FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[smedindy]

How in the holy heck are we persecuting Christians as a group, much less Wheaton? Ye Gods!

[AndOne]

Eventually, if found guilty, I don't foresee jail time. More likely probation and fines, and possible expulsion from school. Also, I believe an out of court settlement is entirely possible.

My money is on deferred adjudication or pre-trial diversion. Whatever they call it in IL.

They are just what I called them. Probation and (out of court) Settlement. 

[smedindy]

Eventually, if found guilty, I don't foresee jail time. More likely probation and fines, and possible expulsion from school. Also, I believe an out of court settlement is entirely possible.

My money is on deferred adjudication or pre-trial diversion. Whatever they call it in IL.

They are just what I called them. Probation and (out of court) Settlement. 

Cut him a deal, McCoy, and move on. The ice is watering down my scotch...

[smedindy]

I think at this point Wheaton (feeling comfortable with their prior conclusion and punishment previously) has to assume that given the new felony charges the government must have information that they don't (something that is more than likely) and suspend the students from the team immediately.   I don't think there is another option.

Do you think they were blindsided here? I'm surprised they didn't get a leak or something.

[AndOne]

As a Reformed amillennialist no other book of the bible describes the persecution of Christians as Rev. 11 where the two witnesses is the Church bearing witness of the Gospel of Jesus. The Gospel torments Satan and the unrepentant wicked through powerful spiritual Judgment that they do everything in their power to stop the witness of Jesus crucified for the forgiveness of sins. So they kill the two witnesses or the spread of the Gospel.
http://www.mountainretreatorg.net/eschatology/rev11.html
http://www.prca.org/resources/categories/articles/item/3505-summary-of-the-book-of-revelation
http://www.cprc.co.uk/2witnesses.m3u
two witnesses = witness of the True Church of Christ crucified for the forgiveness of sins.
I will give power = holy spirit
reed like unto a rod: = Gods measuring stick used to measure the Church
measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein = Church

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against
Revelation 11 King James Version (KJV)
11 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlS_j4QnxrE
{GAWKERS}
10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven


The Bible cuts the atheist deep in the heart till they cant stand it.

Hebrews 4:11-13
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged
sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of
the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of
the heart.
13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.
1 John 2:15-17
15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

Hey, thanks Go Thunder!
Gonna be partying Sat night after the Out Of Darkness Walk Sat afternoon.
Now I can sleep in Sunday as you've already provided me with the Sermon of the Week!

[WooClone15]

How in the holy heck are we persecuting Christians as a group, much less Wheaton? Ye Gods!

Because we dare to question/criticize Wheaton's handling of this. Obviously that means we're persecuting them /s

[shepherd]

How in the holy heck are we persecuting Christians as a group, much less Wheaton? Ye Gods!

Because we dare to question/criticize Wheaton's handling of this. Obviously that means we're persecuting them /s

Impossible to even begin to understand the Word of God unless you are a possessor of the holy spirit and not just a claimer.

[smedindy]

I think I'm going to go to Bible Verses R Us and shop for verses to quote out of context in order to make my point in the most sanctimonious way.

/headdesk

I think I need to read my Bart Ehrman books as a cleanser.

[smedindy]

How in the holy heck are we persecuting Christians as a group, much less Wheaton? Ye Gods!

Because we dare to question/criticize Wheaton's handling of this. Obviously that means we're persecuting them /s

Impossible to even begin to understand the Word of God unless you are a possessor of the holy spirit and not just a claimer.

Well, that, and the many translation errors, and the passages altered to fit a particular viewpoint by early church leaders, kings, bishops, etc.  Oh, and the fact that a good number of the Paulite letters were actually letters not scribed by him, but those who wanted to ride on his coattails. And never mind the Apocrypha (Judith should be a movie, she's badass.) And the gospel of Thomas and the other books written around the same era as the Gospels that were excluded for political reasons (mainly0.

So yeah, the Bible's a hard slog, but the beauty of the KJV language makes up for that.

/and what's the deal with all of the Johns?

[izzy stradlin]

I think at this point Wheaton (feeling comfortable with their prior conclusion and punishment previously) has to assume that given the new felony charges the government must have information that they don't (something that is more than likely) and suspend the students from the team immediately.   I don't think there is another option.

Do you think they were blindsided here? I'm surprised they didn't get a leak or something.

Yeah from what I heard it was a total surprise.   

[jamtod]

/and what's the deal with all of the Johns?

So at least I'm not the only one who thinks there are too many Johnnies over on the MIAC board.
Wait, what?

[izzy stradlin]

I think I'm going to go to Bible Verses R Us and shop for verses to quote out of context in order to make my point in the most sanctimonious way.

/headdesk

I think I need to read my Bart Ehrman books as a cleanser.

Bart Ehrman-- another famous (or infamous to some) Wheaton grad.  Proof we contribute to the mainstream world also. 

[lmitzel]

As a Reformed amillennialist no other book of the bible describes the persecution of Christians as Rev. 11 where the two witnesses is the Church bearing witness of the Gospel of Jesus. The Gospel torments Satan and the unrepentant wicked through powerful spiritual Judgment that they do everything in their power to stop the witness of Jesus crucified for the forgiveness of sins. So they kill the two witnesses or the spread of the Gospel.
http://www.mountainretreatorg.net/eschatology/rev11.html
http://www.prca.org/resources/categories/articles/item/3505-summary-of-the-book-of-revelation
http://www.cprc.co.uk/2witnesses.m3u
two witnesses = witness of the True Church of Christ crucified for the forgiveness of sins.
I will give power = holy spirit
reed like unto a rod: = Gods measuring stick used to measure the Church
measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein = Church

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against
Revelation 11 King James Version (KJV)
11 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlS_j4QnxrE
{GAWKERS}
10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven


The Bible cuts the atheist deep in the heart till they cant stand it.

Hebrews 4:11-13
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged
sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of
the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of
the heart.
13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.
1 John 2:15-17
15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

I'm basically going to paraphrase Greg from yesterday, and I really hope you're not trolling because then I'm just feeding the troll, but here goes.

I share a fairly similar faith to you. Others have come forward and shared similar affirmations of faith. I'm against Wheaton in an athletic sense, but I harbor no ill will towards the college on the whole. But no one on this board from what I can tell has taken this as an opportunity to persecute Christians for t. And seeing as I and others are, why would we persecute our own? As others have said multiple times, bring critical of the college's actions is not persecuting them. It's questioning the operating procedure of an institution whose motto just happens to be "For Christ And His Kingdom." If this were my own Alma mater and the rest of the story was exactly the same I would feel just as dirty about this and wouldn't start cherry picking Scripture in an effort to save face for my school. I imagine many others would say the same.

This isn't a conviction of the Wheaton players, because I don't know enough to make a fully informed decision. Most everyone else seems to be on the fence as well. We want the truth to come out, whatever it is, and for the appropriate actions to then be taken.

[tf37]

tf37,
Thanks for posting. Perhaps I'm the odd man out here, but I appreciated your post, learned from it and hope you post again.
You seem like an objective guy with a rooting interest for Wheaton, perfectly reasonable in my book.

Perhaps if Pat had gone on to read your post, he might have formed a slightly different opinion. Especially since you clearly made an effort to show objectivity, example: "With more information, I could be persuaded to change my stance." That's rock solid.
You raise a valid point that is at the basis of my question and that is: The players were punished to some degree last year, and now, 18 months later, are receiving additional punishment. I have no horse in this race and like all others, want justice. Why? What has changed over time?
I admit to being skeptical that it took investigators this much time to find enough evidence to merit charges.
It seems that accusations so serious should have resulted in the police looking for ways to keep these 5 men off the street/away from other students- immediately.

Thanks emma17.

I do understand Pat's response given that I have no background on the site and it was quite a lengthy response to his comment, which obviously was directed at someone's post.

I would not want to speculate on why authorities are moving forward now.

On an unrelated note, I hope UWW has righted the ship.  I for one would look forward to a rematch of a few years ago.

[WooClone15]

How in the holy heck are we persecuting Christians as a group, much less Wheaton? Ye Gods!

Because we dare to question/criticize Wheaton's handling of this. Obviously that means we're persecuting them /s

Impossible to even begin to understand the Word of God unless you are a possessor of the holy spirit and not just a claimer.

You got me, Go Thunder. Since I don't follow the same creed as you, kowtow before Wheaton, and make large showy displays of faith I'm obviously not a true Christian