FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Gregory Sager]

Also, even if the accused are guilty, I hope they are found guilty solely due to the ultimate facts of THIS case, and that any previous incidents play NO role in a possible guilty verdict. The KKK incident has absolutely no relevance to the case of the accused Wheaton 5.

This. Thank you for saying that, Mark.

[WooClone15]

Also, even if the accused are guilty, I hope they are found guilty solely due to the ultimate facts of THIS case, and that any previous incidents play NO role in a possible guilty verdict. The KKK incident has absolutely no relevance to the case of the accused Wheaton 5.

This. Thank you for saying that, Mark.

The Illinois attorneys can correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think it will play a role. Because as andone said, it doesn't have any relevance and besides, it's way too prejudicial; I don't see any way it gets in. So the only way the jury would know about it is due to outside knowledge, and I don't have a connection to the area, but I doubt the people of the county pay enough attention to Wheaton to remember that.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

I think you guys jumped in the wrong direction. The comment about the two cases was about looking at the program itself and maybe the coach and asking the question about what is going on, the environment, and how can the program now have two extreme cases that have both garnered national attention and not in a good way. I don't see anything in comments to say that those accused would some how have their other case used against them or that the cases are related outside of being from the same program. Again, just that these two cases raise some serious questions that need to be addressed especially at an institution that has some strong beliefs.

[AndOne]

Also, even if the accused are guilty, I hope they are found guilty solely due to the ultimate facts of THIS case, and that any previous incidents play NO role in a possible guilty verdict. The KKK incident has absolutely no relevance to the case of the accused Wheaton 5.

This. Thank you for saying that, Mark.

Thanks. Just stating what, to me, seemed obvious.

[sac]

DuPage County online   https://epay.18thjudicial.org/Clerk/caseNameSearch.do

You can type in their names and see what they were charged with, if my research is correct (and probably not since I'm not from Illinios) I believe these are all class 4 felony crimes subject to 1-3 years prison, possibly 3-6 years.  I imagine they would serve them concurrently if convicted.

Serious stuff.

[USee]

I was in a fraternity. We did what would be called 'hazing' but in reality were inconveniences or shenanigans that didn't involve physical injury. And we creeked pledged brothers who got pinned (stripped them and took them to a nearby creek and they had to walk back naked but they always had someone with them to watch for the cops and we only did it in warmer weather).

And if some version of this is what actually happened, would an off season suspension, 50 hours of community service and a 1 game suspension seem like a reasonable penalty?

[Pat Coleman]

In this extended analogy, did the frat brothers sign an anti-hazing policy that pledged zero tolerance?

[USee]

If this is a cover-up, or a small punishment was given out before this came to light, then Wheaton is no better than Baylor - putting the health of students at risk for the benefit of their athletics program.

Filing felony charges isn't a whim....

This is just inflammatory and wrong to post. Shame on you for having no facts and saying stuff like this about a school with an impeccable record. As I stated before, anyone who thinks Wheaton College makes decisions that priorities athletes first is absolutely clueless.

Mike Swider has been at Wheaton 32 years and I know he has suspended and dismissed many players over the years for what most people would consider non issues. There is simply no way he is risking his career on any 1,2, or 5 players.

[USee]

The injury thing is another stumper to me. Shoulder surgery on both shoulders due to the incident?
I'm no attorney but I do play in the world of insurance. When is the last time you visited a doctor for an injury without your insurance company asking if another party was at fault? If an insurance carrier had to pay the bill, they would look to subrogate. Certainly the victim wouldn't have picked up the deductible and coinsurance- someone had to pay the bill.

Or maybe the family found a friendly D.A. that wants another notch in his belt and could help them get a settlement to pay some bills?

[OzJohnnie]

The injury thing is another stumper to me. Shoulder surgery on both shoulders due to the incident?
I'm no attorney but I do play in the world of insurance. When is the last time you visited a doctor for an injury without your insurance company asking if another party was at fault? If an insurance carrier had to pay the bill, they would look to subrogate. Certainly the victim wouldn't have picked up the deductible and coinsurance- someone had to pay the bill.

Or maybe the family found a friendly D.A. that wants another notch in his belt and could help them get a settlement to pay some bills?

Allegedly he had his wrists and ankles duct-taped and his head covered when he was carried out of the dorm building.  It's easy to imagine that his wrists were duct-taped behind his back and then his weight lifted by them, twisting his arms up and putting great pressure into the shoulder and tearing soft tissue. Both at the same time.  Particularly if he was struggling. Cops are trained how to hog tie and move a person. Civilians not so much.

I'm not saying that is what happened, I'm just saying that the events described make the scenario easy to envision.

And as to the insurance payout, as long as it wasn't a pre-existing condition in terms of the insurance policy they will pay out. Recovery is a seperate issue and they'll sit and wait until the investigation is concluded. But either way they are going to pay.

[USee]

A bit early for people to be taking sides, no?  I suggest waiting to see where the prosecution leads before getting too settled into a corner.  Yes, it's hard to believe the DA would raise felony charges without good cause (don't they need to be grand juried?) and it's equally hard to believe that Wheaton would fail to recognize and properly manage events so serious.

So there is a whole lot of revealing still to go on that choosing sides has no effect on (although it is certainly emotionally satisfying).  Hold your horses folks and see what happens.  The next big event will be the students turning themselves in and being arraigned.  Then we'll get pleas or a trial.  Either is good. Until then it's arguing for no purpose, no?

Well said. I strongly agree with this. I have an experience over a lot of years with Wheaton that tells me something is going on here that isn't known.

[smedindy]

If this is a cover-up, or a small punishment was given out before this came to light, then Wheaton is no better than Baylor - putting the health of students at risk for the benefit of their athletics program.

Filing felony charges isn't a whim....

This is just inflammatory and wrong to post. Shame on you for having no facts and saying stuff like this about a school with an impeccable record. As I stated before, anyone who thinks Wheaton College makes decisions that priorities athletes first is absolutely clueless.

Mike Swider has been at Wheaton 32 years and I know he has suspended and dismissed many players over the years for what most people would consider non issues. There is simply no way he is risking his career on any 1,2, or 5 players.

Impeccable record? The KKK skit is impeccable? Canning the professor wearing the hijab is the sign of an impeccable reputation?

I'm just calling it as I see it. IF it's true, and IF Wheaton covered it up, then that's where the Baylor analogy comes into play. IF...

[smedindy]

I was in a fraternity. We did what would be called 'hazing' but in reality were inconveniences or shenanigans that didn't involve physical injury. And we creeked pledged brothers who got pinned (stripped them and took them to a nearby creek and they had to walk back naked but they always had someone with them to watch for the cops and we only did it in warmer weather).

And if some version of this is what actually happened, would an off season suspension, 50 hours of community service and a 1 game suspension seem like a reasonable penalty?

We didn't have to have surgery to correct injuries after our 'hazing'. We had beers. I doubt felony charges would be filed for the above. Heck, a misdemeanor would be stretching it.

[smedindy]

The injury thing is another stumper to me. Shoulder surgery on both shoulders due to the incident?
I'm no attorney but I do play in the world of insurance. When is the last time you visited a doctor for an injury without your insurance company asking if another party was at fault? If an insurance carrier had to pay the bill, they would look to subrogate. Certainly the victim wouldn't have picked up the deductible and coinsurance- someone had to pay the bill.

Or maybe the family found a friendly D.A. that wants another notch in his belt and could help them get a settlement to pay some bills?

So you will impugn the credibility of an entire counties district attorney's office?

Dude, have you read Missoula? The modus operandi is for prosecutors to paper over things like this, not prosecute it.

[izzy stradlin]

Maybe Swider ordered the code red.      

I keep reading the comments on this page, but at this point I don't think we are going to get more information anytime soon (maybe months).   I have heard two extremely different accounts.   I actually think the charges ended up somewhere in between the two extremes (no sexual assault but yes to battery).

I don't know exactly what to believe but what I do know is these guys probably aren't playing football for Wheaton again.   

Plenty on the DLine to replace Spielman.   Not sure who will replace Kregel at C.    Drew Smith already getting more time than Pettway at RT.