FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Carthage Fan]

Agreed, nice summary of the game. I'm sorry to say I to feel NP will indeed record a donut in the CCIW win column again this year. I was expecting a little better showing from NP, but instead saw a team (sorry to say) that showed little to no improvement from last season.

Actually, there's been quite a bit of improvement by NPU. Again, the stats show that the Vikings have made significant gains from last season in terms of their performance against a particular team:

2007

team	pts	total off yds	1st downs	TOs
Carthage	40	361	18	3
NPU	18	308	16	3

2006

team	pts	total off yds	1st downs	TOs
Carthage	52	364	20	2
NPU	7	153	12	5

As you can see, there's a dramatic improvement by NPU across the board. While the early flurry of points scored by Carthage last Saturday might at first blush appear to skew the statistical results, the fact of the matter is that the first half of this season's game was a carbon copy of the first half of last season's NPU @ CC contest. In the 2006 game, Carthage went into the locker room at halftime with a 35-7 lead; on Saturday the Red Men led at the intermission by an almost identical 33-6 score.

The big question, which AndOne correctly identified last week, is this: What is the source of that statistical improvement? In other words, it's still open to debate as to how much NPU's incremental improvements can be attributed to the Vikings fielding a better team (and a more experienced coaching staff) than they had last season, as opposed to how much those improvements can be written off as indicators of the decline of their opponents. North Central is clearly not as good a team as it was last year, and it's quite possible that the same can be said of Carthage. (I'm agnostic on the subject of Millikin's football fortunes.) My guess at this point remains that it's probably some of both. It's hard to deny the fact that in all five of their losses the Vikings have performed better, both statistically and on the scoreboard, than they performed against the same five teams last season. (This year's and last year's NPU wins over Eureka are immaterial, given how absolutely dreadful the Red Devils are.)

I certainly don't disagree with your statement about NPU's overall talent -- I've actually been the one who has been saying all along that the Vikings have some good football players but not nearly enough of them to compete. And I've maintained that the Vikings aren't going to win a CCIW football game this year; in fact, the scores may get even uglier from here on out. But North Park has improved. The Vikings simply haven't improved nearly enough to be competitive with anyone yet. That will have to wait for another season (if the trend continues to curve favorably for NPU's football program, which I'm still confident will happen).

The Thunder are looking forward to this week against NPU.  Like Thunderstones says, injuries have piled up and this is the week to heal.  No disrespect meant for Vikings fans on the board,

None taken. NPU hasn't done anything on the football field to merit anyone's respect since the Vikings went 4-4-1 under Tim Rucks back in '93. I'll be shocked if Wheaton doesn't win on Saturday by at least five touchdowns.

Its interesting if you look at the stats for NPU, the 308 total yds is made up of only 33 yds rushing and 275 passing, of which 154 went to Durr.  He is a good receiver with good hands and it was fun watching the battle between he and Shenault.   I don't want to take away from that performance but the Red Men D was missing 5 starters on Saturday and while we were able to stop the run, we had difficulty getting good pressure on Wood which gave him time to find guys open.  That all said, I think NPU was one of the most physical teams we have played this year.  They brought some lumber on their hits.

We did hold the ball 21:32 min in the 2nd half and I would have liked Carthage to score more than 7 points in the 2nd half, but thats hard to do when you turn the ball over 3 times.

Good luck to you guys the rest of the year.  Would love for you to knock off Wheaton this weekend! 

[matblake]

Where's Coach Whitehead?

Ouch, sometimes the truth hurts.

[matblake]

Would love for you to knock off Wheaton this weekend! 

So would North Central and IWU.

[matblake]

Word has it that the North Park Vikings have brought in some ringers this week to take on the Thunder.  Their bios are listed here.

[FormerCard]

Would love for you to knock off Wheaton this weekend! 

So would North Central and IWU.

Definitely.  We have an outside chance of still making the playoffs if we win out...a very outside chance...the wash u loss killed us.   I dont think wheaton will lose twice in conf play..just not happening

[FormerCard]

A good week for POW for the Cardinals.  Fanthorpe AND Wenger...Solid

http://cciw.org/fall_football/FBPOW7_07.php

[Titan Q]

Always good to hear from TMS.  My key frustration was with kickoffs getting to the 6 yard line then having Augie run it out to the 40+ really hurt.  Even on the squib kicks they still were able to run it out to good field position. 
I think the most dangerous game for Wheaton will be the one bloomington. 
Good to see Q has something to talk about on this board always good with the commentary on his team. 
Q, I'm not sure,  do you do football broadcasts as well?

Thanks, bg.  As far as broadcasting goes, I just do hoops.

[FormerCard]

If NC, Wheaton, WashU all win out.
Wheaton 10-0
Wash U    9-1
NC           8-2  (losses to Wheaton, Wash U)

Any outside chance of a Pool C bid for the Cardinals?

[matblake]

If NC, Wheaton, WashU all win out.
Wheaton 10-0
Wash U    9-1
NC           8-2  (losses to Wheaton, Wash U)

Any outside chance of a Pool C bid for the Cardinals?

Not looking good at this point.  Since Pool C is on a national scale, you have to take a look at the whole country.  Unfortunately, both losses for NC are in region, which significantly affects the rankings.  In a couple more weeks the picture of how many Pool C slots are in contention will be more clear, it will probably be easier to surmise at that point. 

[Comet 14]

Wow what a tough 4th quarter. Well lets start by saying that it was with out question a trapped ball for an INT. That being said I could not agree more with jaybird that it was not the reason for Elmhurst losing this game. The officiating was poor but fair to both sides. I think that Elmhurst's lack of a consistant running game is really hurting them. There are times in a game when you need to slow down take a deep breath and get a few first downs. The spread offense does not help this part of the game. I also think they try to pass down field to much and don't user the short passing game enough. Jaybird I would be interested in your thoughts on this. I will end with this, I see that Fanthorpe recieved POW honors congrat's to him but I would have given it to Sulo. He was the best player on the field and IMO the best running back I have seen in the conference this year hands down

[79jaybird]

Comet14 I agree with you and in my earlier post I didn't want to pinpoint or fingerpoint to the Bluejays offense.  I think they know what needs addressing and I know Kudyba will have a better game next week.  He just had a bad 10 minutes, which is human and we all have our bad moments.  Unfortunately, it just happened at a pivotal segment of the game.
Since Luna we haven't had a sturdy back in the backfield.  The Carthage game we were able to get at least a small running game going, but the Augie and now NC games, the running game has been abandoned.  I have never liked an all pass offense.  If you abandon the run, the is such a relief for the defense that can drop into coverage and plug up the passing lanes.  Why honor the run if you know they aren't going to run?
I don't think the running game is as much of a concern as predictability.  I think we both know that it was a guarantee that either on 1st or 2nd down they were going to do that quick shovel (dangerous!  ) pass inside which gets 1-3 yards?
I agree Sulo was elusive and great, but I would agree that Fanthorpe is the POW and the reason NC won.  Fanthorpe was superb in finding the holes inside on the QB draws and his tosses were on the money all game long. 

[usee]

If NC, Wheaton, WashU all win out.
Wheaton 10-0
Wash U    9-1
NC           8-2  (losses to Wheaton, Wash U)

Any outside chance of a Pool C bid for the Cardinals?

I agree w Mattblake. No chance at pool C for the Cards. They have the best chance at the AQ if they win out and one of the teams they beat knocks off the Thunder. Presumably that will be IWU. If that scenario plays out then the dreaded tiebreaker comes into play if Wheaton/NCC/IWU end up w 1 loss in conference. In case you don't remember its the point differrential between the 3 tied teams. So it matters how bad NCC beats IWU (of course they must win for this to matter) and then it matters how bad IWU beats Wheaton if that happens. Right now the only score differential we know is Wheaton beat NCC by 4.

[usee]

Jaybird,

Plus K for you for some very good posts in a tough time to be a bluejay fan. 

[Mr. Ypsi]

usee, thanks for the reminder on the tie-break.  I was going to ask for a refresher, but thought it was too premature.

But as long as the prematurity ice has been broken - it would be best for the conference if IWU downed Wheaton, and the winner of the NCC-IWU game got the AQ.  A one-loss Wheaton team would still be a lock for a pool C (IMO); no other team has a snowball's chance in you-know-where for the conference to get a second team in.  [I'm sure my logic will not sway any Thunder fans, but its never too early to start lobbying support from the rest of the board! ]

[FormerCard]

usee, thanks for the reminder on the tie-break.  I was going to ask for a refresher, but thought it was too premature.

But as long as the prematurity ice has been broken - it would be best for the conference if IWU downed Wheaton, and the winner of the NCC-IWU game got the AQ.  A one-loss Wheaton team would still be a lock for a pool C (IMO); no other team has a snowball's chance in you-know-where for the conference to get a second team in.  [I'm sure my logic will not sway any Thunder fans, but its never too early to start lobbying support from the rest of the board! ]

you make a good point..isnt it just better for the conf if we get two teams in?

Maybe if wheaton fans can convince Swider to get a haircut that Saturday when they play IWU, it might keep him in the barbers chair all day and there would be no one to make those great second half adjustments that makes wheaton so good, right?