FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Gregory Sager]

Deadspin running with the story now. Not good pub for Wheaton even if they end up exonerated.

Deadspin running with this was a foregone conclusion since Wheaton is a conservative Christian school.   

Exactly. This is catnip for a site like Deadspin.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Don't forget another nugget of info: the story of those who found the two victims, while looking for the second, and took them back to campus along with the evidence gathered at the hospital (not to mention two surgeries to fix injuries sustained). The "other side's" argument it never happened should be fascinating.

[smedindy]

Injuries usually don't happen with mere 'hazing'....

[smedindy]

If this is a cover-up, or a small punishment was given out before this came to light, then Wheaton is no better than Baylor - putting the health of students at risk for the benefit of their athletics program.

Filing felony charges isn't a whim....

[AndOne]

I'm not sure if this has been addressed. Why has so much time elapsed between the actual event and the filing of charges? Has the police dept been searching for convictable evidence all this time?

Is it possible an agreement was reached last year and for some reason that agreement was broken?

As was somewhat delineated previously, in a county with the case load as high as DuPage, it can take this amount of time to interview all witnesses, complete reports, have the reports reviewed and a decision made as to what charges will be filed. In this case the accused students, the victim, other students in the dorm at the time of the alleged incident, other football players, possibly coaches, probably copis of Wheaton's internal investigation, and hospital personal all needed to be contacted/interviewed/obtained. Hospital records also needed to be obtained and the hospital may have required police to obtain a subpoena before they would release any of their medical reports. Lastly, the States Attorney is going to take his time and be sure he feels he has a pretty strong case before making a final decision to proceed with filing the complaint/charges. All this takes time.

Also, as far as your question about an agreement possibly being broken, this wouldn't happen.
The States Attorney would never make a deal accepting a one football game suspension in place of possible criminal charges, felonies at that, being brought. And, on the minuscule chance that a Plea Agreement was made, my understanding is that it would be illegal to rescind that Agreement unless new evidence was uncovered. Lastly, any in house "agreement" between Wheaton College and the players would not be binding upon the States Attorney office and their possible filing of criminal charges as has now been done.

If this is a cover-up, or a small punishment was given out before this came to light, then Wheaton is no better than Baylor - putting the health of students at risk for the benefit of their athletics program.

Filing felony charges isn't a whim....

As I attempted to point out above. 😏

[emma17]

The injury thing is another stumper to me. Shoulder surgery on both shoulders due to the incident?
I'm no attorney but I do play in the world of insurance. When is the last time you visited a doctor for an injury without your insurance company asking if another party was at fault? If an insurance carrier had to pay the bill, they would look to subrogate. Certainly the victim wouldn't have picked up the deductible and coinsurance- someone had to pay the bill. 

[AndOne]

Don't forget another nugget of info: the story of those who found the two victims, while looking for the second, and took them back to campus along with the evidence gathered at the hospital (not to mention two surgeries to fix injuries sustained). The "other side's" argument it never happened should be fascinating.

Very good point Dave. I think we all missed that one previously.

[Gregory Sager]

My pro-Wheaton source claimed that the kid showed up at Wheaton with two bad shoulders, and that the kid's roommate signed an affidavit to that effect.

[Capn34]

My pro-Wheaton source claimed that the kid showed up at Wheaton with two bad shoulders, and that the kid's roommate signed an affidavit to that effect.

Could the Allegd hazing make the shoulders worse?  Really irrelevant if the allegations are true.  Seems like some people are doing the same thing when woman accuses a star of rape...lets go after the victim. 

As a fan of D3 football this sucks if true.  I think the bigger issue for the Wheaton Football program and specifically the coach is this is added to the KKK incident from a couple years ago.  Wheaton has to ask itself some deep questions about the culture within the football program.  From an outsider it doesn't look like it aligns with the schools mission. 

[Gregory Sager]

My pro-Wheaton source claimed that the kid showed up at Wheaton with two bad shoulders, and that the kid's roommate signed an affidavit to that effect.

Could the Allegd hazing make the shoulders worse?  Really irrelevant if the allegations are true.  Seems like some people are doing the same thing when woman accuses a star of rape...lets go after the victim. 

I raised that same point myself.

Again, I'm not coming down on one side or the other. Several people here have brought up the injuries to the kid's shoulders, and I'm just reporting the rebuttal to that aspect of the case that I've been given.

[OzJohnnie]

A bit early for people to be taking sides, no?  I suggest waiting to see where the prosecution leads before getting too settled into a corner.  Yes, it's hard to believe the DA would raise felony charges without good cause (don't they need to be grand juried?) and it's equally hard to believe that Wheaton would fail to recognize and properly manage events so serious.

So there is a whole lot of revealing still to go on that choosing sides has no effect on (although it is certainly emotionally satisfying).  Hold your horses folks and see what happens.  The next big event will be the students turning themselves in and being arraigned.  Then we'll get pleas or a trial.  Either is good. Until then it's arguing for no purpose, no?

[Capn34]

Looks like Wheaton just suspended the players
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-wheaton-college-hazing-met-20170919-story.html

[AndOne]

My pro-Wheaton source claimed that the kid showed up at Wheaton with two bad shoulders, and that the kid's roommate signed an affidavit to that effect.

Could the Allegd hazing make the shoulders worse?  Really irrelevant if the allegations are true.  Seems like some people are doing the same thing when woman accuses a star of rape...lets go after the victim. 

As a fan of D3 football this sucks if true.  I think the bigger issue for the Wheaton Football program and specifically the coach is this is added to the KKK incident from a couple years ago.  Wheaton has to ask itself some deep questions about the culture within the football program.  From an outsider it doesn't look like it aligns with the schools mission.

This fraction of the investigation is where medical professionals come into play with regard to answering the question of what is known as primary vs cooperative cause.

If the victim showed up with 2 injured shoulders how was he able to become a member of the football team if the injuries were that bad/disabling? Was the surgery that was ultimately necessary due to the injuries the victim showed up at school with (the primary cause/original injury), or was it necessary due to a combination of the pre-existing injuries plus whatever additional injuries (the cooperative cause/new additional injuries) that were sustained in the alleged incident?

Also, even if the accused are guilty, I hope they are found guilty solely due to the ultimate facts of THIS case, and that any previous incidents play NO role in a possible guilty verdict. The KKK incident has absolutely no relevance to the case of the accused Wheaton 5.

And just to be clear, this is in no way saying I think Capn34 is trying to connect the two cases.

[ChicagoHopeNut]

Chicago Tribune reports the players have all been suspended from practice and games.

We don't know all the information but if I were the alleged victim's attorney I'd be salivating at the case Wheaton College is laying out today. There are, of course, limits to what the school can say but it all but admits there was a hazing incident and it reacted to it. Now that hazing incident leads to felony charges and the school describes the events as "entirely unacceptable and inconsistent with the values we share as human beings". That's an opening statement to the jury that writes itself in any civil lawsuit.

[Capn34]

My pro-Wheaton source claimed that the kid showed up at Wheaton with two bad shoulders, and that the kid's roommate signed an affidavit to that effect.

Could the Allegd hazing make the shoulders worse?  Really irrelevant if the allegations are true.  Seems like some people are doing the same thing when woman accuses a star of rape...lets go after the victim. 

As a fan of D3 football this sucks if true.  I think the bigger issue for the Wheaton Football program and specifically the coach is this is added to the KKK incident from a couple years ago.  Wheaton has to ask itself some deep questions about the culture within the football program.  From an outsider it doesn't look like it aligns with the schools mission.

This fraction of the investigation is where medical professionals come into play with regard to answering the question of what is known as primary vs cooperative cause.

If the victim showed up with 2 injured shoulders how was he able to become a member of the football team if the injuries were that bad/disabling? Was the surgery that was ultimately necessary due to the injuries the victim showed up at school with (the primary cause/original injury), or was it necessary due to a combination of the pre-existing injuries plus whatever additional injuries (the cooperative cause/new additional injuries) that were sustained in the alleged incident?

Also, even if the accused are guilty, I hope they are found guilty solely due to the ultimate facts of THIS case, and that any previous incidents play NO role in a possible guilty verdict. The KKK incident has absolutely no relevance to the case of the accused Wheaton 5.

And just to be clear, this is in no way saying I think Capn34 is trying to connect the two cases.

Wasn't trying to tie the cases together in the criminal case version.  My point was people are going to say there is a culture issue with the football program.  I have a feeling, again no info except seeing this happen at other schools, that the coach may end up being ushered out after everything settles.  Hope it doesn't happen because all accounts are he is a pretty good guy.