FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Stagg Again!!]

As for the game,  NCC absolutely dominated the first half and could have had at least another seven but for an INT in the end zone in the first drive of 2Q.  NCC definitely took their foot off the gas in the 3Q with VERY conservative play-calling (all QB draws, Greenfield runs up the middle, or swing passes to the TE behind the LOS).  This, coupled with some (ahem) interesting and very timely calls by the officials, allowed Wheaton to gain momentum and continue drives that were clearly over. 

Both teams had some first half miscues that could have affected the score at intermission. You can't be seriously suggesting the Cardinals got some home cooking from their own refs??

I'm not sure where either of you are going with this discussion of the refs, but, for the record here, the officiating crews for all CCIW football games (non-conference as well as conference) are assigned under the aegis of the CCIW's coordinator of football officials, Bill Carollo, who heads up a consortium of football official assignment pools called the Midwest Football Officials' Alliance that includes the Big Ten as well as the CCIW and the WIAC. (Carollo should be a familiar name to anyone who watches football, as he was an NFL referee for twenty years and thus had his name consistently mentioned on air during national telecasts; in fact, he reffed a couple of Super Bowls.) Carollo's assistants who directly handle CCIW, WIAC, MWC, and NACC officiating assignments are Tom Fiedler and Tom Stapleton.

Long story short, there is no such thing as "their own refs" (or either home cooking or anti-home cooking) in CCIW football. I think you probably both know that, but it bears repeating. And I also figured that this is an opportune moment to inform everyone who reads this board exactly how officiating crews are assigned for CCIW games and who is assigning them.

Greg, thank you for providing this information. I knew most already, but you filled in a few details that I did not know RE: the Midwest Football Officials' Alliance.  BTW, my father-in-law was a lifer at IBM and knew Bill Carollo well while they both worked for the company.

[Gregory Sager]

Apropos of nothing, North Park welcomed its new P.A. announcer for home football games to the press box on Saturday. It's this guy.

Very nice young man ... and very good at his craft. He was well-prepared before he turned on the mic, and he did a great job despite the fact that it was the first football game he's ever P.A.'ed. (He's done plenty of other sports besides baseball and soccer, since he does the P.A. for his alma mater UIC's sporting events as well as the Cubs and the Red Stars.)

After he finished his pregame announcement of the starting lineups for Carthage and North Park and turned off his mic, I said to him, "Why do I have a sudden urge to flag down a beer vendor and a peanut vendor?"

[WUPHF]

A quick shot out to Washington University who joined North Central and Wheaton in the rankings this week. This is the first time the Bears have been ranked since 2018 when the Bears slipped in and back out the next week at the end of the season.

The Bears have made easy work of the 157th ranked scheduled so far, but head to Rock Island as a one touchdown favorite over the Vikings, according to Massey.

[USee]

WashU is going to be a problem for CCIW schools down the stretch. I have watched them more closely and they are good. Very much a top 25 team.

[USee]

Separately, I have independently verified with several reliable sources that the incident regarding the locker room at NCC absolutely happened. I also found out there are 2 separate locker rooms for visiting teams. Most visiting teams, including Wheaton, utilize them for offense and defense separately. Only one side of the locker room had an incident, the offensive side (as attested to by a fellow poster whose son is a player). No one know who the culprit(s) was/were but there was seemingly a breach of security sometime between when the players left for kickoff and when they returned for halftime. Perhaps there is a delay when the locker room gets locked after the team leaves for Kickoff, or maybe it gets unlocked in advance of their return and there is a gap in coverage for some reason. Regardless, I am pretty certain it did happen at this point.

[markerickson]

Up 12 points, Carthage passed for a 21 yard TD with 39 seconds remaining in the 4th qtr.  Classy move, Carthage /s

NP's leading rusher against woeful Carthage garnered a whopping 39 yards.

[New Tradition]

Up 12 points, Carthage passed for a 21 yard TD with 39 seconds remaining in the 4th qtr.  Classy move, Carthage /s

NP's leading rusher against woeful Carthage garnered a whopping 39 yards.

What down was it?  Were they trying to pick up a first to close it out?  Did NP have timeouts?

[Gregory Sager]

Carthage started the drive at the NPU 20 with 2:31 remaining in the game after recovering a fumble, with the Firebirds up, 26-14. North Park had no timeouts left. The Firebirds ran three running plays, the type of up-the-middle handoffs customary for a winning team trying to run out the clock at the end of a game. The starting QB, Christian Beltran, was still in the game, but the RB was the backup, Nasir Canty. Canty's rushes were for -1, 2, and -2 yards, bringing up a 4th and 11 at the NPU 21 with 48 seconds remaining. Carthage HC Dustin Hass called a timeout. The Firebirds offense came back out onto the field, and on 4th and 11 Beltran hit Canty on a swing pass coming out of the backfield. Canty ran right past the right side of the NPU defense and into the endzone, with the official time of that final TD coming at 00:39.

As an NPU fan I didn't have any objection to how Hass played the situation. That includes the timeout; in terms of the unwritten rules of football ethics, Hass certainly has the right to give himself enough time to review his options. Now, the odds that the Vikings are going to score a long touchdown, recover an onside kick, and then score another long TD in the span of a little more than half a minute of game time, all accomplished without a timeout, are infinitesimal. But they're not impossible. A coach's job is to prevent the not-impossible from ever occurring.

Hass could've had his kicker attempt a 38-yard field goal that might've gone through the uprights and yet still wouldn't have put the game out of the reach of two quick Vikings TDs. More likely, given the limited track record of both of Carthage's kickers, the FG attempt would've been missed, putting the ball back in the hands of the Vikings while hardly taking any time off of the clock.

Or Hass could've called the same run-out-the-clock play he'd just called on the three previous plays. It can be argued that another handoff to Canty, with presumably the same result as the first three, would've shaved enough time off of the clock to make it virtually impossible for NPU to score two touchdowns in however many seconds were left once referee Floyd Sutton stopped the clock for the change of possession. Even so, as I said, the not-impossible remains possible, however extremely unlikely.

What Hass chose instead was a play that had as reasonable a chance of gaining a first down as one could expect in that situation, given the down, distance, formation, and game situation, but he obviously wasn't looking to score a touchdown. Nobody ran a route into the end zone. The pass was completed roughly at the line of scrimmage. Canty scored because a) the Vikings were caught by surprise; b) Canty is quick; and, most importantly, c) the attempts by the Vikings to tackle Canty -- several of them had a legit shot at him as he raced up the sideline -- were completely inept. The blame for that last Carthage touchdown is on the NPU defense, not on Hass.

This was not the same situation as the controversial play in 2013 when Wheaton, up 51-0 on NPU, scored a touchdown pass in the final forty seconds of the game on a deep throw up the left sideline. If you're up by 12 points with enough time on the clock for four plays to occur -- an unsuccessful fourth-down play resulting in a change of possession, a long TD pass, an onside kick recovered by the kicking team, and another long TD pass -- then you're under no obligation to simply surrender the ball by either going into victory formation for a kneel-down or sending another useless handoff up the middle.

[New Tradition]

Carthage started the drive at the NPU 20 with 2:31 remaining in the game after recovering a fumble, with the Firebirds up, 26-14. North Park had no timeouts left. The Firebirds ran three running plays, the type of up-the-middle handoffs customary for a winning team trying to run out the clock at the end of a game. The starting QB, Christian Beltran, was still in the game, but the RB was the backup, Nasir Canty. Canty's rushes were for -1, 2, and -2 yards, bringing up a 4th and 11 at the NPU 21 with 48 seconds remaining. Carthage HC Dustin Hass called a timeout. The Firebirds offense came back out onto the field, and on 4th and 11 Beltran hit Canty on a swing pass coming out of the backfield. Canty ran right past the right side of the NPU defense and into the endzone, with the official time of that final TD coming at 00:39.

As an NPU fan I didn't have any objection to how Hass played the situation. That includes the timeout; in terms of the unwritten rules of football ethics, Hass certainly has the right to give himself enough time to review his options. Now, the odds that the Vikings are going to score a long touchdown, recover an onside kick, and then score another long TD in the span of a little more than half a minute of game time, all accomplished without a timeout, are infinitesimal. But they're not impossible. A coach's job is to prevent the not-impossible from ever occurring.

Hass could've had his kicker attempt a 38-yard field goal that might've gone through the uprights and yet still wouldn't have put the game out of the reach of two quick Vikings TDs. More likely, given the limited track record of both of Carthage's kickers, the FG attempt would've been missed, putting the ball back in the hands of the Vikings while hardly taking any time off of the clock.

Or Hass could've called the same run-out-the-clock play he'd just called on the three previous plays. It can be argued that another handoff to Canty, with presumably the same result as the first three, would've shaved enough time off of the clock to make it virtually impossible for NPU to score two touchdowns in however many seconds were left once referee Floyd Sutton stopped the clock for the change of possession. Even so, as I said, the not-impossible remains possible, however extremely unlikely.

What Hass chose instead was a play that had as reasonable a chance of gaining a first down as one could expect in that situation, given the down, distance, formation, and game situation, but he obviously wasn't looking to score a touchdown. Nobody ran a route into the end zone. The pass was completed roughly at the line of scrimmage. Canty scored because a) the Vikings were caught by surprise; b) Canty is quick; and, most importantly, c) the attempts by the Vikings to tackle Canty -- several of them had a legit shot at him as he raced up the sideline -- were completely inept. The blame for that last Carthage touchdown is on the NPU defense, not on Hass.

This was not the same situation as the controversial play in 2013 when Wheaton, up 51-0 on NPU, scored a touchdown pass in the final forty seconds of the game on a deep throw up the left sideline. If you're up by 12 points with enough time on the clock for four plays to occur -- an unsuccessful fourth-down play resulting in a change of possession, a long TD pass, an onside kick recovered by the kicking team, and another long TD pass -- then you're under no obligation to simply surrender the ball by either going into victory formation for a kneel-down or sending another useless handoff up the middle.

Thanks for this!  Exactly why I asked.

[USee]

I expect the CCIW to be much stronger overall this year. Although I suspect our OOC record will be around 6-4 the teams should be much stronger that they were a year ago overall. I am posting my predictions for the league and a capsule on each team with some thoughts. I used only available online info and Wheaton hasn't yet posted their 2022 roster and I am not privy to the talent level of most newcomers. I will post the capsules for the 5 teams playing tomorrow now. I am still finishing the other 5 and will post them when they are done.

Here is my prediction for the league:

Overall non conference record: 6-4

1. North Central 10-0/10-0
2. Wheaton      8-2/8-1
3. IWU            7-3/6-3
4. Augie          6-4/5-4
5. WashU        6-4/5-4
6. Carroll        5-5/4-5
7. North Park  4-6/3-6
8. Carthage    3-7/3-6
9. Millikin       2-8/2-7
10. Elmhurst  0-10/0-9

Halfway point in the schedule, time to revisit these predictions.

Team (predicted record)/(current record)
1. NCC (10-0)(5-0/5-0)-No reason to think 10-0 won't happen. Only potential pothole is a road game to WashU next weekend
2. Wheaton (8-2)(3-2/3-1)-On track to 8-2 though 7-3 is a very real possibility. They play the bottom half of the league but have a road game @WashU in 3 weeks
3. IWU (7-3)(3-2/2-2)-They will lose to NCC but host NPU and Carthage before the key game @Augie and finish @Elmhurst. 7-3 absolutely in play
4. Augie (6-4)(3-2/2-2) An OT loss @Carroll keeps them from really outperforming so far.  I have them losing today v WashU (some don't) but could easily win the 3 before losing @NCC the last week. probably 6-4, but 5-5/7-3 are on the radar.
5. WahU (6-4) (5-0/4-0) I underestimated WashU. Their Offense has been as good as expected but it's their defense that is surprisingly good. They play all the best teams in the league still but 8-2 or 9-1 are likely outcomes.
6. Carroll (6-4)(3-2/2-2): Carroll's OT win v Augie was big. They should get wins @Elmhurst, Carthage, @Millikin;  likely losses @Wheaton and v WashU. Slightly better than expected 6-4
7. NPU (4-6)(0-5/0-4). Lost the games I though they could win (manchester, Mill, Carthage) and only v Elmhurst looms. Worse than I expected and likely 1-9
8. Millikin (2-8)(2-3/1-3). I thought NPU would beat them otherwise they are what I expected. Slight uptick to 3-7 and if they win @Carthage could get to 4-6
9. Elmhurst (0-10)(0-5/0-5). A rough year for the Bluejays and headed for 0-10

Overall I underestimated WashU's performance so far and overestimated NPU.

[USee]

According to HansenRatings The CCIW's rankings has improved over last year. Here are the rankings for this year's CCIW teams as compared to last year (similar stage of the season):

Team/2022/2021/Diff

NCC. #3 vs #1 -2
Wheaton # 12 vs #4 -8
WashU. #28 vs 40 +12
Augie #34 vs #66 +32
IWU #62 vs #66  +4
Millikin #96 vs #115 +19
Carroll #98 vs #138  +40
Carthage #128  vs #47  -81
Elmhurst #178 vs #188  +10
NPU. #179 vs #176  -3


This kind of confirms for me what I am seeing on paper and in the games which is the middle of the conference isn't nearly as soft as it had been. NCC and Wheaton are slightly off where they were, WashU, Augie, Millikin and Carroll are all dramatically better than last year at this point and the "bad look" is really being driven by Carthage, whose shut out loss to Albion was a surprise. Elmhurst and NPU are basically static from last year. I expect(ed) NPU to be better and the loss to Manchester was disappointing.

The 6-4 non conference record (improving on 4-6 a year ago) is a data point for me but I still believe the conference is stronger than it was a year ago and HansenRatings has data to support that.

Checking in on the conference at the halfway point. D3.Com rated the CCIW #4 in the country, flat with 2021. Here is the updated rankings from HansenRatings. He continues to support my belief the conference is better overall than a year ago. WashU, Augie, Carroll have all been significantly better and NCC, Elmhurst and NPU are about flat. Carthage, Millikin and IWU have underperformed so far according to HansenRatings.

Team/2022/2021/Diff

NCC. #1 vs #1 flat
Wheaton # 11 vs #4 -7
WashU. #19 vs 40 +21
Augie #33 vs #66 +33
IWU #89 vs #66  -23
Millikin #155 vs #115 -40
Carroll #96 vs #138  +42
Carthage #128  vs #47  -75
Elmhurst #187 vs #188  +1
NPU. #175 vs #176  +1

[kiko]

Checking in on the conference at the halfway point. D3.Com rated the CCIW #4 in the country, flat with 2021. Here is the updated rankings from HansenRatings. He continues to support my belief the conference is better overall than a year ago. WashU, Augie, Carroll have all been significantly better and NCC, Elmhurst and NPU are about flat. Carthage, Millikin and IWU have underperformed so far according to HansenRatings.

Team/2022/2021/Diff

NCC. #1 vs #1 flat
Wheaton # 11 vs #4 -7
WashU. #19 vs 40 +21
Augie #33 vs #66 +33
IWU #89 vs #66  -23
Millikin #155 vs #115 -40
Carroll #96 vs #138  +42
Carthage #128  vs #47  -75
Elmhurst #187 vs #188  +1
NPU. #175 vs #176  +1

From my POV here in the cheap seats, that rating flatters Augustanta.  And, as much as I don't want to say nice things about Norm, IWU is probably a tad higher than where they are projected.  The others feel like they are in a reasonable postal code.

[USee]

with 11:49 left in the 2nd quarter in Bloomington:

NPU 27 IWU 7. and it hasn't been that close

Wheaton leads Carthage 14-0 middle of 2nd Qtr in Kenosha and NCC is 21-0 over Millikin in 2nd.

[kiko]

And, as much as I don't want to say nice things about Norm, IWU is probably a tad higher than where they are projected.  The others feel like they are in a reasonable postal code.

with 11:49 left in the 2nd quarter in Bloomington:

NPU 27 IWU 7. and it hasn't been that close

Well, this did not age well.

How's it going, Norm?

[USee]

NPU 34  IWU 21 12:35 left in 4th
Wheaton 52 Carthage 12 13:12 4th
NCC 58 Millkin 0  12:34 4th
WashU 14 Augie 7 1st Qtr