FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[markerickson]

I arrived at the North Park game with the score at 7-7.  So I missed the TD catch by Childress.  What I did see was ZERO attempts to go deep to Childress during my presence and a HORRIBLE job by the referees.  The refs
1. ejected Viking DB Simmons for targeting when he first hit the twisting receiver in the shoulder pad. 
2. missed an obvious intentional grounding by SNC while the QB was under pressure and then on the very next play had to confer before finally calling intentional grounding when it was, again, obvious intentional grounding (maybe they heard me scream).
3. called a phantom pass interference penalty on NPU in deep Viking territory when the ball was clearly uncatchable (I didn't see any contact either).  Coach Conway was furious, and SNC subsequently scored a TD.
4. failed to see SNC's QB's forward progress had clearly been stopped on the fumble NPU returned for a TD.
5. gave SNC an EXTREMELY generous spot (4th and 9, no less) on SNC's final drive and then failed to use the chains to check for a first down.

Finally, on NPU's defensive TD, a ref threw a flag against the SNC sideline for unsportsmanlike behavior.  NPU converted the PAT, but the refs spotted the ball on the ensuing KO at the same yard line as if no penalty had been called.  Those extra yards could have been huge as SNC did a very good job returning kick offs all day long.

[Mr. Ypsi]

St. Norbert 41
North Park 31

A heartbreaking loss for the Vikings, who came back from a 28-10 deficit to take their first lead of the game with 1:45 remaining when the NPU defense stripped the ball out of the hands of the SNC quarterback at the one-yard line and sophomore safety Matt DiFecchio then scored his second defensive TD in as many games by scooping up the fumble and running 99 yards for the go-ahead score. But the Vikings couldn't stop SNC in the final two minutes, as the Green Knights made a huge 4th-and-9 conversion at midfield and ended up taking back the lead, 35-31, on a TD screen pass with 22 seconds remaining. The final touchdown was meaningless, as a T.D. Conway desperation heave on the game's final play was tipped and then picked off and taken to the house.

The Green Knights may play in a lesser league, but they are very good, even by CCIW standards. They sport 33 seniors on their roster, and their huge offensive line gave NPU huge headaches today. The fact that the Vikings were able to come back from that far down and bring the game right down to the wire says a lot for this very young Vikings team.

And, be it noted for the record, SNC's 'lesser' league is the MWC, not the MIAA (and they should finish at or very near the top of the MWC).  For purposes of the MIAA-CCIW challenge, SNC may have been an 'honorary' MIAA member for the day, but contra Kiko, the CCIW won the challenge, 4-3.  Since I have little doubt that NPU would have beaten Calvin by any score their conscience allowed, if the MIAA wants a FULL challenge series, they'll have to get Calvin to put on the pads!   (To match the MIAA's seven, last season we withheld the previous year's champ, NCC; this year we withheld T5th NPU; does that mean that next season we should withhold whoever finishes 8th? )

[kiko]

Call it 4-3 or 4-4 at your discretion; either result does not speak well of the CCIW as a conference that is tough top-to-bottom this year.

[USee]

Call it 4-3 or 4-4 at your discretion; either result does not speak well of the CCIW as a conference that is tough top-to-bottom this year.

Why do you say that? In what way would today's result reflect poorly on the CCIW?

[Mr. Ypsi]

Call it 4-3 or 4-4 at your discretion; either result does not speak well of the CCIW as a conference that is tough top-to-bottom this year.

Why do you say that? In what way would today's result reflect poorly on the CCIW?

By fairly general consensus, the MIAA is a fairly weak conference in football - almost certainly in the lower half, perhaps in the lower third.  On the other hand, as recently as two-three years ago, the CCIW was regarded as top five, but has rapidly slipped towards the bottom of the top ten.  No one doubts that the top of the CCIW is well above the usual top of the MIAA (so NCC's and Wheaton's wipeouts of Trine and Adrian were no surprise, and likewise the wipeout by anomalously injury-plagued usual contender IWU against perennial cellar-contender Alma), but that leaves the CCIW only 1-3 (or 1-4 if you want to count SNC) for everyone else.  That is not a good showing  for the top-to-bottom quality of the conference.

[izzy stradlin]

Call it 4-3 or 4-4 at your discretion; either result does not speak well of the CCIW as a conference that is tough top-to-bottom this year.

Why do you say that? In what way would today's result reflect poorly on the CCIW?

By fairly general consensus, the MIAA is a fairly weak conference in football - almost certainly in the lower half, perhaps in the lower third.  On the other hand, as recently as two-three years ago, the CCIW was regarded as top five, but has rapidly slipped towards the bottom of the top ten.  No one doubts that the top of the CCIW is well above the usual top of the MIAA (so NCC's and Wheaton's wipeouts of Trine and Adrian were no surprise, and likewise the wipeout by anomalously injury-plagued usual contender IWU against perennial cellar-contender Alma), but that leaves the CCIW only 1-3 (or 1-4 if you want to count SNC) for everyone else.  That is not a good showing  for the top-to-bottom quality of the conference.

Agree.  It was just 7 games, but I was hoping the CCIW would do better.

Boy I need this season to start soon.

I was curious about how the D3 conferences predicted strength stacked up (Top to Bottom) vs. the other conferences using the '15 Kickoff Rankings.... Here they are.  (Somewhat interesting)   (Rank -  Conf. - Avg. Team Ranking)

1   WIAC   48.13
2   MIAC   67.67
3   E8        69.56
4   CCIW   81.38
5   IIAC        83.75
6   OAC        90.90
7   NJAC        95.00
8   ODAC     96.13
9   SCAC     99.25
10   CC        100.90
11   NWC    102.13
12   ASC        105.75
13   LL        107.63
14   MAC        111.40
15   SAA        112.33
16   PAC        123.73
17   USAC    123.75
18   MIAA        127.57
19   NESCAC 133.10
20   SCIAC   133.50
21   NCAC    135.10
22   HCAC   149.11
23   MWC   152.67
24   MASCAC  166.44
25   NACC   179.57
26   NEFC   180.25
27   ECFC   213.38
28   UMAC   220.30
29   IND         243.00

Still time to sign up for Kickoff and find out how some these surprising rankings came about.   

The composite Kickoff rankings had the CCIW 4th and MIAA 18th.   Based on the preseason individual team rankings in Kickoff, the CCIW would have been predicted to go 6-1.   Only #97 Olivet was favored of #147 Carthage based on those rankings.   While Wheaton and North Central are probably quite a bit better then every MIAA team, top to bottom, 4-3 was worse than expected. 

[sac]

All of whats been said about the MIAA is mostly true.  However its worth mentioning last year the league was really young and did well,  five teams finished with winning records.  This year they're a year older and also doing well.  2 or 3 through 6 been have really close the last year or two and #7 isn't far behind them.  Its really not the pushover league it was even 3 or 4 years ago, far from good obviously.   Roster numbers seem to up across the league as well.   

I think all 7 programs have reason to feel optimistic about their progress direction in recent years, that's pretty unusual.

[USee]

Wow. You guys are some serious analysts! So, let me see....using the analysis I see here the almighty WIAC went 2-5 last week against the likes of the IIAC, MIAA, and MIAC, all lower (and much lower) ranked conferences. Sorry WIAC, you suck.

The semi-mighty OAC went 3-5 last weekend against the NCAC, HCAC and E8, good night sweet heart the reign is over.

Honestly, there isn't a result I saw today that surprised me. I don't think there was a team that I had favored in a game that ended up losing. MIAA #1 was not competitive with CCIW #1, MIAA #2 struggled against CCIW #5, MIAA #3 struggled mightily against CCIW #8, MIAA #4 (with 1 first place vote) was dismantled by CCIW #2, MIAA #5 lost to CCIW #4, MIAA#6 wins by 3 over CCIW #7. MIAA#7 is destroyed by CCIW #3. What of any of that is surprising?

Today's result doesn't make me feel like the CCIW gained ground on the MIAC, E8 or WIAC, but I certainly don't think we lost ground. This is exactly what I would have expected.

[izzy stradlin]

Wow. You guys are some serious analysts! So, let me see....using the analysis I see here the almighty WIAC went 2-5 last week against the likes of the IIAC, MIAA, and MIAC, all lower (and much lower) ranked conferences. Sorry WIAC, you suck.

The semi-mighty OAC went 3-5 last weekend against the NCAC, HCAC and E8, good night sweet heart the reign is over.

Honestly, there isn't a result I saw today that surprised me. I don't think there was a team that I had favored in a game that ended up losing. MIAA #1 was not competitive with CCIW #1, MIAA #2 struggled against CCIW #5, MIAA #3 struggled mightily against CCIW #8, MIAA #4 (with 1 first place vote) was dismantled by CCIW #2, MIAA #5 lost to CCIW #4, MIAA#6 wins by 3 over CCIW #7. MIAA#7 is destroyed by CCIW #3. What of any of that is surprising?

Today's result doesn't make me feel like the CCIW gained ground on the MIAC, E8 or WIAC, but I certainly don't think we lost ground. This is exactly what I would have expected.

Well, you are obviously know more than the rest of us and could predict what was going to happen.  Just going by the rankings from Pat Coleman et al., along with the other CCIW wins, Augie and Millikin were predicted to win at home and they didn't.  I am not gonna pretend to know more about what is going on in D3fb than the guys who run the site, but that's why I think people were thinking more like 6 wins this weekend. 

Regardless, 4 wins isn't horrible and it comes from a small sample size.  I am pretty sure the CCIW would win by a large number of games if there was a round robin season-long challenge with the MIAA.

[sac]

Wow. You guys are some serious analysts! So, let me see....using the analysis I see here the almighty WIAC went 2-5 last week against the likes of the IIAC, MIAA, and MIAC, all lower (and much lower) ranked conferences. Sorry WIAC, you suck.

The semi-mighty OAC went 3-5 last weekend against the NCAC, HCAC and E8, good night sweet heart the reign is over.

Honestly, there isn't a result I saw today that surprised me. I don't think there was a team that I had favored in a game that ended up losing. MIAA #1 was not competitive with CCIW #1, MIAA #2 struggled against CCIW #5, MIAA #3 struggled mightily against CCIW #8, MIAA #4 (with 1 first place vote) was dismantled by CCIW #2, MIAA #5 lost to CCIW #4, MIAA#6 wins by 3 over CCIW #7. MIAA#7 is destroyed by CCIW #3. What of any of that is surprising?

Today's result doesn't make me feel like the CCIW gained ground on the MIAC, E8 or WIAC, but I certainly don't think we lost ground. This is exactly what I would have expected.

Not sure where your #'s for the CCIW are coming from.  The teams were paired straight down last years standings until you reached IWU/Carthage/Millikin.
http://miaa.org/sports/fball/2014-15/index
http://www.cciw.org/standings.aspx?path=football&standings=42

MIAA #1 vs CCIW #1
MIAA #2t vs CCIW #2
MIAA #2t vs CCIW #3t
MIAA #4t vs CCIW #3t
MIAA #4t vs CCIW #5t
MIAA #6 vs CCIW #8
MIAA #7 vs CCIW #5t

[USee]

Wow. You guys are some serious analysts! So, let me see....using the analysis I see here the almighty WIAC went 2-5 last week against the likes of the IIAC, MIAA, and MIAC, all lower (and much lower) ranked conferences. Sorry WIAC, you suck.

The semi-mighty OAC went 3-5 last weekend against the NCAC, HCAC and E8, good night sweet heart the reign is over.

Honestly, there isn't a result I saw today that surprised me. I don't think there was a team that I had favored in a game that ended up losing. MIAA #1 was not competitive with CCIW #1, MIAA #2 struggled against CCIW #5, MIAA #3 struggled mightily against CCIW #8, MIAA #4 (with 1 first place vote) was dismantled by CCIW #2, MIAA #5 lost to CCIW #4, MIAA#6 wins by 3 over CCIW #7. MIAA#7 is destroyed by CCIW #3. What of any of that is surprising?

Today's result doesn't make me feel like the CCIW gained ground on the MIAC, E8 or WIAC, but I certainly don't think we lost ground. This is exactly what I would have expected.

Not sure where your #'s for the CCIW are coming from.  The teams were paired straight down last years standings until you reached IWU/Carthage/Millikin.
http://miaa.org/sports/fball/2014-15/index
http://www.cciw.org/standings.aspx?path=football&standings=42

MIAA #1 vs CCIW #1
MIAA #2t vs CCIW #2
MIAA #2t vs CCIW #3t
MIAA #4t vs CCIW #3t
MIAA #4t vs CCIW #5t
MIAA #6 vs CCIW #8
MIAA #7 vs CCIW #5t

I took mine from the pre season coaches polls for both leagues. While I have tremendous respect for the work Pat and co. do on D3.com and I think their weekly rankings of the top 40 or so teams is about as reliable as we can get, I am not sure how big their information advantage is when comparing the #147th ranked team to the #115th ranked team. I think there is a huge margin of error there. There aren't 25 voters picking the teams below #40.

So the CCIW went 6-1 last week against the IIAC, NACC, HCAC what does that mean that we went 4-3 this week against the MIAA?  Is there a chance, as SAC suggests, that the MIAA is getting better?

My observation is that the CCIW is vastly improved from top to bottom over last year. Last year we went something like 3-4 in this series and werent' really competitve in the losses. This year we went 4-3 and could easily have gone 7-0. I don't think Saturday's results change the CCIW's place in the world order or give us any information we didn't already have.

[USee]

I would add that if anyone told me Augie was favored over Albion and Millikin was favored over Kzoo before I would have taken the points and the underdogs and bet all the corn in Manito.

#116 Albion beat #28 UWSP last week. #145 Bluffton beat #62 Baldwin Wallace. Do these results predict the demise of the WIAC and OAC?

[Pat Coleman]

I would add that if anyone told me Augie was favored over Albion and Millikin was favored over Kzoo before I would have taken the points and the underdogs and bet all the corn in Manito.

#116 Albion beat #28 UWSP last week. #145 Bluffton beat #62 Baldwin Wallace. Do these results predict the demise of the WIAC and OAC?

Obviously Albion would not have been ranked 116 going into the Augie game.

[USee]

I would add that if anyone told me Augie was favored over Albion and Millikin was favored over Kzoo before I would have taken the points and the underdogs and bet all the corn in Manito.

#116 Albion beat #28 UWSP last week. #145 Bluffton beat #62 Baldwin Wallace. Do these results predict the demise of the WIAC and OAC?

Obviously Albion would not have been ranked 116 going into the Augie game.

Exactly.

[Gregory Sager]

I arrived at the North Park game with the score at 7-7.  So I missed the TD catch by Childress.  What I did see was ZERO attempts to go deep to Childress during my presence

A lot of what the NPU offense does in the passing game is based upon matchups. Dakota Conway and Anthony Burton had what were apparently considered to be the favorable matchups for the vertical game, so that's where T.D. went when the Vikings threw long.

NPU's passing game is very much a share-the-wealth sort of operation. In spite of the phenomenal freshman year that Devin Childress had last season, he's not going to get the ball thrown to him every other play. Dakota Conway and Anthony Burton are going to get a lot of attempts as well, and some of the younger guys like Jordan Turner and Cody Hood will get their fair share, too. Plus, the Vikings are looking more this year to get the ball to RBs like Kvonte Spearman and John Wilkinson via the swing pass, because they have several guys now who have the sort of game-breaker speed that the Vikes haven't had from that position in a long time, and the coaching staff wants them to get the ball in space.

and a HORRIBLE job by the referees.  The refs
1. ejected Viking DB Simmons for targeting when he first hit the twisting receiver in the shoulder pad.

They reviewed it in the press box at halftime, as per NCAA rules, and ascertained that it was not a deliberate targeting attempt by Simmons. He couldn't come back into the game after being ejected, but he won't be suspended.
 

2. missed an obvious intentional grounding by SNC while the QB was under pressure and then on the very next play had to confer before finally calling intentional grounding when it was, again, obvious intentional grounding (maybe they heard me scream).

Well, I heard you from the press box. It's not as though the flag on the second play was a makeup call, either ... as you said, both plays clearly warranted intentional grounding calls.

3. called a phantom pass interference penalty on NPU in deep Viking territory when the ball was clearly uncatchable (I didn't see any contact either).  Coach Conway was furious, and SNC subsequently scored a TD.

Actually, that was the drive in which SNC ended up missing a 30-yard field goal attempt, at the end of the 3rd quarter and the start of the 4th.

I try not to harp too much on the air about bad calls, because I don't want to be that guy ... you know, the homer PBP guy who always goes on about the refs whenever there's a call against his team. Besides, I know that the refs have a difficult job, and they're not going to make the right call every time. But you're right, that particular pass interference call was absolutely egregious. The ball was thrown two yards behind the receiver and was therefore absolutely uncatchable. That's why I initially speculated on the air that it might've been a defensive holding call (even though it didn't appear that there had been any contact at all between receiver and cornerback) before the ref activated his field mic and made the call. It never entered my mind that a pass that was thrown two yards behind a WR cutting across the middle could be DPI. That was one of the worst calls I've seen in years. Fortunately, it didn't cost NPU any points.

4. failed to see SNC's QB's forward progress had clearly been stopped on the fumble NPU returned for a TD.

Jack Becker's forward progress had initially been stopped up the middle on the QB sneak, but then he backed out of the pile and shifted to his right. That's where Joe Butz stripped him and Matt DiFecchio scooped up the ball and started that 99-yard fumble return.

Finally, on NPU's defensive TD, a ref threw a flag against the SNC sideline for unsportsmanlike behavior.  NPU converted the PAT, but the refs spotted the ball on the ensuing KO at the same yard line as if no penalty had been called.  Those extra yards could have been huge as SNC did a very good job returning kick offs all day long.

That wasn't an unsportsmanlike behavior penalty. It was a sideline violation; one or more SNC personnel had crossed the white caution line on the sideline that keeps players and coaches from getting too close to the field of play. I knew immediately what it was, because of where it was thrown (right in front of the SNC bench, where there were absolutely no active players, while DiFecchio was running down the opposite sideline) and because sidelines tend to go nuts on weird plays like that in which someone comes out of a pile with the football and starts running the opposite way with nobody in front of him while some players slow down and/or stop, thinking that the play is over.

Anyway, the first sideline violation is a warning; the second one is a penalty. Since it was SNC's first infraction, the refs gave the Knights a warning. In other words, they made the right call and the NPU kickoff team should not have received any extra yards via penalty.

Lest anyone think that my grousing about the refs is an exercise in excuse-making, I want to make clear that I think SNC earned the victory. The Green Knights outgained NPU by 160 yards, and that was no accident. The O-line of the Green Knights is huge, and it consists of four seniors and a junior. They owned the line of scrimmage against a much smaller and far less experienced Vikings D-line, both in the running game and in the passing game. SNC has two very good running backs, but most of the time they weren't even touched by a North Park defender until they were already well past the first line of defense. Although the Knights executed tremendously on that fatal drive in the game's final minute, a big part of the reason why they scored the go-ahead touchdown was because the NPU defense was absolutely gassed; the 28-yard reception by Brett Olson that took SNC down to the NPU 7 was a simple dump-off in which Olson went through the arms of three diving tacklers, an indication that the Vikes were several steps slower than usual. That's a sure sign of a defense worn down by a power running team.

What made it worse was that the Vikings couldn't get off the field when they should have. On one drive they surrendered a first down when they had SNC in a 3rd and 18. The Green Knights then went on to score a touchdown. On the next drive, the Vikes had SNC in a 3rd and 11. Again, the Knights converted a long gain that moved the chains, and, again, it led to a St. Norbert touchdown. And, of course, the play that spelled disaster for NPU was that 4th and 9 in the game's final minute in which they couldn't get the stop. If you can't get off the field when you're supposed to, you're just making it worse on yourself when the other team's game plan is to wear you down with a huge, experienced line and a very solid 225 lb. running back.

Meanwhile, although the passing game was effective and the NPU O-line kept T.D. Conway clean of St. Norbert fingerprints all day, the Vikings were unable to connect with anything big in the vertical game. And the running game never really got going for the Vikings, although I wish that they hadn't just given up on it altogether in the second half. NPU made that comeback largely on the strength of a lot of dink-and-dunk passes in which the WRs and RBs did a nice job of fighting for yards after the catch.

I won't say that justice was served, because the Vikings played with the hearts of lions yesterday in that second-half comeback and they did deserve the victory on effort alone. But if they'd held on to that last-minute lead, it would've been a case of the Park stealing a win.

And, be it noted for the record, SNC's 'lesser' league is the MWC, not the MIAA (and they should finish at or very near the top of the MWC).  For purposes of the MIAA-CCIW challenge, SNC may have been an 'honorary' MIAA member for the day, but contra Kiko, the CCIW won the challenge, 4-3.  Since I have little doubt that NPU would have beaten Calvin by any score their conscience allowed,

I like the thought of NPU beating Calvin by any score their conscience allowed almost as much as a Hope fan would like it. It's a family thing.

if the MIAA wants a FULL challenge series, they'll have to get Calvin to put on the pads!

I think that Calvin is predestined to spend eternity with a 0-0 all-time mark in football.