FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Tailgater]

man Pat, it took me a day and a phone call to come up with that idea and you pooh-poohed it in a minute. How bout my info and assumption on why CUW hosts a playoff game near home rather than travel to NCC?

[Tailgater]

I can't say I agree. While you might want to give more weight to conference games, you can't really ignore non-conference games altogether when evaluating a player.

Otherwise it's the "CCIW All-Conference-Game Team."

You need to be a member of the conference to be eligible, right?

Not sure I'm following your last sentence?

[WahooThunder]

Can NCC pull off a couple of wins to see Alliance from the inside?

You mean McCully Stadium?  I think they've already been there.  This season in fact, and if my memory serves me they didn't enjoy the second half too much so I'm not sure why they would be very eager to return. 

Kidding aside, if Wheaton can't beat them, I certainly hope the Cards will get their shot, but I give Wheaton at least as good of a chance, if not better, to beat Mt. Union as I would North Central to beat Capital.

[WahooThunder]

And that speaks nothing negative of North Central, just that Capital is a really great team as well and I like Wheaton's upset chances better because of their defense.

[FishHack76]

I still don't undersatnd why CWU gets to play at another field. The game should be played at whoevers field and press box can handle a playoff game. Carthage did not have the press box to handle a playoff game in 2004 so we traveled Alma. That should be the case here and NCC should be hosting. NCAA should stay consistant.

You don't have enough information to know if the NCAA was consistent. Do you know if Carthage filed paperwork to host on another Division III field? Hmm?

Yeah, I checked and they were denied. Now what Mr. Guru?

Do you know 100% for certain all of the facts? Where were they hoping to host the game? Was that in their original filing, or did they amend after the fact when it was clear that they couldn't host on campus? Was the replacement facility suitable?

"Yeah, I checked and they were denied" isn't good enough.

Pat, I've watched your comments for a while now to the people that come to your website, and here's a good question.
Why don't you try to be a little less condescending? Not everyone knows the answers or has as much knowledge as you do. There have been times where I see people have a decent question. Yes, it may be one that you've answered 100 times before, but I would suggest being a little more patient.
Berating someone on a message board, someone who is coming to your website probably isn't a good idea. That attitude can't be good for business.
That's about as polite as I can state all that.

[Red Reign]

And that speaks nothing negative of North Central, just that Capital is a really great team as well and I like Wheaton's upset chances better because of their defense.

According to the CCIW website North Central has the better overall defense in composite 252.7 yards/game vs Wheaton 268.8 and in Conf. play the two defenses are almost idenical NC 264.9 vs WC 264.0...

[Pat Coleman]

Yeah, I checked and they were denied. Now what Mr. Guru?

Pat, I've watched your comments for a while now to the people that come to your website, and here's a good question.
Why don't you try to be a little less condescending? Not everyone knows the answers or has as much knowledge as you do. There have been times where I see people have a decent question. Yes, it may be one that you've answered 100 times before, but I would suggest being a little more patient.
Berating someone on a message board, someone who is coming to your website probably isn't a good idea. That attitude can't be good for business.
That's about as polite as I can state all that.

I think the tone of that post got answered in a similar tone. Sorry if you find that displeasing. I found the tone displeasing, personally, and answered in kind.

[Pat Coleman]

More good information concerning why Carthage traveled for the playoffs in 2004 while CUW has an opportunity to play near home due to inadequate press-boxes. After a 3-7 season in 2003 who at Carthage would have thought it necessary to file for hosting at an alternate playoff sight? When it became apparent that the possibility existed that they would make the playoffs Carthage did file, but late and were denied. Here is my assumption. Coach Adam Walker, now at CUW, was at Carthage in 2004. He may have had the foresight to see the possibility of the same circumstances happen to CUW so informed the Athletic Director to get the filings in the work early enough to be approved. Just an assumption, but that would sure answer the question.

It's always possible that people learn from history rather than doom themselves to repeat it.

One note, though -- Carthage wouldn't have had to file in 2004 to host until about Week 8. I'm sure 3-7 was left in the rearview mirror by that point.

[FishHack76]

Yeah, I checked and they were denied. Now what Mr. Guru?

Pat, I've watched your comments for a while now to the people that come to your website, and here's a good question.
Why don't you try to be a little less condescending? Not everyone knows the answers or has as much knowledge as you do. There have been times where I see people have a decent question. Yes, it may be one that you've answered 100 times before, but I would suggest being a little more patient.
Berating someone on a message board, someone who is coming to your website probably isn't a good idea. That attitude can't be good for business.
That's about as polite as I can state all that.

I think the tone of that post got answered in a similar tone. Sorry if you find that displeasing. I found the tone displeasing, personally, and answered in kind.

Pat,
Why stoop down to match someone's tone? I think you should be the bigger person, don't you agree? Like I wrote, that's not good for business to answer displeasing posts with a snotty, condescending response.
I understand this is your little fiefdom and all, but you piss enough people off and they'll go elsewhere eventually. That's simple customer service, man.
I work in the media so I understand that sometimes people out there don't have the answers or sometimes go off on conspiracy theories about coverage or get a little riled up because their passions as fans get the best of them. They don't always have the same perspective, but if I respond to a complaint or a question to my readers like that, they go read another newspaper.

[Gregory Sager]

Greg, interesting tidbit on Wheaton and how the conference discouraged the Thunder because they were too good.
Sooo, my question here is... If the CCI(W) said Wheaton was too good at the time  and wanted them out because they were beating everybody bad,  why didn't the CCIW squawk or do something similar when Augie went on their rampage in the 80's winning 4 Nat'l Titles,  and setting the CCIW Conf. record winning streak?
Why didn't they do the same thing that happened to Wheaton?  That doesn't seem fair. 
Disclaimer-- I am not suggesting Augie leaves the CCIW, I am just looking back in history and wondering why
Augie 8 CCIW titles in a row from 1981-1988 seems like dominance to me.

Different era, different circumstances.

This conference does not revolve around football, nor did it do so in the 1980s. It's just one sport among many that the CCIW was sponsoring at that time. What sense would it make to ask a school to leave the conference just because it was dominating one particular sport? It would've made more sense to ask North Central to leave than to ask Augustana to leave, because even as far back as the '80s North Central's dominance in cross-country was more thorough than was Augie's dominance in football. NCC has won every CCIW men's cross-country title since 1974, and Al Carius and his Cardinals harriers had already won six D3 cross-country national championships before Augie won its first in football in 1983.

The 1950s was another story. The CCIW sponsored fewer sports, and back then the dominance of the two main sports in collegiate culture (football and men's basketball) was much more pronounced than it is now. Anything besides those two was an afterthought. And Wheaton dominated both sports, completely and simultaneously, in the late '50s. From 1983 thru 1986, while the Doggies were winning four consecutive Stagg Bowls under Bob Reade and going undefeated in CCIW play on the gridiron, their hardwood counterparts under Jim Borcherding and Jim Leix were finishing second, fourth, third, and third in the CCIW and compiling a 39-25 record.

Also, a big part of why Wheaton was asked to leave was because they were winning in both sports by ridiculous margins. I don't know the average spread of their football wins during that era, but they won their CCIW basketball contests in 1959 by an average margin of 32.3 points. Nobody's ever going to come close to that record. It's like Cy Young's 511 career wins as a pitcher. It's completely untouchable. A championship basketball team in this league typically has an average CCIW winning margin that's somewhere in the 9-12 points range. The 2001-02 Carthage team that went to the Final Four had the biggest margin in this decade, 13.6 points. What does that tell you about how Wheaton dominated the league in basketball in the late fifties?

[Gregory Sager]

Pat,
Why stoop down to match someone's tone? I think you should be the bigger person, don't you agree? Like I wrote, that's not good for business to answer displeasing posts with a snotty, condescending response.
I understand this is your little fiefdom and all, but you piss enough people off and they'll go elsewhere eventually. That's simple customer service, man.
I work in the media so I understand that sometimes people out there don't have the answers or sometimes go off on conspiracy theories about coverage or get a little riled up because their passions as fans get the best of them. They don't always have the same perspective, but if I respond to a complaint or a question to my readers like that, they go read another newspaper.

Where else are they gonna go? How many websites for D3 football are there?

[FishHack76]

How hard is it to start up a rival website, especially if there is a dissatisfied contigent of people?
Yes, this is a great resource, but all I'm saying is don't abuse your base of readers and don't take them for granted. Nothing is ever permanent. Just because this is the No. 1 website right now doesn't mean it'll stay that way forever.

[pg04]

How hard is it to start up a rival website, especially if there is a dissatisfied contigent of people?
Yes, this is a great resource, but all I'm saying is don't abuse your base of readers and don't take them for granted. Nothing is ever permanent. Just because this is the No. 1 website right now doesn't mean it'll stay that way forever.

First of all, I don't think there is a large amount of dissatisfied people out there to try to compete with Pat. 

I have been floating around for 4 years on this site, and never have I seen an "abuse" on any reader.  Sure, if he disagrees with a point of view, he'll let you know.  If you have blatant misstatement of fact, he'll let you know.  Isn't that what a moderator is supposed to do?

He runs this site, the message board (including the many different regions, topics under the board) for two different sports.  Not always can he give you a long drawn out response, it just doesn't make any sense timewise. 

The people on this site do a lot of work for basically nothing, they deserve a little respect, not people complaining  that "WAAAH STOP HURTING ME" 

If you don't like it, you can leave, no one is stopping you but you aren't going to find a better site out there. PERIOD. 

[ncc_cardinal_fan]

How hard is it to start up a rival website, especially if there is a dissatisfied contigent of people?
Yes, this is a great resource, but all I'm saying is don't abuse your base of readers and don't take them for granted. Nothing is ever permanent. Just because this is the No. 1 website right now doesn't mean it'll stay that way forever.

Hey FishHack once you get a site that you run, then you can talk some smack, until then you need to just take a chill pill. I didnt see you on ESPN the other day, but Pat was.

I along with all the other posters probably agree that Pat is fair and honest 100% of the time. Can that be the next poll question???

[ncc_cardinal_fan]

How hard is it to start up a rival website, especially if there is a dissatisfied contigent of people?
Yes, this is a great resource, but all I'm saying is don't abuse your base of readers and don't take them for granted. Nothing is ever permanent. Just because this is the No. 1 website right now doesn't mean it'll stay that way forever.

Hey FishHack once you get a site that you run, then you can talk some smack, until then you need to just take a chill pill. I didnt see you on ESPN the other day, but Pat was.

I along with all the other posters probably agree that Pat is fair and honest 100% of the time. Can that be the next poll question???

Man my Karma is getting up there!!!!