FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Tailgater]

Sica:
Bitter NCC won? Someone who is bitter certainly doesn't congratulate the other team. Disappointed Carthage let an opportunity slip away, you better believe it.

RoberGoulet, NCC-alum62:
Spouting off on what ifs? What do you think most (and I do mean most) of the discussion and speculation on this board is? All us arm-chair coaches base comments on "what ifs" on a daily basis. I'm merely pointing out that with 6 minutes left in the game Carthage had the opportunity to put the game away with a turnover and failed to execute. Who cares what happened earlier in the game, last week or last year. I'm saying at that moment in time a turn-over would have certainly changed the outcome of the game and had all you NCC faithful complaining about Cartage winning because they play dirty. Sounds to me like you're all gloating. In speaking with several Carthage players after the game and today I've learned that NCC players are far from angelic with their mouths and took their cheap shots in the piles. It's football for goodness sake. If you can't take it get a skirt and tennis racket and hit the courts.

[dansand]

All the North Central/Augie talk is pre-mature anyway. The Vikings have the mind-numbing (another poster's characterization) trip to Decatur next week and can't afford to look past that; plus 5-2 Elmhurst the following week (Ya, I know they're 5-1 but I doubt they'll beat NCC next week--although I'd love to see it). As for as my two cents on the favorite goes, I have no problem with the Cardinals being considered the favorite. They've played great this year and they did pound Augie last year. It doesn't really matter what any of us think anyway. It's going to have to be settled on the field. Plus, I don't mind the pressure being put on NCC instead of the Vikes.
Pretty typical win for Augie yesterday. The offense took a while to get going. Roe's only pass was a desperation throw with time running out in the first half. The defense was tremendous early, although it looks like IWU has some serious problems on offense. They're line was overwhelmed by Augie on almost every play. I missed the second half (homecoming activities and such), but it looks like both offenses picked it up a little after intermission. Mike Guzman is quietly having a tremendous season. He had 175 yards on only 12 carries versus the Titans, including a 97-yard TD. Not your stereotypical big, slow fullback for sure.

[zorbadagreek]

I would also like to see NCC go down. I dont think it will happen until Auggie, but one of those two will be your conference champ. We saw what happened when Elmhurst took on one of the big boys so its safe to say they arent the real deal.

[Augie6]

Congrats to NCC on a big win this weekend.  As for the "what if" discussion, IMO both teams had a chance to win the game.  NCC could have put it away early in the 2nd half if they continued to play as they did in the first half.  Carthage may have been able to put it away if they converted on one of the INT chances they had after taking the lead.  Bottom line is, when you have two good teams playing, the team who executes on a few key plays usually wins the game.  NCC executed when it mattered and Carthage didn't.

As for the remainder of the season, I am optimistic about Augie's chances but would have to go with NCC as the favorite.  Augie must beat a good Millikin team on the road and somehow find a way to finally beat Wheaton for the first time in Barnes' tenure.  Having NCC at home will help, but the offense must control the ball (and clock) to have a chance to win.  Based on the play of NCC's defense this year, I believe Augie has the opportunity to do this.   Since NCC has already beaten two of the big four, I have to give them a slight edge.  I don't believe the fact that NCC spanked Augie last year has any bearing on this season.  Two different teams, two different seasons.

[augiedogie]

Washedup:

Just for clarifactaion, when I said the outcome would be different I'm saying NCC won't win by the 20+ or 30 points that they did last year. They might still win the game, but not by that huge of a difference. Although I think Augie will be able to control the clock, and will keep it a relatively low scoring game which I think would favor Augie just like in the Carthage Augie game earlier in the year

[Tailgater]

[quote author=Augie6 link=topic=3543.msg387475#msg387475 date=1129498561
Congrats to NCC on a big win this weekend.  As for the "what if" discussion, IMO both teams had a chance to win the game.  NCC could have put it away early in the 2nd half if they continued to play as they did in the first half.  Carthage may have been able to put it away if they converted on one of the INT chances they had after taking the lead.  Bottom line is, when you have two good teams playing, the team who executes on a few key plays usually wins the game.  NCC executed when it mattered and Carthage didn't.]
[/quote]


Well said Augie6!

[Tailgater]

wow! what happened with that last post format?

[Tailgater]

One last thought for those of you who post accusations of Carthage playing dirty or as being a dirty team. You are foolishly making a direct inditement of Coach Tim Rucks, his leadership and football philosophy. A team's character or identy is a direct reflection of it's head coach. Most of you probably haven't had the privaledge of knowing or even meeting Coach Rucks. If you look up the word "integrety" in the dictionary, Coach Rucks picture should be found there. Not for one minute would he tolerate such actions as so called "dirty play". Words like aggressive, intensity and unrelenting better discribe the character Coach Rucks instills in his teams. For those of you that harp on personnel foul penalties as being equivelant to dirty play, I'd have to guess you have lost your objectivity of the game of football. Dirty play is delibriate and intended. Aggressive, intense and unrelenting play may at times lead to late hits, roughing the kicker and other defined personnel fouls.

[NCC41]

Tailgator-  I'm new to the board but figured i'd give my 2 cents on the 'dirty play' of Carthage.  I don't want to point and claim that all Carthage athletes are dirty players as you said the coach is a good man, doens't mean every player is going to take what he preaches to heart though.

I was curious if #91 of Carthage was one of the players with previous personal fouls, because from watching the game this week I would have had no problem having him ejected.  He was responsible for numerous late hits.  Curious as to which end of the football feild you sat on, because the end closest to the scoreboard is where I witnessed the most activity.  After a Holdon touchdown, he came up and gave him a good shot about 10 whole seconds after the play was over, when another cardinal player walked towards the incident he gave him a smaller shove.  I had a real problem with this because the penelty on something like that does very little.  The game is all but out of reach at this point for Carthage, plus NCC was kicking off with the wind and a strong kicker, most of th kicks were ending up touchbacks anyways so adding 15 yards from the spot of the kickoff just doesn't seem like a justified penelty for the incident. 

I'm assuming its safe to say a few other posters witnessed the same plays I did, i don't want to carry over and say that a few players actions deserves an entire team of being called 'dirty' but to excuse them with 'come on, it's football' just seems irresponsible to me.

[usee]

i still give augie the inside track because their defense is playing better (ncc giving up way too much run yardage) and augie can grind the ball. i also don't think it is a given ncc will beat elmhurst and millikin. this league is as tough as it has ever been  and elmhurst has a really good defense. the league champ will not be undefeated. so all the talk is extremely premature. it is not inconceivable that carthage make the playoffs either. you have to keep playing and taking this week by week.

for those at the carthage/ncc game....who were the carthage defensive players that didn't play? i know smith was out for ncc and a couple others were banged up.

[augiedogie]

Tailgator:

I have to agree with you on the comment you made about the reflection of Rucks. I have met him, and his brother is a coach in the MSL at the high school level. Neither of them would ever promote dirty play. I am only an outsider, but I could not possibly believe that the coach would intentionally promote "dirty" play by his team.

[Augie6]

Tailgater,

When I played in the CCIW (granted it was 20 years ago), I don't recall any teams that I would classify as "dirty."  With the very aggressive defensive scheme we ran at Augie, we would get flagged for late hits periodically.  I don't believe any of the teams we played against called us dirty because of this.  I know what our coaches called it when it happened, STUPID!!   Our coaches wanted us to be aggressive as a defense, but to also play "under control" and limit mistakes of over-aggressiveness.  In order to be a successful team, you can't make frequent mistakes like that and win against good teams.  I don't know Coach Rucks, but I can bet that he will be preaching this to his team because these type of stupid mistakes have cost Carthage over the past couple of weeks.  I have only seen Carthage play a couple of times over the past few seasons and certainly wouldn't classify what I saw as "dirty play."  

It's disappointing to see the amount of trash talking that takes
place by most teams in the CCIW and sports, in general.  When we played, our philosophy was to keep our mouths shut and let our play do the talking.  I can remember several teams running their mouths early in the game, but this would usually stop when they were down by 3 scores early in the 2nd quarter.  Unfortunately, I think trash talking has become an accepted part of sport and is here to stay.

[sica-sica]

Penalty called for chop block.Thats dirty and deliberate or is it aggressive?

[Jim Matson]

I think the CCIW got beat up in the latest Top 25 poll. 

North Central deserves a higher rating as they are 6-0, having played and defeated 2 top 25 teams.  I would agree with Augie being in the top 25, but I'd also have to say that Wheaton belongs there as well.  A number of teams have 1 loss that are ranked higher than all 3 of these teams...and I don't think it is a strength of schedule issue (at least by my research).

[Augie6]

On the chop block, I didn't see it and don't know the player's intent, so I can't say if it's dirty/deliberate.  By that logic, anyone who commits a penalty that could cause an injury would be a dirty player.  We are all taught when we first start playing the game that we don't grab the facemask to tackle and if we do we let it go immediately.  However, it's still a common occurrence to see a 15 yard face mask penalty in a game.  Does that mean every player who has committed this penalty is dirty?  For some, that is probably the case, but, sometimes, things just happen in the heat of the battle by players who I wouldn't classify as dirty.  

That being said, I'm not saying that Carthage (or any other team in the CCIW) doesn't have any players who could be considered a dirty player.  But, I do think people need to be careful about calling a particular team, dirty.  I am sure you can find examples where teams at all levels of college football have lost their composure in certain games and done something they wish they hadn't.  In a physical, emotional sport like football, that comes with the territory.