FB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[matblake]

As an explanation to the newer members of the board, Carthage's mascot used to be the Redmen.  The logo on the helmets had several Native American headdress looking feathers attached to the C.  In compliance with the NCAA, Carthage changed their mascot to the Red Men and removed the feathers.  Hence, the featherless bird.  

You can see the old Carthage helmet logo here.  Just go down to Division III on the left side and find the CCIW.

Never stop to explain a great joke, MB. If people don't get it the first time, they won't laugh after you explain it to them. And those of us that did get your feather joke laughed all the harder for its subtlety.

That explains all the blank stares by Mrs. matblake......... 

[CardinalAlum]

Do I loose my Karma and +Karma for posting in the wrong place? 

No, but you lose it for bad information!!!

I was taking a gander of the regional rankings. I believe they usually take the top 8. Given both Wheaton and NCC win out (highly likely), and Capital losing to Baldin-Wallace. We could see NCC be ranked 8th. The question is will they take a 7-3 OAC team over a 8-2 CCIW team or take a team from another conf.?I also believe Wash U. plays Case Western who is ranked No. 4 in the region. If Wash U. can pull off the win Case Western will also drop down. It will be exciting to see what happens these next couple of weeks... I know they don't like pairing conf. teams in the first round but a NCC, Wheaton rematch sounds pretty nice

What's good for the goose..........

[matblake]

Now onto real football topics.  The Elmhurst vs. Millikin game boils down to 1 thing. Turnovers.  Who is going to keep the ball the longest and execute when they have the ball?  Elmhurst is searching for a running game and Millikin is searching for a #1 QB.  Hmm,  should be a close battle between 2 teams that I would have to say are rather disappointing at this point in the year.

79, no doubt this has been a tough year for the Jays.  You've handled it very well, IMO.  I picked Elmhurst to win in this one.  I think the Jays will turn it over and it will hurt them.  It did against Carthage, Wheaton, North Central.  But at the end of the day Elmhurst is a passing team this year and Millikin is last in pass defense.  I think the Big Blue will let the Bluejays back into the game just as they did last week against Carthage.

[wheels81]

I saw the Trinity lateral play is up for a vote on ESPN as one of the best college plays.

The last time I remember seeing Wheaton use an intentional lateral play was to do the old "hook and ladder" play in late 80''s. 
Is that still in some team's play book?

[devildog29]

I was living in San Antonio the last couple years before moving back here to SoCal, and I saw quite a few Trinity games.  They always struck me as very quick and very athletic, if not overly big.  Even with all that athleticism, I never envisioned a play like that.  That was something else.  I know the Cal-Stanford play will still be the favorite of many people because of the trombone player getting owned at the end, but as for the play itself, that Trinity play was the craziest thing I've ever seen.  Especially the bounce pass at the end.  Incredible.

[Tailgater]

A few years back when Carthage was struggling with the NCAA as far as the mascot goes they thought about a mascot change.  Here was one of their options.  However, the NCAA still had a problem with that logo and suggested that this should be their logo instead.

And a chicken (with or without feathers} has what to do with the Red Men name If you need to follow a post with an explanation for your intended humor of that post, maybe you should defer comedy to others.

By the way, the logo had 2 feathers not several as you infer. Check the logo you posted. Yes I gave you -K for lame humor.

+k for speaking your mind, and for being forthright about your actions!   

And +K back to you for being a gentleman concerning this matter.

[usee]

I was taking a gander of the regional rankings. I believe they usually take the top 8. Given both Wheaton and NCC win out (highly likely), and Capital losing to Baldin-Wallace. We could see NCC be ranked 8th. The question is will they take a 7-3 OAC team over a 8-2 CCIW team or take a team from another conf.?I also believe Wash U. plays Case Western who is ranked No. 4 in the region. If Wash U. can pull off the win Case Western will also drop down. It will be exciting to see what happens these next couple of weeks... I know they don't like pairing conf. teams in the first round but a NCC, Wheaton rematch sounds pretty nice

This is not correct.

1.  You've ignored automatic qualifiers - both the MIAA and IBC champs automatically qualify, but are not among the regionally ranked.  That right away cuts it from 8 to 6.

2.  Pool B ('at large' selections from among independents or conferences without automatic qualifiers) and Pool C (true 'at large' selections, including any 'surplus' pool B teams) selections are made nationally, not regionally (though using regional criteria - go figure!)  Thus, the number of North region teams actually selected for the tourney could be less than (or more than) 8.

While Wheaton (with one loss) would still be likely for a pool C (if they aren't the A), both NCC and IWU get in ONLY if they win the AQ (I'd rate IWU's chance of a C as flatout zero; NCC's as vanishly small).

Mr. Ypsi is right. Although I would clarify that they will definately be 8 teams in the north bracket, there is a chance 1 or more of those are imported from other regions. It is also possible more than 8 north teams are taken and someone would be exported to another bracket.

there are some very informative playoff discussions on other parts of the board including Pool C and Pool B discussions. PP/General football/Pool C is one location.

If NCC wins out and doesn't make the dance the only reason will be because of their loss to WashU. That combined with their loss vs Wheaton will make for a long and bitter offseason in Naperville. But it will also fuel what is becoming a great rivalry in the CCIW for next years game in Wheaton.

[matblake]

there are some very informative playoff discussions on other parts of the board including Pool C and Pool B discussions. PP/General football/Pool C is one location.

One thing that is very important to remember is that Pool C is on a national level.  The playoff committee is under no obligation to make sure that all the regional brackets are filled with teams only from that region.   The committee could theoretically choose all Pool C teams from one region and distribute them evenly throughout all the brackets.

[usee]

there are some very informative playoff discussions on other parts of the board including Pool C and Pool B discussions. PP/General football/Pool C is one location.

One thing that is very important to remember is that Pool C is on a national level.  The playoff committee is under no obligation to make sure that all the regional brackets are filled with teams only from that region.   The committee could theoretically choose all Pool C teams from one region and distribute them evenly throughout all the brackets.

sort of true but also not really. If you read the Pool C discussions you will realize (as I did) that the 7 pool C's are picked nationally they are done w regional criteria. Here is the analogy from that thread:

I always think of it as a table with 4 chairs, one chair for each region.  The top candidate from each region sits in one chair with the rest of the candidates from that region lined up behind them in the order they are ranked.  The committee then looks at the four teams in the chairs and picks the best one.  That team is in and the next team from that region sits in the chair.  After seven picks, the shop is closed.

So the disadvantage to being the second or third candidate in your region, is that you don't get up to the table until the guy in front of you gets in.  So even if you're better than the three other teams at the table, you can't even be considered until the chair in front of your region clears.

So there is a good chance if 1 region is loaded with Pool C teams that other regions could get inferior teams in through this process.

[matblake]

there are some very informative playoff discussions on other parts of the board including Pool C and Pool B discussions. PP/General football/Pool C is one location.

One thing that is very important to remember is that Pool C is on a national level.  The playoff committee is under no obligation to make sure that all the regional brackets are filled with teams only from that region.   The committee could theoretically choose all Pool C teams from one region and distribute them evenly throughout all the brackets.

sort of true but also not really. If you read the Pool C discussions you will realize (as I did) that the 7 pool C's are picked nationally they are done w regional criteria. Here is the analogy from that thread:

I always think of it as a table with 4 chairs, one chair for each region.  The top candidate from each region sits in one chair with the rest of the candidates from that region lined up behind them in the order they are ranked.  The committee then looks at the four teams in the chairs and picks the best one.  That team is in and the next team from that region sits in the chair.  After seven picks, the shop is closed.

So the disadvantage to being the second or third candidate in your region, is that you don't get up to the table until the guy in front of you gets in.  So even if you're better than the three other teams at the table, you can't even be considered until the chair in front of your region clears.

So there is a good chance if 1 region is loaded with Pool C teams that other regions could get inferior teams in through this process.

That is good stuff, thanks usee.  I haven't been over to the Pool C board yet today, darn work getting in the way.......

[usee]

Keep in mind also that in the unlikely event Wheaton were to lose a game this year ( ) and become a pool C candidate they would be compared to Mt St Josephs. One of the primary criteria is results against common opponents and MSJ beat IWU in the "preseason".  counter point to that is that Wheaton's SOS/QOWI is much stronger than MSJ but all this highlights the complexity of the situation.

[Wags]

I think the NC/IWU game boils down to focusing on 3 players.
Fanthorpe, Dunlop, and Ciesel.  If Fanthorpe has a game like he had in the second half of the EC/NC game,  I think he has the tools to lead NC to a close, second half win.
If Dunlop is able to run wild and Ceisel is moving the ball on his quick 10 yard outs,  I think IWU can really overpower NC on offense. 
Should be a great game similar to the NC/Wheaton game earlier this year.

See the following articles regarding IWU and NCC:

In 10/31/07 Pantagraph: 

At 5-0 in CCIW, Titans the ones laughing now

BLOOMINGTON — Most people outside the Illinois Wesleyan football team snickered when the Titans talked about winning a conference championship at the start of the season.

The Titans didn't get any respect from the College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin coaches, either, after being pegged for a seventh-place finish in the preseason poll.

Nobody is laughing anymore except for the Titans, who enter Saturday's 2 p.m. showdown against North Central with a 6-2 overall record and league co-leading 5-0 mark.

"Coming in here and hearing them say we don't think you're going to beat anybody in the conference was really a slap in the face to us and really angered a lot of the seniors," IWU senior center Eric Van Hise said Wednesday.

"As if we didn't have enough motivation, to see that everyone else picks you at the bottom of the pack and doesn't expect anything out of you is really disappointing. We came out trying to earn a lot of respect in the conference. I think this year has been a big step toward that, but we still have two big games left."

IWU defensive end Tim Wilkins was another one of those steamed seniors.

"It's definitely been motivating us from the very first day the rankings came out," Wilkins said. "Coming into this year we knew we were bringing back a lot of seniors defensively and other schools were graduating a lot of people.

"Then they pick you to win one conference game against teams you almost beat last year that graduated all their players. You kind of smile because you know you're going to go out there and surprise people."

North Central (6-2, 4-1) stands alone in third place in the CCIW standings behind IWU and No. 4-ranked Wheaton. IWU will host Wheaton in the Nov. 10 regular-season finale.

"Every week has been a must win for us," IWU coach Norm Eash said. "I don't think anything changes. Our players have done a great job of keeping everything in perspective.

"Our theme was to take them one at a time and we've done that. The next team up is North Central."

Dunlop nearing record

Senior running back Marcus Dunlop ran for 142 yards in last week's 20-14 win at North Park to move into second place on IWU's all-time rushing list. Dunlap has 2,510 career yards, 263 behind all-time leader Kurt Swearingen (2,772, 1975-78).

"Every week our confidence in the running game keeps building," Van Hise said. "For the O line we're getting really excited. Things are starting to happen for us. We're seeing the fruits of our labor."

Freshman Bo Lanter, who added 93 yards on the ground against North Park, may see more action this week with Dunlop listed as questionable because of an ankle injury. Senior defensive back Brian Smith (leg) is also questionable.

"You hope in these types of games players will step up and get themselves on the field, and they will," Eash said. "The nice thing with Marcus being banged up is Lanter is back full speed. We're OK there."

Eash vs. Thorne

Eash will be facing fellow IWU graduate John Thorne, who has turned the North Central program around in his six-year tenure. Last season the Cardinals won their first CCIW title since 1960 and first postseason win in school history.

"He's done a great job with that program," Eash said. "It was a sleeping giant and he awoken it. They've got it rolling now. I look at is as a credit for Illinois Wesleyan because he's a grad."

Eash downplayed any personal rivalry with Thorne. IWU beat North Central in Thorne's first season, but the Cardinals have won the last four meetings.

"Do I want to beat John Thorne? Sure I want to be John Thorne," Eash said. "That's just the competition there is. Besides, North Central stands in our way. We have to go through North Central to get to a championship."
________________________________________

ANOTHER ARTICLE IN TODAY'S SUN-TIMES READS AS FOLLOWS:

SMALL COLLEGES: N. Central's Fanthorpe chews 'em up
November 1, 2007
BY DARYL VAN SCHOUWEN dvanschouwen@suntimes.com
Aaron Fanthorpe is settling into the No. 1 quarterback role for North Central. The gap-toothed sophomore from Naperville North has hiked his passing-efficiency rating to 146.3, which ranks 23rd in Division III, but he's every bit the threat on foot.
In five College Conference of Illinois & Wisconsin games, Fanthorpe has averaged 180.8 yards passing and 64.6 rushing for a league-best 245.4 yards per game of total offense. In North Central's 31-15 victory Saturday at Augustana -- the Cardinals' first win there in 28 years -- Fanthorpe was 11-for-20 for 105 yards and two touchdowns and rushed for a team-high 106 yards on 17 carries.
The performance earned the 5-11, 185-pounder his second CCIW player of the week honor in three weeks.
''Our young quarterback is just turning into a phenomenal player,'' North Central coach John Thorne said.
Thorne likes the toughness he sees in Fanthorpe, whose brother Nick is a standout wrestler at Iowa State. Aaron lost his two front teeth playing basketball in high school.
''He pulls that mouthguard out on game days, and it's like, 'You're not going to get many dates with that look,''' Thorne said. ''But he's real tough, and he keeps getting better. He has a chance to be something special.''
North Central (6-2, 4-1), needing two victories for a shot at the Division III playoffs, hosts Illinois Wesleyan (6-2, 5-0) at 2 p.m. Saturday before finishing the season at Carthage.
• • Safety Jerwane Ford (Collins), who forced two fumbles and made nine tackles in North Park's near upset of Illinois Wesleyan (a 20-14 loss), was named CCIW defensive player of the week

[Pat Coleman]

I saw the Trinity lateral play is up for a vote on ESPN as one of the best college plays.

The last time I remember seeing Wheaton use an intentional lateral play was to do the old "hook and ladder" play in late 80''s. 
Is that still in some team's play book?

Many, many teams' playbook, yes.

[79jaybird]

Pat, do you think the odds are high that the CCIW may only get 1 team in this year if Wheaton wins out and grabs the AQ?  NC's loss to WashU hurts and IWU has already lost a couple of games etc. -M

[79jaybird]

MatBlake- Yes it's been a great/sad year all in one.  Great to be 4-0 after a great rivalry win over Carthage, then frustrating to see the wheels go flat on the bus down the stretch run.  So is life in the CCIW where anything/everything can happen.