FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[USee]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

[iwu70]

Ypsi, has your broom flown off to the city by the Bay?  I feel your pain.

I agree with you on the weird ranking this week for EC, but the regional ranking is more key to the whole situation.  Obviously, some D3 voters just don't follow the CCIW all that closely.  I'm hoping our Titans will have the answer with EC at the end of the season, putting the whining by EC fans into another whole orbit.  Sure hope our Titans regroup this weekend and finish strong in the last two games of the CCIW season.

Congrats to the Titan women for winning their program's first ever CCIW championship in cross-country.  Our track and field women are really doing us proud these past few years.  Women roundball too, of course.

Looking forward to basketball season.

IWU70

[Mugsy]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

[Titan Q]

On IWU assistant football coach Billy Dicken...

http://iwusports.com/news/2012/10/29/FB_1029124754.aspx

[Mugsy]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

Not sure what the point of your comments are in relation to my post (of which you've only taken a portion of).  I don't think anything I've stated is contradictory.

I believe my response to AndOne indicates that I don't think there is a huge separation between Wheaton and NCC passing performance - other than Wheaton is more dependent on their passing attack (and has thus thrown the ball more often). 

Furthermore I've gone out on the record that I think NCC wins this somewhat easily, unless Wheaton does find a way to cash in on uncharacteristic turnovers and "have their best defensive game in several years.".   

[NCF]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

[USee]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

Of course it matters, it just doesn't matter ONLY for Naperville players. Wheaton starters have missed similar time. The statement also assumes that because some starters only play a half they are mythically "missing" opportunities. The reality is they scored 40 pts in a half, didn't play in the second half, and won 52-0. Wheaton players played the whole game and only scored 30 pts in a loss, so the stats are inflated for Wheaton? Of course Naperville players could have stayed in and won 104-0 but Wheaton players could have done the same in 4 of their games. Basically, playing time does have an impact on stats but I believe it affects teams fairly equally over a season. If you think otherwise, you would really have to show some empirical proof (which I have looked for and can't find).

[robertgoulet]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

Of course it matters, it just doesn't matter ONLY for Naperville players. Wheaton starters have missed similar time. The statement also assumes that because some starters only play a half they are mythically "missing" opportunities. The reality is they scored 40 pts in a half, didn't play in the second half, and won 52-0. Wheaton players played the whole game and only scored 30 pts in a loss, so the stats are inflated for Wheaton? Of course Naperville players could have stayed in and won 104-0 but Wheaton players could have done the same in 4 of their games. Basically, playing time does have an impact on stats but I believe it affects teams fairly equally over a season. If you think otherwise, you would really have to show some empirical proof (which I have looked for and can't find).

Can we have this argument when NCC pulls starters at half after being up 42-6 vs Wheaton this weekend? 

Ding. Ding. Ding.

[shepherd]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

Of course it matters, it just doesn't matter ONLY for Naperville players. Wheaton starters have missed similar time. The statement also assumes that because some starters only play a half they are mythically "missing" opportunities. The reality is they scored 40 pts in a half, didn't play in the second half, and won 52-0. Wheaton players played the whole game and only scored 30 pts in a loss, so the stats are inflated for Wheaton? Of course Naperville players could have stayed in and won 104-0 but Wheaton players could have done the same in 4 of their games. Basically, playing time does have an impact on stats but I believe it affects teams fairly equally over a season. If you think otherwise, you would really have to show some empirical proof (which I have looked for and can't find).

Can we have this argument when NCC pulls starters at half after being up 42-6 vs Wheaton this weekend? 

Ding. Ding. Ding.

Don't make me go all Spider Monkey I mean Spider Mugsy all over this board.

[NCF]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

Of course it matters, it just doesn't matter ONLY for Naperville players. Wheaton starters have missed similar time. The statement also assumes that because some starters only play a half they are mythically "missing" opportunities. The reality is they scored 40 pts in a half, didn't play in the second half, and won 52-0. Wheaton players played the whole game and only scored 30 pts in a loss, so the stats are inflated for Wheaton? Of course Naperville players could have stayed in and won 104-0 but Wheaton players could have done the same in 4 of their games. Basically, playing time does have an impact on stats but I believe it affects teams fairly equally over a season. If you think otherwise, you would really have to show some empirical proof (which I have looked for and can't find).

If you are a defensive player and you are pulled after the 3rd quarter (of sometimes earlier), your stats are affected. If I miss five or more quarters a season, I am missing more than one full game of stats. And it affects all players who rarely play a full game, not just NC.

[NCF]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

Of course it matters, it just doesn't matter ONLY for Naperville players. Wheaton starters have missed similar time. The statement also assumes that because some starters only play a half they are mythically "missing" opportunities. The reality is they scored 40 pts in a half, didn't play in the second half, and won 52-0. Wheaton players played the whole game and only scored 30 pts in a loss, so the stats are inflated for Wheaton? Of course Naperville players could have stayed in and won 104-0 but Wheaton players could have done the same in 4 of their games. Basically, playing time does have an impact on stats but I believe it affects teams fairly equally over a season. If you think otherwise, you would really have to show some empirical proof (which I have looked for and can't find).

Can we have this argument when NCC pulls starters at half after being up 42-6 vs Wheaton this weekend? 

Ding. Ding. Ding.

+K hahahahahahaha  Although, I don't think that happens

[Mugsy]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

And Wheaton can't make the same argument?  Case in point Roberts played less than a half in at least 4 games, Hiben missed 3 games outright.

I don't disagree that NCC stats would be significantly higher if starters played every minute of every game.  It is just that Wheaton can make the same argument (perhaps to a little lesser degree) and ultimately the discussion means nothing to the result on Saturday.

[NCF]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

And Wheaton can't make the same argument?  Case in point Roberts played less than a half in at least 4 games, Hiben missed 3 games outright.

I don't disagree that NCC stats would be significantly higher if starters played every minute of every game.  It is just that Wheaton can make the same argument (perhaps to a little lesser degree) and ultimately the discussion means nothing to the result on Saturday.

I never said it would affect the outcome of the game, but it does affect the stats when your starters have not played a full conference game yet this season. Looking forward to a great game on Saturday!

[USee]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

Of course it matters, it just doesn't matter ONLY for Naperville players. Wheaton starters have missed similar time. The statement also assumes that because some starters only play a half they are mythically "missing" opportunities. The reality is they scored 40 pts in a half, didn't play in the second half, and won 52-0. Wheaton players played the whole game and only scored 30 pts in a loss, so the stats are inflated for Wheaton? Of course Naperville players could have stayed in and won 104-0 but Wheaton players could have done the same in 4 of their games. Basically, playing time does have an impact on stats but I believe it affects teams fairly equally over a season. If you think otherwise, you would really have to show some empirical proof (which I have looked for and can't find).

If you are a defensive player and you are pulled after the 3rd quarter (of sometimes earlier), your stats are affected. If I miss five or more quarters a season, I am missing more than one full game of stats. And it affects all players who rarely play a full game, not just NC.

So you are making the same point I made? Or something different? This isn't a new phenomena. We have seen this affect every season. What's your point?

[NCF]

Is Wheaton capable of beating NCC?  Absolutely, but it will take Wheaton cashing in on NCC mistakes (at least 2 or 3 turnovers) and the Wheaton defense playing their best game in several years.

In my heart I'm rooting all the way for Wheaton and I put a lot of faith in the staff and players putting together a solid scheme and executing on it.  At this point in the week my head tells me NCC over Wheaton 42-17.

Agreed, Wheaton is capable of beating NCC. Wheaton is a good team, with very good skilled athletes.  But Wheaton has to do what no other team has done - force turnovers and protect the ball.

The stats are interesting. What they don't account for is the large margins that NCC has had over Elmhurst, IWU, and Millikin. In those games, NCC played mostly 2s and 3s in the fourth quarter in those games. So, the offensive stats especially would be more gaudy. Roberts has earned a lot of praise for his play this season. Stanek has quietly had a very good season, after the game 1 disaster. His stats compare well against the passing numbers that Wheaton has put up.

I have heard and seen the argument about teams blowing other teams out and playing 2's/3s, etc.  I don't think it is represented in any data. Wheaton had blowouts v Benedictine, Luther, Augie, Carthage, etc. I just don't think the data supports a claim that Napervilles' starters are somehow better than they appear. It balances out over games and a season.

Absolutely agree on this statement by USee.  You can't make the argument exclusive to NCC that their stats would be "X% better because their staters haven't played full games.

I wouldn't place a percentage on how better the stats would be, but if a starter has missed five quarters of the conference season (so far), that's a lot of stats that guy could have been accumulating had he been playing and not sitting. It would definitely have an affect on the teams overall stats. In the long run the only thing that matters is to keep winning.

Of course it matters, it just doesn't matter ONLY for Naperville players. Wheaton starters have missed similar time. The statement also assumes that because some starters only play a half they are mythically "missing" opportunities. The reality is they scored 40 pts in a half, didn't play in the second half, and won 52-0. Wheaton players played the whole game and only scored 30 pts in a loss, so the stats are inflated for Wheaton? Of course Naperville players could have stayed in and won 104-0 but Wheaton players could have done the same in 4 of their games. Basically, playing time does have an impact on stats but I believe it affects teams fairly equally over a season. If you think otherwise, you would really have to show some empirical proof (which I have looked for and can't find).

If you are a defensive player and you are pulled after the 3rd quarter (of sometimes earlier), your stats are affected. If I miss five or more quarters a season, I am missing more than one full game of stats. And it affects all players who rarely play a full game, not just NC.

So you are making the same point I made? Or something different? This isn't a new phenomena. We have seen this affect every season. What's your point?

As much as I'd like to say something I'll regret, I'll let it go. Saturday can't come soon enough.