FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[NCC_alum62]

Thanks Mugsy.  There has been an upswing in postings recently and I missed it.

[matblake]

I will be traveling the 2 hours or so to Albion from my house this week to see Wheaton play.  I will return the favor of the many who posted re: Wheaton v Wabash and try to give a decent summary of the action. 

If any of you make the trip, I would love to meet you.  If you are making the trip, remember that Albion is in the eastern time zone.  I wouldn't want anyone showing up an hour late.

[usee]

Usee,

A report was written by New Tradition back on August 26. So, stop complaining. 

Alright, now that I'm back in town, I'll give you guys some of my thoughts on the North Central/Olivet scrimmage.

QB – The top 2 quarterbacks, Fanthorpe and Kniss, rotated every other play, which was nice because we were able to see both qb's with the first team in just about every situation.  All in all, I believe that Fanthrope had the edge.  His throws were a bit more accurate, and it seemed to me that he had better command and control of the offense.  I am sure that this is a product of the year that he has already spent in the system, learning the plays, etc.  Not to say that Kniss did poorly.  He made some nice throws as well, however, I believe that Fanthorpe just made more of them.

RB – This is where I believe the majority of the Cardinal offense will come from this year.  Both backs, Sulo and Izzy Brown, looked fantastic running the football.  There was a good amount of yardage gained straight up the middle, several 8 and 10 yard chunks.  There was even use of a pretty decent sized fullback named Champion (I'm sorry, but that has to be the coolest last name ever) in a few of the sets.

WR – From what I saw, the wide outs ran crisp routes, but I have to say that I did not pay attention to them because I was watching the quarterbacks.  I know that many balls were caught, but there were no stellar catches or runs after the catch.  They seemed to pretty much do their job, but nothing out of the ordinary.  I do know, however, that #1 receiver Perry Welch did not dress for the scrimmage.

OL – The offensive line looked very good overall.  There was a good surge when the ball was handed off, but what really impressed me was the time that they gave the quarterbacks to throw the football.  It seemed like no matter what blitzes Olivet threw at them, they had an answer for all of it and picked everything up.  I know the Offensive Line Coach, Ponx, always worked very hard on the o-line knowing their assignments for the different blitzes that teams throw at them from week to week.  Also, a sophomore named Delancy took the spot of Scott Plamer, the right tackle who chose not to come back, and did very well.  I also did not realize until yesterday, the Ryan Armstrong also did not come back.  He saw a significant amount of time on the o-line, but decided that he wanted to concentrate on track.

Offense overall – While it is obvious that the Cardinals will not have the high-octane air attack that Kam Kniss provided (at least until the quarterback(s) get a better grip on the offense) I believe that they can still score by a more balanced attack and involving the running game more than they had in the past 2 years.

DL – Only having 3 down linemen translates to a lot of depth for the Cards.  Look for them to rotate a lot and have a lot of fresh bodies.  The D-line played very tough and had several tackles for loss and sacks.

LB – The linebackers impressed me the most in this 3-3 scheme.  I know that they proclaim this to be an attacking defense, and that is exactly what they did.  For several series, Olivet was unable to pick up many blitzes while they were in pass protection and the LB's were able to get a few sacks and put a ton of pressure on the qb.  The 2 outside linebackers, Kostellic and Hammers, are both seniors with a lot of experience, and in the middle, they have Wenger, a sophomore who saw a fair amount of action last year.  Hammers, to me, looked like he made more plays than anyone.  He was all over the field.  Wenger had a few monster hits, though.

DB – Kind of tough to go wrong when you have 5 of them.  I did see kind of a Jekyll and Hyde with the DB's.  Several times they were in excellent position and defended well – thrown balls, and even made a few picks, but there were many other times when the Olivet receivers were able to find soft spots and catch the ball completely undefended.  Jordan Hoffman and Tyler Venier looked very good and had interceptions, but aside from that there was nothing out of the ordinary.

Defense overall – Going into this scrimmage I was very skeptical about the 3-3-5.  I'm still not completely sold on it, but I have a slightly better feeling about it than I did before.  It was very effective for the first few series, but eventually Olivet figured out what they were doing and was able to move the ball.  From the stands, it looks like they gamble a LOT with some of the blitz schemes that they run.  Talking to a few players after the scrimmage, one told me that it looks that way, but there are a lot of checks involved based upon the formation that the offense lines up in, and their tendencies out of certain formations, so its not as big of a gamble as it appears.  All that being said, Olivet did only put the ball in the endzone 1 time during the entire scrimmage with about a minute left to go.

Special teams – I will say that the special team that impressed me the most was Kickoff return.  Joe Mastrino had several excellent returns that put the Cards in great field position.  Joe Rubin, the other returner, did not dress for the scrimmage.  I have been coaching football at the high school level this season, and watching the kick returns almost looked like watching film in fast forward.  It is amazing how much faster things happen on the college level!

Team overall – I think that the Cards dominated the scrimmage, early on especially.  Once Olivet settled in and figured out the new defense, things evened out a bit.  As the scrimmage progressed, it became evident that Olivet had been in camp for 2 weeks as opposed to the Cards 5 days because the Cards seemed to lack conditioning, to me.  All in all, it was fun to watch and I am excited to see what happens in the CCIW this year!

He sure did. thanks for reposting. I remember reading this too. must be getting senile in my old age like mugsy.

[RedmenBigD]

SmithFan

I am sure that Jake Smith is a good back but the Lakeland team did see Justin Beaver from UWW, one of the top Senior running backs in D3. Justin put up over 120 yards on Lakeland, If Jake is that good he should put up more than that on Lakeland. I will wait till after the game to compare the two, since I have only seen one.

And Beaver hasn't played the whole game against Lakeland even once in his career.

Also I don't think you can ever compare a FRESHMAN to a SENIOR with factors lik the difference in age, playing experience, maturity and so on.  Maybe when Jake Smith becomes older and more mature (in the weightroom, and game experience) then we might be able to talk about him in the same complex as Justin Beaver one of, if not the top Division 3 running backs...

[Mugsy]

must be getting senile in my old age like mugsy.

You've got little to worry about, old age is just one of many causes of my senility (dealing with CardinalAlum is the primary cause).

[Smithfan]

Sorry, did not mean to create any controversy or comparison of Jake Smith to any one else.  I only wanted to say that I believe that he has the potential to be very good  at the college level.  He led all Carthage RBs last week with not alot of playing time.  He is a Freshman.  I agree that with maturity he will only get better.  Let's see what happens after Saturday.

Go easy on me......this is all new to me!!

[old 40]

SmithFan

I am anxious to see Jake in action. I know he is good(saw him in High school). If he does his off season work and focuses he will indeed be real good by his senior year. I hope he is off this week, not offense, I just want to see Lakeland win. I don't know if that is possible. Good Luck to the Red Men and I hope Lakeland can keep it competitive. No one gets injured is my biggest wish.

[usee]

I will be traveling the 2 hours or so to Albion from my house this week to see Wheaton play.  I will return the favor of the many who posted re: Wheaton v Wabash and try to give a decent summary of the action. 

If any of you make the trip, I would love to meet you.  If you are making the trip, remember that Albion is in the eastern time zone.  I wouldn't want anyone showing up an hour late.

Matblake,

thanks, a full report would be most appreciated for us Thunder backers.

[BrightGuy]

At first Wabash was getting great pressure on Ullrich from their d-line, but as the game went on the Wheaton o-line looked better at pass protection.  That may be in part to Wabash having one of their better DT's getting ejected from the game.  Not sure what happened... it looked benign enough.  There wasn't any pushing or shoving, the ref just threw a flag for an unsportsman like right after the play and then tossed him.  

From what I have heard about this was, one of your (Wheaton) O-Line went all through last years scrimage trashing him (93-Gangloff), chopping at him, and he started right at him again this year, so 93 gave him a little extra at the end of the play so the official ejected him (No flag, No foul, No yardage) just ejection.  This is very much NOT like 93.
Looking for BIG things from this front 7 this year.
Good luck to Wheaton and maybe see you later...

[ncc58]

I will be traveling the 2 hours or so to Albion from my house this week to see Wheaton play.  I will return the favor of the many who posted re: Wheaton v Wabash and try to give a decent summary of the action. 

If any of you make the trip, I would love to meet you.  If you are making the trip, remember that Albion is in the eastern time zone.  I wouldn't want anyone showing up an hour late.

Matblake,

thanks, a full report would be most appreciated for us Thunder backers.

And, you may want to post your report a few times so that usee will have no problem finding it. 

[usee]

At first Wabash was getting great pressure on Ullrich from their d-line, but as the game went on the Wheaton o-line looked better at pass protection.  That may be in part to Wabash having one of their better DT's getting ejected from the game.  Not sure what happened... it looked benign enough.  There wasn't any pushing or shoving, the ref just threw a flag for an unsportsman like right after the play and then tossed him.  

From what I have heard about this was, one of your (Wheaton) O-Line went all through last years scrimage trashing him (93-Gangloff), chopping at him, and he started right at him again this year, so 93 gave him a little extra at the end of the play so the official ejected him (No flag, No foul, No yardage) just ejection.  This is very much NOT like 93.
Looking for BIG things from this front 7 this year.
Good luck to Wheaton and maybe see you later...

there was most certainly a flag and a 15 yd penalty. What you are describing is not something we have heard about before. No one has complained about any wheaton olineman to my knowledge. Either way "a little extra" is usually what the refs see.

[Mugsy]

At first Wabash was getting great pressure on Ullrich from their d-line, but as the game went on the Wheaton o-line looked better at pass protection.  That may be in part to Wabash having one of their better DT's getting ejected from the game.  Not sure what happened... it looked benign enough.  There wasn't any pushing or shoving, the ref just threw a flag for an unsportsman like right after the play and then tossed him.  

From what I have heard about this was, one of your (Wheaton) O-Line went all through last years scrimage trashing him (93-Gangloff), chopping at him, and he started right at him again this year, so 93 gave him a little extra at the end of the play so the official ejected him (No flag, No foul, No yardage) just ejection.  This is very much NOT like 93.
Looking for BIG things from this front 7 this year.
Good luck to Wheaton and maybe see you later...

there was most certainly a flag and a 15 yd penalty. What you are describing is not something we have heard about before. No one has complained about any wheaton olineman to my knowledge. Either way "a little extra" is usually what the refs see.

I overheard a Wabash coach in the pressbox mention a Wheaton player was pressing his forearm to the throat of the Wabash player while he was on the ground in the pile (whether intentional or not) and the Wabash player took a swing in full view of the ref.  That'll get you tosses asap.  As usee mentioned, there was a 15 yard unsportsman like penalty and the ref indicated he was tossed.

Unfortunate and definitely not indicative of the type of play between Wabash & Wheaton in the past.

[Mugsy]

And, you may want to post your report a few times so that usee will have no problem finding it. 

Very nice... k+

[burly]

What I find interesting in this discussion is that BP is insistent on talking about Burris compared statistically to players against whom he didn't compete, whereas Comet is talking about Burris in the only context in which he did compete. In that context, the coaches voted him first-team All-CCIW.

When you guys are doing talking apples and oranges, please pass the fruit salad.

Called out by the moderator in the first week of posting, I'm doing something right....or wrong.

That's a fair argument, but you are the first to bring it up.  In 1999, stats were down benchmarked against other years.  Either the offenses were worse, defenses were better or a combination of both.

I've made my point, but just for apples to apples sake in 1999, David Chorney (2nd Team Selection) had 17 less carries, 149 more yards, 1 less TD, 21 less all purpose attempts and 197 all purpose yards when compared to Burris.

[burly]

What I find interesting in this discussion is that BP is insistent on talking about Burris compared statistically to players against whom he didn't compete, whereas Comet is talking about Burris in the only context in which he did compete. In that context, the coaches voted him first-team All-CCIW.

When you guys are doing talking apples and oranges, please pass the fruit salad.

ZING

Yeah the Burris talk is getting old BP. 

Lets focus on the now...couple big games this week.  I hope Auggie wins against BW but I don't think it will happen BW has a top notch defense in the OAC and judging the Auggie O against the Highlanders last week isn't really a good judge of talent.  Not to knock on Mac too much but they are not a good football team right now with all of the off-the-field problems and coaching changes.

Any Auggie posters at the game last week?

Maybe, but it's generated a lot of discussion.