FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[New Tradition]

You "obviously made the right choice"? I don't see the obviousness in it. Of course, if your team's success on the gridiron is your sole criterion for validating your choice of college -- or even your primary criterion for validating it -- then, yes, you made the right choice. North Central was better in football than Cornell during your student era, so, if that's your Holy Grail when it comes to choosing a school, you chose wisely. But that's not a universal truism for every former college student -- even for a football alumnus -- so it's therefore not "obvious."

I'm not trying to be snarky here or to bust your chops out of boredom or malice or some misplaced sense of superiority. (Especially not the latter; one of the colleges to which I applied when I was seventeen drew my interest solely because the girls pictured in the school brochure were hot. And, no, the college in question was not a CCIW school. ) I'm simply saying that there are countless reasons for choosing a college, whether you're a student-athlete or just a student at large. Potential for team success in one's sport is only one of those reasons. Furthermore, when you come to the end of your college career, or even years afterward, you might reach the conclusion that your initial reason for choosing the school was not a particularly sound one, even if the experience turned out to be positive and you're now a supportive alumnus or alumna of the school.

If wins and losses on the football field are what validate for you in retrospect your choice of North Central over Cornell, that's fine, of course. It's your life. But it's not obvious, because not everybody starts with your set of preconceptions nor sees it all the same way you do in hindsight ... not even, I would dare to guess, your fellow Cardinals football alumni.

Actually, when I chose my college my parents advised me to do so as though I'd never play another down of football in my life.  I took their advice.  When I made my decision to attend NCC instead of Cornell, Joe DeGeorge was still the head coach and it appeared as though they were destined to continue their 40+ year streak of not winning a conference title, and that Cornell would continue to be a power in the IOWA Conference.  I chose my college based solely on academics and the "feel" of the campus.  Football played little or no role in my choice, and had I made my decision based solely upon football and how I was recruited, I would have been a Cornell Ram.  I feel that I have gained much from my decision, both on and off the field.  Shark56 nicely sums up what I gained from my football experience as a Cardinal; but what I gained from North Central both academically and in the friendship category (many of whom did not play football) is immeasurable and are things that, like my football memories, will last a lifetime.  Since this is a football message board, however, when I said that I "obviously made the right choice" I was referring to football success. 

[New Tradition]

so, if that's your Holy Grail when it comes to choosing a school, you chose wisely.

K+ for the Last Crusade reference.  That's one of my favorite lines.

[Mugsy]

Although I'm intrigued by the Cornell matchup simply because when I was deciding where to go to college, I had it narrowed down to Cornell and NCC.  (In hindsight I obviously made the right choice, although at the time Cornell was coming off a 7-3 season while NCC was only able to muster a 3-7 effort.)

You "obviously made the right choice"? I don't see the obviousness in it. Of course, if your team's success on the gridiron is your sole criterion for validating your choice of college -- or even your primary criterion for validating it -- then, yes, you made the right choice. North Central was better in football than Cornell during your student era, so, if that's your Holy Grail when it comes to choosing a school, you chose wisely. But that's not a universal truism for every former college student -- even for a football alumnus -- so it's therefore not "obvious."

I'm not trying to be snarky here or to bust your chops out of boredom or malice or some misplaced sense of superiority. (Especially not the latter; one of the colleges to which I applied when I was seventeen drew my interest solely because the girls pictured in the school brochure were hot. And, no, the college in question was not a CCIW school. ) I'm simply saying that there are countless reasons for choosing a college, whether you're a student-athlete or just a student at large. Potential for team success in one's sport is only one of those reasons. Furthermore, when you come to the end of your college career, or even years afterward, you might reach the conclusion that your initial reason for choosing the school was not a particularly sound one, even if the experience turned out to be positive and you're now a supportive alumnus or alumna of the school.

If wins and losses on the football field are what validate for you in retrospect your choice of North Central over Cornell, that's fine, of course. It's your life. But it's not obvious, because not everybody starts with your set of preconceptions nor sees it all the same way you do in hindsight ... not even, I would dare to guess, your fellow Cardinals football alumni.

If you all recall, last year we had someone come onto the board exposing the "obvious" choice of Millikin over other CCIW schools based on it's relative proximity to the bars in Champaign-Urbana and other drinking establishments in Decatur.  Oh boy...

[Mugsy]

lol... easy coming from a North Park alumni... what's the streak? 10 years now? North Central builds champions on and off the field (along with many other teams in the CCIW). There is a huge connection between winning football games and being successful in life. It might sound smug, however, it is fair to say that anyone that is used to winning year after year, striving to be the best every opportunity possible, becomes a custom to that competitiveness.  That will carry on to anything after graduation and into life.

IMO, school like NCC, AC, WC are obvious choices for any D3 athlete.

I think it is fair to say you missed much of what GS was trying to say and focused more on winning percentage on the football field (the fact NCC has beaten NPU 10 years in a row?).  

On a side note, so are you saying it is not possible to "strive to be the best at every opportunity possible" or to learn from ones dedication/commitment to football that will carry on to anything after graduation or in life if you play on a losing team?  Are you saying because one plays for NPU it will not be possible to learn from the experience of participating in collegiate sports, apply it to whatever vocation you choose and make a difference in the world or be "successful".  

I would have to say I completely disagree with your view.  While there is something to learn or gain from success and winning, I do NOT think the experience of participating in collegiate athletics and what can be applied to whatever you do post college (business, family, etc...) is driven by whether or not your team wins or loses.  

I could easily compile a long list what can be learned from playing college sports that have nothing to do with wins or loses that have significant application to life, but I'm rambling already...

Real quick... how about dedication, commitment, time management, team work, continual striving to be the best, never giving up, leadership, knowing your role, setting and reaching goals, overcoming hardship and setbacks, etc...  NONE of these are only applicable to those who play for winning teams.

IMO, school like NCC, AC, WC are obvious choices for any D3 athlete.

If primary criteria is successful football programs, then yes... those would be valid options.  Incidentally you'd need to include IWU as well.  

Every single CCIW school has a number of reasons why it would be an obvious choice depending on criteria such as; offered degree programs, campus location, financial aid, enrollment size and yes, another factor would be athletic programs (but that is not the sole factor).

[Gregory Sager]

You "obviously made the right choice"? I don't see the obviousness in it. Of course, if your team's success on the gridiron is your sole criterion for validating your choice of college -- or even your primary criterion for validating it -- then, yes, you made the right choice. North Central was better in football than Cornell during your student era, so, if that's your Holy Grail when it comes to choosing a school, you chose wisely. But that's not a universal truism for every former college student -- even for a football alumnus -- so it's therefore not "obvious."

I'm not trying to be snarky here or to bust your chops out of boredom or malice or some misplaced sense of superiority. (Especially not the latter; one of the colleges to which I applied when I was seventeen drew my interest solely because the girls pictured in the school brochure were hot. And, no, the college in question was not a CCIW school. ) I'm simply saying that there are countless reasons for choosing a college, whether you're a student-athlete or just a student at large. Potential for team success in one's sport is only one of those reasons. Furthermore, when you come to the end of your college career, or even years afterward, you might reach the conclusion that your initial reason for choosing the school was not a particularly sound one, even if the experience turned out to be positive and you're now a supportive alumnus or alumna of the school.

If wins and losses on the football field are what validate for you in retrospect your choice of North Central over Cornell, that's fine, of course. It's your life. But it's not obvious, because not everybody starts with your set of preconceptions nor sees it all the same way you do in hindsight ... not even, I would dare to guess, your fellow Cardinals football alumni.

Actually, when I chose my college my parents advised me to do so as though I'd never play another down of football in my life.  I took their advice.  When I made my decision to attend NCC instead of Cornell, Joe DeGeorge was still the head coach and it appeared as though they were destined to continue their 40+ year streak of not winning a conference title, and that Cornell would continue to be a power in the IOWA Conference.  I chose my college based solely on academics and the "feel" of the campus.  Football played little or no role in my choice, and had I made my decision based solely upon football and how I was recruited, I would have been a Cornell Ram.  I feel that I have gained much from my decision, both on and off the field.  Shark56 nicely sums up what I gained from my football experience as a Cardinal; but what I gained from North Central both academically and in the friendship category (many of whom did not play football) is immeasurable and are things that, like my football memories, will last a lifetime.  Since this is a football message board, however, when I said that I "obviously made the right choice" I was referring to football success. 

Your college choice was something that you've obviously thought out at length, both before and after, and not everyone can say that. Kudos on your articulate response to my post.

lol... easy coming from a North Park alumni... what's the streak? 10 years now? North Central builds champions on and off the field (along with many other teams in the CCIW). There is a huge connection between winning football games and being successful in life. It might sound smug, however, it is fair to say that anyone that is used to winning year after year, striving to be the best every opportunity possible, becomes a custom to that competitiveness.  That will carry on to anything after graduation and into life.

IMO, school like NCC, AC, WC are obvious choices for any D3 athlete.

I think it is fair to say you missed much of what GS was trying to say

Much? I'd say that that the whole thing flew right over shark's head.

and focused more on winning percentage on the football field (the fact NCC has beaten NPU 10 years in a row?). 

On a side note, so are you saying it is not possible to "strive to be the best at every opportunity possible" or to learn from ones dedication/commitment to football that will carry on to anything after graduation or in life if you play on a losing team?  Are you saying because one plays for NPU it will not be possible to learn from the experience of participating in collegiate sports, apply it to whatever vocation you choose and make a difference in the world or be "successful". 

I would have to say I completely disagree with your view.  While there is something to learn or gain from success and winning, I do NOT think the experience of participating in collegiate athletics and what can be applied to whatever you do post college (business, family, etc...) is driven by whether or not your team wins or loses. 

I could easily compile a long list what can be learned from playing college sports that have nothing to do with wins or loses that have significant application to life, but I'm rambling already...

Real quick... how about dedication, commitment, time management, team work, continual striving to be the best, never giving up, leadership, knowing your role, setting and reaching goals, overcoming hardship and setbacks, etc...  NONE of these are only applicable to those who play for winning teams.

IMO, school like NCC, AC, WC are obvious choices for any D3 athlete.

If primary criteria is successful football programs, then yes... those would be valid options.  Incidentally you'd need to include IWU as well. 

Every single CCIW school has a number of reasons why it would be an obvious choice depending on criteria such as; offered degree programs, campus location, financial aid, enrollment size and yes, another factor would be athletic programs (but that is not the sole factor).

As usual, you make a number of good points and state them well, Mugsy.

[Red Reign]

lol... easy coming from a North Park alumni... what's the streak? 10 years now? North Central builds champions on and off the field (along with many other teams in the CCIW). There is a huge connection between winning football games and being successful in life. It might sound smug, however, it is fair to say that anyone that is used to winning year after year, striving to be the best every opportunity possible, becomes a custom to that competitiveness.  That will carry on to anything after graduation and into life.

IMO, school like NCC, AC, WC are obvious choices for any D3 athlete.

I think it is fair to say you missed much of what GS was trying to say and focused more on winning percentage on the football field (the fact NCC has beaten NPU 10 years in a row?).  

On a side note, so are you saying it is not possible to "strive to be the best at every opportunity possible" or to learn from ones dedication/commitment to football that will carry on to anything after graduation or in life if you play on a losing team?  Are you saying because one plays for NPU it will not be possible to learn from the experience of participating in collegiate sports, apply it to whatever vocation you choose and make a difference in the world or be "successful".  

I would have to say I completely disagree with your view.  While there is something to learn or gain from success and winning, I do NOT think the experience of participating in collegiate athletics and what can be applied to whatever you do post college (business, family, etc...) is driven by whether or not your team wins or loses.  

I could easily compile a long list what can be learned from playing college sports that have nothing to do with wins or loses that have significant application to life, but I'm rambling already...

Real quick... how about dedication, commitment, time management, team work, continual striving to be the best, never giving up, leadership, knowing your role, setting and reaching goals, overcoming hardship and setbacks, etc...  NONE of these are only applicable to those who play for winning teams.

IMO, school like NCC, AC, WC are obvious choices for any D3 athlete.

If primary criteria is successful football programs, then yes... those would be valid options.  Incidentally you'd need to include IWU as well.  

Every single CCIW school has a number of reasons why it would be an obvious choice depending on criteria such as; offered degree programs, campus location, financial aid, enrollment size and yes, another factor would be athletic programs (but that is not the sole factor).

Sure... thats the politically right thing to say.  "Winning is a habit. Unfortunately, so is...." I think that statement carries on to everything in life.

LOL... Don't get me wrong, I know what GS and NT were saying but when I read it for some reason I decided to go on a rant about the correlation between success on the football field and success in life. I have no clue why but I stand by it. Trying to spice thing up I suppose.

and I didn't mean to cut IWU short I was naming a few... and I still might be a little upset about last years out come

[oldnuthin]

so, if that's your Holy Grail when it comes to choosing a school, you chose wisely.

K+ for the Last Crusade reference.  That's one of my favorite lines.

Really? i thought that was from Indiana Jones and the lasst Crusade   Like the way i worked Wheaton om thaT one . As for the bars in Decataur I prefer the ones in Forsyth.

[usee]

so, if that's your Holy Grail when it comes to choosing a school, you chose wisely.

K+ for the Last Crusade reference.  That's one of my favorite lines.

Really? i thought that was from Indiana Jones and the lasst Crusade  Like the way i worked Wheaton om thaT one . As for the bars in Decataur I prefer the ones in Forsyth.

Actually, I am willing to bet GS was referencing something from the Monty Python era.

[Gregory Sager]

Nope, it was Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.

[matblake]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36WEn-9zs1U

[usee]

Nope, it was Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.

No, I think you misremember.

[Gregory Sager]

Nope, it was Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.

No, I think you misremember.

No, I didn't. This is from the quotes section of the IJ&TLC entry on imdb.com:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0097576/quotes?qt0357927

[usee]

That doesn't prove anything. the fact is that Monty Python's Holy Grail predates Indy's. You are clearly more of a Monty Python generation guy. Stop the denial and own up to it.

[CardinalAlum]

I'd watch the Monty Python movie any day over any of the the Indiana Jones movies!   

[New Tradition]

I'd watch the Monty Python movie any day over any of the the Indiana Jones movies!   

You can stop your crazy talk at any time...