensive players I assume 5 OL, 2 RB, 1 TE, 1 QB and 3 WR. For defense I would assume 4 DL, 4 LB, 4 DB. That's 12 for each side. That seems reasonable. I think when you take the path of least resistance, which is what appears to be happening, and end up with 17 players on the 2nd team that it weakens the award. The coaches (which is all that matters) don't appear to agree since its been happening for a couple decades.

As for having to break a tie, I assume you are kidding because figuring out how to break a tie is not new to CCIW all conference selections. You certainly can't be presenting the unsolvable conundrum that is holding these coaches back from honoring the best of the best? There are many ways to break ties and these coaches are privy to them (see handbook on how to determine AQ) or  so you must be asking something more germane to the heart of the discussion? Like why does it matter? I am not sure so please clarify. Either way, I don't think tie breaking is rocket science but here are a few ideas on how to break your tie:

A. Each coach ranks the players in the tie 1 through X (like the top 25 poll)
B. Have the conference commissioner cast a vote in case of ties (or better yet, let me do it)
C. Have the head coaches arm wrestle for it
D. Put all the names in a hat and the first 2 drawn get the award
E. Revote using only the schools not involved in the tie.
F. Have all the players hang from a bar and the two who hold on the longest win.

[grboob]

Go Thunder,

You need to lighten up, chill out and remember it really is "just a game"

[HScoach]

Look on the bright side,  the CCIW does it a lot better than the  high school conference I coached in.  The final finish order of the team slotted them to a certain number 1st and 2nd team selections. 
League champs = 8-1st team / 5-2nd team
runner-up = 6-1st team / 4-2nd team
3rd place = 4-1st team / 3-2nd team
etc
etc
all the way down to last place that gets 1 of each.  And then each team gets 3 honorable mention.

So what you end up with is 5 or 6 or 7 of the 8 teams in conference picking their QB and TB as "1st team" since they are the best athletes on the team.    That is beyond dumb!

[Rhythm21]

The Bennies have to know, even if they won't admit it out loud, that they don't have a snowball's chance in hell of winning the Stagg Bowl -- or of even coming anywhere close to it, unless they buy tickets to the game like everybody else. But, hey, they were the team out of the three NACC tri-champions this season that won the automatic bid, and that: a) separates them from fellow tri-champs Wisconsin Lutheran and Lakeland and therefore gives them not only bragging rights but also a leg up on them in recruiting claims; b) gives the Bennies an extra week of practice and an extra game against a really good foe -- and D3 football fans who follow perennial playoff programs all swear up and down that the extra practices and the extra games in November are of great benefit in terms of giving returning players additional experience for next season -- and; c) recognizes and maintains the NACC's status as a D3 qualifying member conference in good standing for football.

Being a follower of the NACC, I appreciate this post thoroughly. We do not have the long, glorious history like the CCIW and what keeps D3 college football competitive and interesting (In my opinion) is the opportunity for programs to rise and build and compete on a national scale. Our conference would never have a chance of improving by recruiting players the caliber of those on CCIW rosters if our coaches told them, "Hey, you can come here and compete for a conference championship for four years. No, you will not compete nationally if you win said conference championships. If you want to make the playoffs, go play in the CCIW." It is a small hope BU has for winning this playoff game, let alone taking a trip to Salem. An AQ is a solid pitch for our coaches to use on the recruiting trail. Well said and great post, Gregory Sager.

[GoPerry]

Nobody should miss the article in Saturday's Wall Street Journal on MIT's Football Team.  "How MIT Engineered a Football Team Out of Scrap".

Here's the link but it might not work if you're not a subscriber to the Online WSJ

http://online.wsj.com/articles/how-players-at-mit-engineered-a-football-team-1416586648

A classic D3 'love-of-the-game' success story I think . . .

[Mugsy]

Nobody should miss the article in Saturday's Wall Street Journal on MIT's Football Team.  "How MIT Engineered a Football Team Out of Scrap".

Here's the link but it might not work if you're not a subscriber to the Online WSJ

http://online.wsj.com/articles/how-players-at-mit-engineered-a-football-team-1416586648

A classic D3 'love-of-the-game' success story I think . . .

There was also a piece/video on NBC news by Brian Williams.

The QB is a studying aerospace engineering -  he is a "rocket scientist"

[iwu70]

Good luck to Wheaton today.  Make the CCIW proud.

Another big game today, actually "The Game" -- Harvard vs. Yale for the Ivy crown.  Both teams pretty good now, this year, at least by Ivy standards.  ISU has a big game today too, vs. SIU, and a chance to win or share the Valley title.  ISU is having a very good season . . . and will surely make the DII  national tourney, likely with a bye week and a game at home @ Hancock in Normal.  Go Redbirds!

Not that it matters to anyone on this board, but I'm cheering for Yale to win over Harvard -- Blue over Crimson.   Go Bulldogs!

IWU70

[Augie6]

Good luck to Wheaton today.  Make the CCIW proud.

Another big game today, actually "The Game" -- Harvard vs. Yale for the Ivy crown.  Both teams pretty good now, this year, at least by Ivy standards.  ISU has a big game today too, vs. SIU, and a chance to win or share the Valley title.  ISU is having a very good season . . . and will surely make the DII  national tourney, likely with a bye week and a game at home @ Hancock in Normal.  Go Redbirds!

Not that it matters to anyone on this board, but I'm cheering for Yale to win over Harvard -- Blue over Crimson.   Go Bulldogs!

IWU70

Actually, ISU will make the DI FCS playoffs, not DII. 

[thunderdog]

Is next week's game vs. John Carrol at home, for sure?  Makes sense to me considering the #2 seed, but I was hearing chatter that the location was yet to be determined.  Can someone confirm?

[Mugsy]

Is next week's game vs. John Carrol at home, for sure?  Makes sense to me considering the #2 seed, but I was hearing chatter that the location was yet to be determined.  Can someone confirm?

It will be at Wheaton.

[HScoach]

Is next week's game vs. John Carrol at home, for sure?  Makes sense to me considering the #2 seed, but I was hearing chatter that the location was yet to be determined.  Can someone confirm?

The game will be a Wheaton, though officially the brainiacs at the NCAA don't seed the teams and won't announce the location until I think  Monday morning.   Never understood the logic behind this.

[USee]

Wheaton 43
Benedictine 14

Wheaton Offense 542 total yards, 325 rushing, 217 passing
JP11 21-29 72% 217 yds 2 TDs 0 INTS, 20 rush 90 yds 1 TD
Luke Thorson 7 catches 111 yds 2 TD's
Danny Puknaitis 18 carries 121 yds
Jesse Geary 70 yds rushing
Dandsdill 8 tackles

Benedictine 315 yds offense, 56 rushing 259 passing
Ryan Keener 22-41-2 54% 259 yds 2 TD's

Thunder led 28-0 and dominated this game the whole way. BU got a big play to get the score to 31-14 and then recovered an onsides kick but a Dornbush INT ended the hopes and the Thunder cruised. 2 Fumbles by Geary today were concerning but Danny Puknaitis had a big day

The Thunder will host mighty OAC #2 John Carroll next Saturday. Glad to get them on the home turf. Wheaton will likely be the underdog at home next Saturday and most won't give them a chance against Mark Myers, the 5th year SR QB who leads a 42 pt per game attack and the #2 ranked defense in the country. The Thunder will have to play very well next Saturday. Should be a fun matchup. Can't wait.

[HScoach]

Not sure about your Wheaton is the underdog statement, but it should be a great game.  Very much looking forward to this matchup.  We've seen enough of Wheaton in Alliance over the years to know they'll be well coached, fundamentally sound and a tough bunch of SOB's.  Wheaton, nor any CCIW team, in my opinion will be an easy out for any team.

JCU when playing well is VERY good.  But they occasionally have a head scratcher like their 17-10 win over ONU.  Very solid overall roster.  Good O-line that protects Myers well.   Active D-line that gave Mount fits last week.  Most of Burke's in completions were throw-aways under heavy pressure.  RB is good, but not national level difference maker.  More of a change-of-pace from the passing game.  Much more balanced this season than last year.

If the weather is dry, should be a good one.