FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Mugsy]

jaybird,
I believe you misread my Wheaton roster post.  He is a 303lbs offensive lineman.

[HughJass]

Masko, 

I guess it's not so much of a question as when is Barnes out of here but more or less what has to change to make Augie the dominant team like they were in the 90's.  Augie has been near the top of their game but have been losing the important games.  It has to be disappointing to have a great season and lose it in the very last game three years in a row.  Well actually, I think it is 4 or 5 straight years now.  But the Vikings have been out of the playoffs the last 3 seasons.  I wont say that the players Augie has now arent good because I dont feel that is the case.  Augie has always had great performers.  Is it the players' commitments?  I remember seeing games in the 90's and it was smashmouth football.  I dont see that as much anymore and it needs to be brought back to augie.  I cant put a finger on exactly what needs to change but I think there is something. 

[masko]

Agree - seems like less smash mouth...  Also seems like less confidence in general, which was an attribute that all of Reades teams had.  There wasn't one year I was at Augie where we didn't think we would win a title.  I always thought Reade and Augie in general ran a football program similar to Nebraska under Osborne.  In your face, down your throat, run right at you kinda stuff.  I think Barnes will eventually have a lot of success, he just needs some time, a little luck and good recruiting... 

[HughJass]

Also, I'm not sure what other schools in the CCIW charge in tuition but it may also have a thing to do with it.  I think tuition these days is close to 30K.  Wesleyan I'm sure is over that even but, are other schools offering things that are attracting their recruits?  Questions I'm not sure many people can answer. 

[masko]

I have a really dumb question and I'd figure to ask the CCIW files - do some teams have conference championship rings and or do teams issue rings for winning the conference?  I just happened to browse around and noticed some teams show actual Conference Championship rings - is this true?

[washdupcard]

Think it could have anything to do with Augie being located Rock Island?!

[Mugsy]

masko,
I think you've hit on a key aspect to Augie during the truly dominant years.  "In your face, down your throat, run right at you kinda stuff."

I can only comment on the years I was at Wheaton as a player and a coach - 85' to 94'.  As a defense, we studied hours and hours of Augie Wing-T game film.  I recall especially in my junior and senior year(87'-88'), the entire defense knew what play was coming by subtle variations of offensive line and running back alignment.  We'd even call out what play was coming... but Augie didn't care.  They still ran it... as if to dare you to stop them.

I think there are a variety of factors that all play in Augie's "fall" (if one can even call it that) from extreme dominance.  There may be a drop in overall talent given the general competitiveness of CCIW recruiting (ie. other schools stealing from Augie talent pool).  That doesn't even factor in other Illinois schools who didn't even have football or were horrible prior the 80's (Aurora for one).

Personally, I do think the primary change to Augie has been on the defensive side of the ball.  They are much less aggresive in terms of scheme.  They see to sit back and react rather than attack as a defense.

The coach staff is different from the championship years.  I recall being part of some back and forth jugernaut games with Augie, where yes... we knew what play Augie was running.  But somewhere in the 2nd half, Augie coaches would make subtle adjustments that resulted in some quick TD's.  For example, 1988 Wheaton vs. Augie... score is 13-10 (or something close to that) entering the 4th quarter.  Augie changes the way they block the trap play to a 3rd variation we'd hadn't seen them use - ever.  3 quick TD's on the trap play in under 5 minutes... game over.  Reade & Co. always seemed to make the adjustments to win.  Personally I can't comment on the job Barnes & staff do, because I don't know enough.  But it seems other coaching staffs seem to now be the ones making the crucial adjustments... ie. Swider & staff during the past 5 years?

[masko]

Mugsy:

I was a freshman at that game and remember very well.  We seemed to do that a lot over the years or somehow pulling out a win at the last min when everyone thought it was over.  I also remember we had probably our best team poised for a DIII title in 91 and was running over everyone until that 2nd to last game against Wheaton!  Talk about a tough loss...  Wheaton was the toughest place for us to play away - that and Daytons Division I football stadium....

Bob Reade owed a ton to his assistant coaches, especially from the recruiting side.  All his assistants were on the road all year long trying to get the best of the best. 

washdupcard :
I terms of "Does Rock Island have anything to do with it."  Well, ask the rest of the CCIW and NCAA Division III football from 1980 until about 1995 my good friend...  Didn't seem to have a problem then.  Probably one of the prettiest campuses in the CCIW if I must say so myself (still is).... 

[HughJass]

Conference rings, to my knowledge, arent given to the team, but the team can get one made, paid out of their pockets. 

[Pat Coleman]

If I were Elmhurst, I would keep Benedictine. I think their new facility will help them get better and the new coaching staff is on the ball -- primarily the assistants from Aurora last year. That will turn into a good challenge game.

Someone shoud come up with a trophy.

[devildog29]

Mugsy, in regards to augie playing smashmouth, in your face football in the past, i totally agree with your comments.  at wesleyan in the mid 90's during the final years of reade, just as you said, their offense said here we come, try and stop us.  they ran and ran and ran that wing-t.  it seems to me that lately they've tried to be a little more cute with their offense in recent years, particularly the passing game.  also, their defense i thought had a great combination of aggressiveness and athleticism.  the front 4 and the LB's like Van Wetzinga (however you spell that) were just nasty, but they had great athletes in the secondary like corey christenson that were always just making great plays.  any thoughts?

[masko]

The philosophy at Augie, at least when I was there, was fly around to the ball on D - no worries about mistakes.  Better to be over aggressive.  Always, always placed a great emphasis on putting great athletes on the corners and safety positions.  LB's go way back in tradition - guys that would just fly around...

Sounds like things maybe have changed a little since I left in 91

[dansand]

I have to agree with Devildog and Mugsy. As I've said before, Augie's defense is the the big difference between now and the Reade years. Nasty and athletic are excellent desriptions of those defenses. Their defenses during the national championship years possessed exceptional speed. Examples would be guys like Carlton Beasley, a defensive end who ran a sub-4.4 40, Pete Kasap, a linebacker who also returned punts and and DB's like Mike Gray (15 int. in '86) and Troy Westerman (Augie6?) who were both sub-4.5 guys. When it came to nastiness, guys like Lynn Thomsen and Mark Long played like men among boys. The other thing that those teams had was tremendous confidence (which I think came directly from Reade). As Masko said earlier, they just expected to win and then went out and did it. They blew most teams out but also won many close games during those years. I think
getting that swagger back might end up being even more difficult than upgrading the talent on defense.

[vikes35]

Hugh and Masko,

I couldn't agree more with you about the problem at Augie. They aren't aggresive and they seem to think that is ok. Instead of having a "we are going to beat them" attitude, they seem to have a "how can we hang on to beat them attitude". It would have been nice to see this smashmouth game you are talking about (I am a senoir at Augie right now and was not around to see the games of the 80's & 90's as I was still in pre-school and grade school), but I can tell you that what we have been watching for the last 3 years hasn't been aggresive stop us if you can football. Hopefully with a new D cord we will be more aggresive and apply more pressure than we have in the recent past, because like most of you this comment is mainly concerning the defensive side of the ball.

Washedup,
"Think it could have anything to do with Augie being located Rock Island?!"

I think that our school being where it is is actually a plus. The reason I choose to go to Augie was because it was far enough away from Chicago but was also close enough to make weekend trips home possible.  The campus is excellent if you as me and the quad-cites (in the right parts) has a lot of entertainment close to the school. I would not think of Rock Island as a negative involving recruiting but instead a plus.

[devildog29]

I don't really see nasty aggressive D anywhere in the CCIW much anymore.  Not to get all sociological, but perhaps it's just a reflection of today's student athlete period.  Football at all levels has gotten all glitz and glamour and less the physical game it used to be.  Look at the hit Urlacher put on Indy's tight end and got called for a late hit on Saturday night.  Aggression has been taken out of the game.  It's no longer cool to be mean and nasty on the football field anymore.  It's cooler to have your wristbands and socks worn properly stylish than to go out and just worry about making plays.