FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[badgerwarhawk]

Great catch, NewTradition...Fletcher is probably one of the most underrated players around the league because he's never had the good fortune to play for a winner.  He's one of those guys that I would love to see sign with a winning team late in his career as a leader/lockerroom guy, just because a guy like that deserves at least one chance to suit up in the playoffs.

London Fletcher has had more than one chance to suit up in the playoffs and play for a winner.  He played in two Super Bowls with the Rams (1999, 2001).  The Rams were 16-3 both of those years. 

[iwu70]

I also don't get why Wheaton is ranked about IWU, after our head-to-head win over them, (road or home shouldn't matter) and the same records.  I 'll still be pulling for Wheaton this weekend so our Titans can hopefully share the CCIW crown.  But, don't expect it.  I also feel NCC will win, perhaps by more than 13 points.  TITANS need to play much better this weekend to beat Carthage on the road.  Last week at MU was not very impressive.  Would be nice if all three top CCIW teams make the playoffs.  What is the chance of that? 

[ExTartanPlayer]

Great catch, NewTradition...Fletcher is probably one of the most underrated players around the league because he's never had the good fortune to play for a winner.  He's one of those guys that I would love to see sign with a winning team late in his career as a leader/lockerroom guy, just because a guy like that deserves at least one chance to suit up in the playoffs.

London Fletcher has had more than one chance to suit up in the playoffs and play for a winner.  He played in two Super Bowls with the Rams (1999, 2001).  The Rams were 16-3 both of those years.

Correct; I apologize for the error.  I probably should have written that he hasn't been able to do so recently, and that he deserves "one last shot" to suit up for the playoffs.

I do think that he's the NFL player with the longest active streak of "games played without a playoff appearance" just because that was so long ago.

[ncc58]

Would be nice if all three top CCIW teams make the playoffs.  What is the chance of that?

I would say 0. After this weekend, either Wheaton or NCC will have 2 losses. Neither of them has a strong enough resume to be selected over a 1 loss team.

[NCF]

Would be nice if all three top CCIW teams make the playoffs.  What is the chance of that?

I would say 0. After this weekend, either Wheaton or NCC will have 2 losses. Neither of them has a strong enough resume to be selected over a 1 loss team.

Even if NC loses by less than 14, I don't see three CCIW teams getting in, but stranger things have happened.

[Mugsy]

Would be nice if all three top CCIW teams make the playoffs.  What is the chance of that?

I would say 0. After this weekend, either Wheaton or NCC will have 2 losses. Neither of them has a strong enough resume to be selected over a 1 loss team.

It is not 0.  Very, very low, but not 0 and not by the logic you listed above.

This has been posted several times both here and on the Pool C board.  If Wheaton wins this weekend and all 3 of the top teams (SoDup, IWU and Wheaton) win out in the remaining games, then all 3 would be 6-1 in conference and hence Co-Champs.  However the automatic qualifier would decided upon a list of criteria that starts with point differential in head to head games, which likely would give SoDup the nod given they beat IWU by 24 points.

Yes SoDup would be 8-2 but they would likely get the AQ.  That would leave IWU and Wheaton at 9-1, with very strong strength of schedules and wins against high ranking in region opponents.  It then comes down to how likely it would be to get both IWU and Wheaton into Pool C slots, of which there are only 6 total.  Possible... but a stretch.

Again... it requires:
1. A Wheaton win over SoDup, which most don't see happening
2. SoDup, IWU and Wheaton winning out the remaining games in week 10 & 11.
3. Likely a number of 1 loss teams around the country losing so that the committee could consider two pool C slots from the CCIW.

[NCF]

Would be nice if all three top CCIW teams make the playoffs.  What is the chance of that?

I would say 0. After this weekend, either Wheaton or NCC will have 2 losses. Neither of them has a strong enough resume to be selected over a 1 loss team.

It is not 0.  Very, very low, but not 0 and not by the logic you listed above.

This has been posted several times both here and on the Pool C board.  If Wheaton wins this weekend and all 3 of the top teams (SoDup, IWU and Wheaton) win out in the remaining games, then all 3 would be 6-1 in conference and hence Co-Champs.  However the automatic qualifier would decided upon a list of criteria that starts with point differential in head to head games, which likely would give SoDup the nod given they beat IWU by 24 points.

Yes SoDup would be 8-2 but they would likely get the AQ.  That would leave IWU and Wheaton at 9-1, with very strong strength of schedules and wins against high ranking in region opponents.  It then comes down to how likely it would be to get both IWU and Wheaton into Pool C slots, of which there are only 6 total.  Possible... but a stretch.

Again... it requires:
1. A Wheaton win over SoDup, which most don't see happening
2. SoDup, IWU and Wheaton winning out the remaining games in week 10 & 11.
3. Likely a number of 1 loss teams around the country losing so that the committee could consider two pool C slots from the CCIW.

Do you really think that the CCIW would get three bids, when the AQ would have two losses and beat one of the co-champs by 24? I see two bids for sure, three a very, very, long shot.

[Mugsy]

Would be nice if all three top CCIW teams make the playoffs.  What is the chance of that?

I would say 0. After this weekend, either Wheaton or NCC will have 2 losses. Neither of them has a strong enough resume to be selected over a 1 loss team.

It is not 0.  Very, very low, but not 0 and not by the logic you listed above.

This has been posted several times both here and on the Pool C board.  If Wheaton wins this weekend and all 3 of the top teams (SoDup, IWU and Wheaton) win out in the remaining games, then all 3 would be 6-1 in conference and hence Co-Champs.  However the automatic qualifier would decided upon a list of criteria that starts with point differential in head to head games, which likely would give SoDup the nod given they beat IWU by 24 points.

Yes SoDup would be 8-2 but they would likely get the AQ.  That would leave IWU and Wheaton at 9-1, with very strong strength of schedules and wins against high ranking in region opponents.  It then comes down to how likely it would be to get both IWU and Wheaton into Pool C slots, of which there are only 6 total.  Possible... but a stretch.

Again... it requires:
1. A Wheaton win over SoDup, which most don't see happening
2. SoDup, IWU and Wheaton winning out the remaining games in week 10 & 11.
3. Likely a number of 1 loss teams around the country losing so that the committee could consider two pool C slots from the CCIW.

Do you really think that the CCIW would get three bids, when the AQ would have two losses and beat one of the co-champs by 24? I see two bids for sure, three a very, very, long shot.

Didn't I say that it would be a very, very low chance of happening?  It is not likely, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible.  Remember all three are currently list as top 25 teams.  That would not change with a Wheaton victory over SoDup, IMO.  SoDup would not drop out of the top 25 with a loss to Wheaton from #6, just as UWO was still ranked with 2 losses.

It starts with this weekend.  Wheaton would need to pull off a pretty reasonable upset.

I remember almost everyone saying Wheaton's season was over in 2008 because they were 8-2.  Yet they were the surprise last time voted in and promptly went to the semi-finals.  Still a lot that can happen in the remaining weeks that will cause all kinds of ebbs and flow for Pool C candidates.  But the possibility is not 0%.

[NCF]

Would be nice if all three top CCIW teams make the playoffs.  What is the chance of that?

I would say 0. After this weekend, either Wheaton or NCC will have 2 losses. Neither of them has a strong enough resume to be selected over a 1 loss team.

It is not 0.  Very, very low, but not 0 and not by the logic you listed above.

This has been posted several times both here and on the Pool C board.  If Wheaton wins this weekend and all 3 of the top teams (SoDup, IWU and Wheaton) win out in the remaining games, then all 3 would be 6-1 in conference and hence Co-Champs.  However the automatic qualifier would decided upon a list of criteria that starts with point differential in head to head games, which likely would give SoDup the nod given they beat IWU by 24 points.

Yes SoDup would be 8-2 but they would likely get the AQ.  That would leave IWU and Wheaton at 9-1, with very strong strength of schedules and wins against high ranking in region opponents.  It then comes down to how likely it would be to get both IWU and Wheaton into Pool C slots, of which there are only 6 total.  Possible... but a stretch.

Again... it requires:
1. A Wheaton win over SoDup, which most don't see happening
2. SoDup, IWU and Wheaton winning out the remaining games in week 10 & 11.
3. Likely a number of 1 loss teams around the country losing so that the committee could consider two pool C slots from the CCIW.

Do you really think that the CCIW would get three bids, when the AQ would have two losses and beat one of the co-champs by 24? I see two bids for sure, three a very, very, long shot.

Didn't I say that it would be a very, very low chance of happening?  It is not likely, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible.  Remember all three are currently list as top 25 teams.  That would not change with a Wheaton victory over SoDup, IMO.  SoDup would not drop out of the top 25 with a loss to Wheaton from #6, just as UWO was still ranked with 2 losses.

It starts with this weekend.  Wheaton would need to pull off a pretty reasonable upset.

I remember almost everyone saying Wheaton's season was over in 2008 because they were 8-2.  Yet they were the surprise last time voted in and promptly went to the semi-finals.  Still a lot that can happen in the remaining weeks that will cause all kinds of ebbs and flow for Pool C candidates.  But the possibility is not 0%.

.

I would be surprised to see three CCIW teams in the play-offs, that's all i'm sayin. With a loss to Wheaton (and I wouldn't be surprised if NC were one of the teams  chosen as the most likely to be upset) and a loss to Redlands, NC would need to be the AQ to go. NC needs to win to lock up a spot and a decent seed.

[hazzben]

Studebaker comes up with a huge fumble recovery on MNFB and has his pick on the home page of ESPN and Sports Illustrated!

Living in KC, it's great to see him do well. Kansas and Mizzou have almost no DIII presence so most people have no concept of the quality of play at our level. (KC is also dominated by 3 FBS schools and home to 2 very good DII schools) It's great to be able to point to a player on the Chiefs roster and say, that is the type of player DIII is capable of producing. 

Beat me to it...I love seeing the D-III schools represented in the NFL.

Who's the best Division III alum currently playing in the NFL?  Off the top of my head, I can think of Fred Jackson (Coe/Bills), Studebaker (Wheaton/Chiefs), and Pierre Garcon (Mt. Union/Colts).

Well, they're all playing in the NFL, so at one level, let's start by just saying they all deserve tons of cred.

But if I had to pick the best, I'd say London Fletcher gets the nod for longevity of excellent play. He's been playing at an incredibly high level for well over a decade. He was even mentioned in Peter King's MMQB as a new 'standard' for ILB, as a guy who can play 3 downs because of his superior coverage skills. Simply one of the most underrated players in the league. And that's said about a guy who has made some Pro Bowls!

If we're talking strictly the best player this season, I don't know how you could argue for anyone but Fred Jackson. He's having an All Pro caliber season right now. He and Adrian Peterson would be my votes for best RB's in the league. If Fred continues to play like he has the last few years, I'd give him the nod over anyone. He's playing at the same level Thurmon Thomas did back in the day for the Bills, and that is some serious praise.

[badgerwarhawk]

Would be nice if all three top CCIW teams make the playoffs.  What is the chance of that?

I would say 0. After this weekend, either Wheaton or NCC will have 2 losses. Neither of them has a strong enough resume to be selected over a 1 loss team.

It is not 0.  Very, very low, but not 0 and not by the logic you listed above.

This has been posted several times both here and on the Pool C board.  If Wheaton wins this weekend and all 3 of the top teams (SoDup, IWU and Wheaton) win out in the remaining games, then all 3 would be 6-1 in conference and hence Co-Champs.  However the automatic qualifier would decided upon a list of criteria that starts with point differential in head to head games, which likely would give SoDup the nod given they beat IWU by 24 points.

Yes SoDup would be 8-2 but they would likely get the AQ.  That would leave IWU and Wheaton at 9-1, with very strong strength of schedules and wins against high ranking in region opponents.  It then comes down to how likely it would be to get both IWU and Wheaton into Pool C slots, of which there are only 6 total.  Possible... but a stretch.

Again... it requires:
1. A Wheaton win over SoDup, which most don't see happening
2. SoDup, IWU and Wheaton winning out the remaining games in week 10 & 11.
3. Likely a number of 1 loss teams around the country losing so that the committee could consider two pool C slots from the CCIW.

Do you really think that the CCIW would get three bids, when the AQ would have two losses and beat one of the co-champs by 24? I see two bids for sure, three a very, very, long shot.

Didn't I say that it would be a very, very low chance of happening?  It is not likely, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible.  Remember all three are currently list as top 25 teams.  That would not change with a Wheaton victory over SoDup, IMO.  SoDup would not drop out of the top 25 with a loss to Wheaton from #6, just as UWO was still ranked with 2 losses.

It starts with this weekend.  Wheaton would need to pull off a pretty reasonable upset.

I remember almost everyone saying Wheaton's season was over in 2008 because they were 8-2.  Yet they were the surprise last time voted in and promptly went to the semi-finals.  Still a lot that can happen in the remaining weeks that will cause all kinds of ebbs and flow for Pool C candidates.  But the possibility is not 0%.

.

I would be surprised to see three CCIW teams in the play-offs, that's all i'm sayin. With a loss to Wheaton (and I wouldn't be surprised if NC were one of the teams  chosen as the most likely to be upset) and a loss to Redlands, NC would need to be the AQ to go. NC needs to win to lock up a spot and a decent seed.

On another board Pat mentioned that three teams from the same conference have made the playoffs, in their current format, on one occassion.  They all were co-champions of the league and the worst of the three received the conference's automatic bid. 

[robertgoulet]

Would be nice if all three top CCIW teams make the playoffs.  What is the chance of that?

I would say 0. After this weekend, either Wheaton or NCC will have 2 losses. Neither of them has a strong enough resume to be selected over a 1 loss team.

It is not 0.  Very, very low, but not 0 and not by the logic you listed above.

This has been posted several times both here and on the Pool C board.  If Wheaton wins this weekend and all 3 of the top teams (SoDup, IWU and Wheaton) win out in the remaining games, then all 3 would be 6-1 in conference and hence Co-Champs.  However the automatic qualifier would decided upon a list of criteria that starts with point differential in head to head games, which likely would give SoDup the nod given they beat IWU by 24 points.

Yes SoDup would be 8-2 but they would likely get the AQ.  That would leave IWU and Wheaton at 9-1, with very strong strength of schedules and wins against high ranking in region opponents.  It then comes down to how likely it would be to get both IWU and Wheaton into Pool C slots, of which there are only 6 total.  Possible... but a stretch.

Again... it requires:
1. A Wheaton win over SoDup, which most don't see happening
2. SoDup, IWU and Wheaton winning out the remaining games in week 10 & 11.
3. Likely a number of 1 loss teams around the country losing so that the committee could consider two pool C slots from the CCIW.

Do you really think that the CCIW would get three bids, when the AQ would have two losses and beat one of the co-champs by 24? I see two bids for sure, three a very, very, long shot.

Didn't I say that it would be a very, very low chance of happening?  It is not likely, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible.  Remember all three are currently list as top 25 teams.  That would not change with a Wheaton victory over SoDup, IMO.  SoDup would not drop out of the top 25 with a loss to Wheaton from #6, just as UWO was still ranked with 2 losses.

It starts with this weekend.  Wheaton would need to pull off a pretty reasonable upset.

I remember almost everyone saying Wheaton's season was over in 2008 because they were 8-2.  Yet they were the surprise last time voted in and promptly went to the semi-finals.  Still a lot that can happen in the remaining weeks that will cause all kinds of ebbs and flow for Pool C candidates.  But the possibility is not 0%.

.

I would be surprised to see three CCIW teams in the play-offs, that's all i'm sayin. With a loss to Wheaton (and I wouldn't be surprised if NC were one of the teams  chosen as the most likely to be upset) and a loss to Redlands, NC would need to be the AQ to go. NC needs to win to lock up a spot and a decent seed.

Actually, NCC can lose to the Breakfast of Champions and still get the conference AQ...they just can't lose by more than 17 (I believe that is the tie breaker spread at the moment).

[Gregory Sager]

This is the first time I've been on the computer since Saturday morning, and I've been sitting here trying to think of what to say about NPU's loss to Carthage. Simply put, it was the most painful loss I've ever seen North Park football endure -- and over the years I've sat through enough 57-0 pastings with the Vikings on the goose-egg end to know what "painful loss" means -- and one of the three or four most painful losses I've ever seen North Park suffer in any sport in my thirty-plus years of following North Park athletics.

The Vikings had this game won, and then they handed it back. Never mind NPU's statistical dominance (394 offensive yards to 335; 36 minutes of possession to Carthage's 24), the Vikings had the Red Men on the ropes, plain and simple. Give credit to Carthage for coming back from a 14-0 halftime deficit and for erasing two other second-half NPU leads -- the Red Men never quit, and they managed to scrape together a pretty decent offensive effort in that second half despite not really having a great array of weapons -- but the game should've ended with North Park snapping that abominable CCIW losing streak. Up 28-24 with a little over three minutes remaining, the Vikings had the ball and faced a 2nd and 4 on the Carthage 40. As Scott Pethtel said afterwards, all that NPU had to do was run simple line dives from that point onward. Even if the Vikings had failed to pick up a first down, they still would've been able to send in punter Mark Howard to pin the Red Men deep in their own territory, needing a touchdown with, at best, two minutes and change remaining.

And the Vikings fumbled the ball.

It was a bad exchange by Tyler Krebs and Matt Hassan, and it was hard to get angry at either one of them. Both otherwise played tremendous games. Krebs gained 76 yards on 21 carries -- 21 carries is a lot of hits to take when you're 5'7, 175 -- and fought his way into the end zone twice. Hassan had 157 yards on 19 carries, scored once, and was a human battering ram all day long up the middle. Nevertheless, they botched the handoff, Carthage recovered, and drove down the field to score the go-ahead touchdown with 35 seconds left. Even after that face-palm of a turnover, however, NPU still should've stopped the Red Men. Backup QB Trevor Beazley (he started the year as Carthage's third-string quarterback, for those of you keeping score at home) had to complete a 4th-and-3 pass at the NPU 15 in the final minute to keep the drive alive. The Vikings failed to stop him, and then failed to stop Carthage at the goal line as well. It was the ultimate defeat-snatched-from-the-jaws-of-victory experience.

Kudos to Carthage coach Tim Rucks for how he engineered the end-of-game scenario. He could teach a master class in Football Clock Management.

Carthage fought hard to get back into the game and keep it close, but the Red Men never led until there was a half-minute left in the game. NPU should've won that game. NPU didn't. It remains to be seen how the Vikings respond to such an agonizing Senior Day loss.

[bigz61550]

Not sure how Wheaton is ranked higher than IWU with IWU winning the head to head and their only loss is to a team ranked higher than both of them.

So if Wheaton wins Saturday, where do you rank the three teams?

I think you may see Wheaton ranked ahead of both teams in the polls and the regional rankings.

I think many believe if Wheaton & IWU were to play 10 times Wheaton would win 8-9 of them.  Wheaton is the better team who got beat in a close game on the road.

I saw the IWU/Wheaton game and, as a Wheaton fan, I believe Wheaton could play much better; but I think the IWU effort was also a factor in Wheaton playing poorly.  I'm not sure who would win the majority if they played ten times, but it would be fun to watch!

[NCF]

This is the first time I've been on the computer since Saturday morning, and I've been sitting here trying to think of what to say about NPU's loss to Carthage. Simply put, it was the most painful loss I've ever seen North Park football endure -- and over the years I've sat through enough 57-0 pastings with the Vikings on the goose-egg end to know what "painful loss" means -- and one of the three or four most painful losses I've ever seen North Park suffer in any sport in my thirty-plus years of following North Park athletics.

The Vikings had this game won, and then they handed it back. Never mind NPU's statistical dominance (394 offensive yards to 335; 36 minutes of possession to Carthage's 24), the Vikings had the Red Men on the ropes, plain and simple. Give credit to Carthage for coming back from a 14-0 halftime deficit and for erasing two other second-half NPU leads -- the Red Men never quit, and they managed to scrape together a pretty decent offensive effort in that second half despite not really having a great array of weapons -- but the game should've ended with North Park snapping that abominable CCIW losing streak. Up 28-24 with a little over three minutes remaining, the Vikings had the ball and faced a 2nd and 4 on the Carthage 40. As Scott Pethtel said afterwards, all that NPU had to do was run simple line dives from that point onward. Even if the Vikings had failed to pick up a first down, they still would've been able to send in punter Mark Howard to pin the Red Men deep in their own territory, needing a touchdown with, at best, two minutes and change remaining.

And the Vikings fumbled the ball.

It was a bad exchange by Tyler Krebs and Matt Hassan, and it was hard to get angry at either one of them. Both otherwise played tremendous games. Krebs gained 76 yards on 21 carries -- 21 carries is a lot of hits to take when you're 5'7, 175 -- and fought his way into the end zone twice. Hassan had 157 yards on 19 carries, scored once, and was a human battering ram all day long up the middle. Nevertheless, they botched the handoff, Carthage recovered, and drove down the field to score the go-ahead touchdown with 35 seconds left. Even after that face-palm of a turnover, however, NPU still should've stopped the Red Men. Backup QB Trevor Beazley (he started the year as Carthage's third-string quarterback, for those of you keeping score at home) had to complete a 4th-and-3 pass at the NPU 15 in the final minute to keep the drive alive. The Vikings failed to stop him, and then failed to stop Carthage at the goal line as well. It was the ultimate defeat-snatched-from-the-jaws-of-victory experience.

Kudos to Carthage coach Tim Rucks for how he engineered the end-of-game scenario. He could teach a master class in Football Clock Management.

Carthage fought hard to get back into the game and keep it close, but the Red Men never led until there was a half-minute left in the game. NPU should've won that game. NPU didn't. It remains to be seen how the Vikings respond to such an agonizing Senior Day loss.

I was following the game on live stats and thought for sure North Park was going to win. They will break the streak at some point, hopefully with some of the guys who played their hearts out on Saturday.