FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Mugsy]

Wheaton all over Elmhurst thus far.  36-7 Wheaton at the half.  Wheaton with 270 yards offense at the half.  Meader 20-28 for 223 yards, 3 TD's.

Elmhurst offense getting their share of yards, 202 yards.  Furco having a rough day, 10-25 for 121 yards, 1 INT (return 45 yards to Elmhurst 3).  Scottie Williams 13 carries for 80 yards.

Thought this would be a very, very tight game.

[Mugsy]

IWU leads 28-3 at the half against NPU.

[Titan Q]

IWU 42
North Park 3


Rob Gallik was 16-24 for 257 yards with 1 TD in the air.  He also had 2 TD's rushing, and 38 yards.

TE Parker Carroll had 99 receiving yards.  Cameron Allen was IWU's leading rusher (75 yards)...T.J. Stinde did not play again.

The Titans play @ Elmhurst next weekend.

[Mugsy]

Elmhurst plays their 1st team for the entire game.  Even when down by 28 with 10 minutes left in the game.  Makes the game look more respectable, but give no game experience to the subs.  Not sure I agree with Coach Lester's thinking.

Scottie Williams ends up with almost 200 yards rushing, 70 on reserves.  Elmhurst with 490 yards offense, 170 yards on reserves. 

Bogus if you ask me.

<update>:  Elmhurst losses one of their starting receivers on the last play of the game with an ankle injury.  Now he likely won't be available for game next week against IWU.  All to make a game look closer.  Stupid if you ask me.

[Mugsy]

Final:  Wheaton 49, Elmhurst 21

[bluejay4ever]

Elmhurst plays their 1st team for the entire game.  Even when down by 28 with 10 minutes left in the game.  Makes the game look more respectable, but give no game experience to the subs.  Not sure I agree with Coach Lester's thinking.

Scottie Williams ends up with almost 200 yards rushing, 70 on reserves.  Elmhurst with 490 yards offense, 170 yards on reserves. 

Bogus if you ask me.

<update>:  Elmhurst losses one of their starting receivers on the last play of the game with an ankle injury.  Now he likely won't be available for game next week against IWU.  All to make a game look closer.  Stupid if you ask me.

Mugsy, I have to disagree with you on a few points here. Coach Lester is a very classy coach and before you start calling people out Wheaton was throwing the ball when they were up 4 touchdowns so don't throw stones.

I was a coach at EC for 5 years which included 1 year with Coach Lester, while also an ex player and alum from the 97,98,99 and 2000 football seasons. Coach Lester defines class in everything he has done and will continue to do with the program as well as the rest of the staff. While most of the other coaches in the conference are negative recruiting he said to us if he ever hears us say one bad word about another school or coach we would be fired on the spot.  This while our recruits would send us emails from other coaches in the conference showing us what the lies they said or wrote about EC. When trying to build a team from a consistent 500 team to an upper tier program you have to develop your freshman and sophomores. I don't know if you realize this but if you step foot on the field on Saturday you can not play in the JV game on Monday (also against Wheaton). This was something that even when I coached made us play the starters longer then we would have liked many times. So while you are trying to develop continuity and strength with your upper classmen and teaching them about finishing drives, not turning the ball over, and trying to get something going for the following week it is fine to play your starting line up throughout the entire game.  You don't go through a million off season work outs and camps to be rewarded drinking water on the sideline to avoid the embarrassment of not executing a game plan (I know this from the dark ages of EC football that I played in). Get back out there son and hit somebody and get better. This also while trying to maintain your recruiting promises that your freshman (45 of them on their roster I believe) will be able to play a full JV game schedule so they mature and have success in the future and actually have some fun because they not have CCIW bodies yet.  So while saying that they are classless be careful because he is fulfilling his promise to the kids and the parents that they will be able to play a full game on Monday and not mop up duty on the last drive of the game. Integrity to his recruits, the parents, and to the other coaches in the CCIW by not slipping players into the game and then also playing them on a Monday. He defines class.

As for the kid getting hurt on the last play. I feel horrible for any athlete that gets hurt. It could have been the first play or the last play. Injuries can be avoided one way in football. Put on the toga suit and go cheer in the stands or put on the mascot uniform. There you are safe. Would it had been better if it was the freshman who came in for one play and then got hurt? Better for the team but look at it from that kids standpoint.  I went in down three touchdowns and now I am hurt. It goes both ways.

The fact is we got off the bus but on the opening kickoff we got a flat with their long return and quick TD. 3 scores later the kids woke up and it was too late.

A little angry today and sorry Mugsy you  hit a button and after being on the inside and seeing three regimes (the one I played in, coaching with Coach Journell, and when I coached with Coach Lester) be careful making assumptions without proper information.

[hazzben]

I don't know if you realize this but if you step foot on the field on Saturday you can not play in the JV game on Monday (also against Wheaton).

Is this a conference rule or just an Elmhurst rule?

[Mugsy]

Elmhurst plays their 1st team for the entire game.  Even when down by 28 with 10 minutes left in the game.  Makes the game look more respectable, but give no game experience to the subs.  Not sure I agree with Coach Lester's thinking.

Scottie Williams ends up with almost 200 yards rushing, 70 on reserves.  Elmhurst with 490 yards offense, 170 yards on reserves. 

Bogus if you ask me.

<update>:  Elmhurst losses one of their starting receivers on the last play of the game with an ankle injury.  Now he likely won't be available for game next week against IWU.  All to make a game look closer.  Stupid if you ask me.

Mugsy, I have to disagree with you on a few points here. Coach Lester is a very classy coach and before you start calling people out Wheaton was throwing the ball when they were up 4 touchdowns so don't throw stones.

I was a coach at EC for 5 years which included 1 year with Coach Lester, while also an ex player and alum from the 97,98,99 and 2000 football seasons. Coach Lester defines class in everything he has done and will continue to do with the program as well as the rest of the staff. While most of the other coaches in the conference are negative recruiting he said to us if he ever hears us say one bad word about another school or coach we would be fired on the spot.  This while our recruits would send us emails from other coaches in the conference showing us what the lies they said or wrote about EC. When trying to build a team from a consistent 500 team to an upper tier program you have to develop your freshman and sophomores. I don't know if you realize this but if you step foot on the field on Saturday you can not play in the JV game on Monday (also against Wheaton). This was something that even when I coached made us play the starters longer then we would have liked many times. So while you are trying to develop continuity and strength with your upper classmen and teaching them about finishing drives, not turning the ball over, and trying to get something going for the following week it is fine to play your starting line up throughout the entire game.  You don't go through a million off season work outs and camps to be rewarded drinking water on the sideline to avoid the embarrassment of not executing a game plan (I know this from the dark ages of EC football that I played in). Get back out there son and hit somebody and get better. This also while trying to maintain your recruiting promises that your freshman (45 of them on their roster I believe) will be able to play a full JV game schedule so they mature and have success in the future and actually have some fun because they not have CCIW bodies yet.  So while saying that they are classless be careful because he is fulfilling his promise to the kids and the parents that they will be able to play a full game on Monday and not mop up duty on the last drive of the game. Integrity to his recruits, the parents, and to the other coaches in the CCIW by not slipping players into the game and then also playing them on a Monday. He defines class.

As for the kid getting hurt on the last play. I feel horrible for any athlete that gets hurt. It could have been the first play or the last play. Injuries can be avoided one way in football. Put on the toga suit and go cheer in the stands or put on the mascot uniform. There you are safe. Would it had been better if it was the freshman who came in for one play and then got hurt? Better for the team but look at it from that kids standpoint.  I went in down three touchdowns and now I am hurt. It goes both ways.

The fact is we got off the bus but on the opening kickoff we got a flat with their long return and quick TD. 3 scores later the kids woke up and it was too late.

A little angry today and sorry Mugsy you  hit a button and after being on the inside and seeing three regimes (the one I played in, coaching with Coach Journell, and when I coached with Coach Lester) be careful making assumptions without proper information.

Tell me, where exactly did I say classless in my post?  Where did I question Coach Lester's integrity?  I did not know Coach Lesters reasoning for playing his starters for the entire game, but I do not know another coach in the past 25 years who has done so.  Thanks for the insight as to why he does, btw. 

I questioned playing his starters for the entire game, because it was my opinion.  Yes I used "stupid", which is regrettable.   But here are my reasons for not agreeing with Coach Lester's philosopy:

   1) I think it would be better to play his 2nd string to give them real game experience (and yes as a former player and 5 years as a coach at Wheaton, I do know the rules on playing JV games, but nothing compares to the experience and speed of a varsity game).  You need to have you're 2nd team ready to play, because all it takes is one play and your starter is gone for the season. I understand the point about saving players for the JV game, but only for those 3rd string on down.  2nd string needs to be ready for varisty play.  Just my opinion...  Oh, many of the 2nd string players typically are already out of consideration for JV games because they make up a considerable part of the special teams.
   2) It would protect against injurying his starters when the game was well in hand.  Down 28 with 10 minutes left, it is highly unlikely the game would turn.  The focus should turn to giving the 2nd team experience, but also to preserving your starters for the remaining 5 games.  If Elmhurst wins those 5 games, they would likely win the CCIW.  But by playing the starters, he risk injuring those who need to be ready for the remaining games.  In fact they lost a receiver on the last play of the game.  Tell me, what happens to Elmhurst's chances to finish in the top of the CCIW if Scottie Williams blows out his knee with under 5 minutes left in a 20+ point blow out?

Yep... Wheaton kept throwing the ball in the 4th quarter, with 13 minutes left, but with their 2nd and 3rd string players.  The 2nd string was practicing the same game plan all week, so it would figure that with 13 minutes left in the game, the coaches would want to see how well the subs execute the same game plan.  Did Wheaton throw trick plays, bombs, etc... with the 2nd team or did they run the exact same ball control scheme?  Let's see how they execute the plan, especially against the 1st string Elmhurst team.

I will also point out that Wheaton only had 18 rushes for the game until the 2nd team played.  I'm going to look at the play by play, but I'm willing to bet over 70% of the Wheaton plays from the 10 minute mark on were runs.  I'll bet the 3rd string RB had as many rushes as the starter.  I'll respond once I have the compiled this list.

Sure, I was upset that Elmhurst "ran up the stats" when the game was out of hand, but that is the defensive coach and player in me.

You tell me that I shouldn't make assumptions, but you shouldn't put words in my mouth (or post).  Tell me where I called anyone classless?  You can question my opinions all you want, that in large part is what happens on this board.  But don't question my integrity, saying I'm calling someone classless when I never posted that.

[Pat Coleman]

... before you start calling people out Wheaton was throwing the ball when they were up 4 touchdowns so don't throw stones.

It's a crime to throw when up by just four touchdowns? Really? Elmhurst did last week, up by four and up by five TDs:

http://www.d3football.com/seasons/2011/boxscores/20111001_zybd.xml?view=plays#qtr3

[Mugsy]

Ok here is Wheaton's play-by-play offensively from the 13:05 point of the 4th quarter when all starters were removed.

Kuhn was the 2nd string QB (or 3rd string if you factor in Jordan Roberts season ending injury).  Would Kuhn really be ready to step into varsity action if all he played was JV games?  Anyway...

Drive #1:
Kuhn 11 yard pass to Thorson (TE, his 1st reception of the year)
Kuhn 5 yard pass to Thorson
RB Geary 4 yard run
RB Geary 3 yard run
Kuhn 5 yard pass to Kemp
Hibbler -7 yard run
Kuhn pass INT

Drive #2:
Kuhn 6 yard run
Geary 6 yard run
Geary 6 yard run
Sjelin 1 yard run
Kuhn 9 yard run
Sjelin -4 yard run
Sjelin 1 yard run
Kuhn 1 yard run

So with Wheaton subs that is 4 passes and 11 rushes (including 8 in row on the last drive).  That is a 73% to 27% run to pass ratio.  Oh and the passes, 3-4 for 21 yards and 1 INT.  That is airing it out and running up the score, eh?

Wheaton had 20 rushes total by starters (including 5 by Watkins out of the wildcat) and 46 passes.  That is 30% to 70% run to pass ratio.

Wheaton's leading rusher only had 12 carries, the sub RB's had 13.

[Mugsy]

Ok... on a more positive note:

Over 60 first downs and 1000 yards of offense.  Makes my defensive mindset cringe...

Top players of the game:
RUSHING            No.  Gain  Loss  Net  TD  Lg  Avg. 
Williams, Scottie  26   194   0      194  0    21  7.5  (though 70 yards of this against 2nd team)

Scottie Williams is an incredible athlete.  Quick, illusive and surprisingly hard runner. Clearly the best RB in the conference.

PASSING          Cmp-Att-Int  Yds  TD  Long  Sack 
Meador, Garrett  31-45-0      422   4    59      0 

Wow... huge game for Garrett.  Big credit to the patch work O-Line of Wheaton, who gave Garrett all day to pass. 0 sacks allowed on 50 pass attempts.

RECEIVING        No.  Yds  TD  Lg 
Zeller, Justin      9    124  1  25 
Watkins, Teddy  7    140  2  59 
Hiben, Mark       6    103  1  28

3 Wheaton receivers with at least 6 catches and 100 yards.

Scott Roche with 3 more FG's, that is 11 for the season in 5 games.

Wheaton defense with 6 sacks for the game (JD East with 2, Ramsey with 1.5)

[Mugsy]

Wow... NCC only winning 7-0 over Augie at the half in Naperville. 

[Mugsy]

It is 10-3 NCC with only 15 seconds left in the 3rd quarter.

Augie with only 122 yards offense, NCC with 315.  NCC with 9 penalties for 83 yards in 3 quarters. NCC with nearly twice as many offensive plays, 60 to 32.   NCC with 18 first downs, Augie only 4. So score is a lot closer than stats suggest.

Trying to figure out why NCC doesn't have more points.  No turnovers?  Only one failed 4th down.  1 of 3 on FG's

Hmm... 5 of 12 on 3rd downs with 13 of 28 passing?

[shepherd]

Listening to NCC on my radio and the delayed video.  The North Central announcer made me spit pop as the Augie QB was throwing to the corner and he says "as far as I'm concerned that was out of bounds."  I must say in my opinion the NCC play by play is getting better every week.  That guy can be pretty funny sometimes.

[bluejay4ever]

Mugsy you are correct as you never said Coach Lester or Elmhurst was classless today. I am sorry but after sitting in the sun today in that "everything is wonderful city of yours" watching my guys take it on the chin, I must have been seeing something that wasn't there on your post. I do apologize and I was wrong putting that sentence into your mouth (or Post) when you did not say that.

I understand your points but if you look at the truth of what was going on the 1st team players and the second team players were rotating pretty regularly. Some of the O Lineman was also changed in that 4th quarter at times. I do believe that Elmhurst was playing their main starters less while getting them work while still getting  many more players involved then if it were a tight game. At WR and RB Elmhurst plays a lot of players. They continually rotate in at wide receiver so although you may see someone on the starting line up sheet it is not unusual to see 7 or 8 deep play in a game. Many of the "second team"players you are referring to are regulars as well. It is how the offensive system works.

As for Pat Coleman who posted Elmhurst through up 4 TD's last week as well. I never have a problem with it, nor did I say I had a problem with it today when Wheaton did  it. Its football. When we played in the park as kids did you ever stop scoring because you were up by a lot.. probably not. It was just a counter point to leaving your starters in by Mugsy. One can portray as something being an unwritten rule when in fact there is no such thing.

HAZZ Been the rule if I remember it correctly (mugsy help me out here), is I believe you only get 10 game participations (not including post season). EC has a full JV schedule of 5 or 6 games I believe. In the non conference most of those players play regardless so playing the freshman in conference games is tough to do and still get them full games on JV. Also you do not want to count a game if all of a sudden week seven you get a whole bunch of injuries and you use a guy on a Saturday and a Monday as you get to 10 really quickly. EC has always tried to separate the two so there was never a close area crossed. Also like many teams some of the primary back ups are a banged up as it is so it is a tough call to say to a starter to sit and play a freshman and lose that game for them on JV. It's a constant battle of win today but build for the future.

Either way I took some advil and the cramps of my period must be subsiding. Just when you bleed blue sometimes you come out looking like you got in a car accident. We are so close to taking that next step and it eats me up inside on days like today.