FB: Northwest Conference

[MonroviaCat]

Conference Rankings from Around the Nation:

No. 4 Northwest Conference (NWC)
2006 non-conference record: 13-13 (One team went 1-1 in the playoffs)
Reasoning at the time of Kickoff ranking: Bumped down after Linfield had an off year and Whitworth could not carry the conference by itself in the playoffs. Some of its depth had wilted as Pacific Lutheran and Willamette slid below .500 and Puget Sound's 7-3 season included not-very-competitive showings against the NWC's top two.
2007 non-conference record so far: 9-12
What's been established so far in '07: Early NWC results send mixed messages, as Linfield looked powerful again vs. Hardin-Simmons and Whitworth knocked off UW-Stout. But the league is also just 6-6 against the SCIAC and Chapman, the only other measuring stick in Division III on the West Coast. Redlands won 24-12 at Whitworth and Whittier won 28-26 at Puget Sound, leaving us to question the NWC's overall strength this year.


No. 20 Southern California Intercollegiate Athletic Conference (SCIAC)
2006 non-conference record: 10-12 (One team went 0-1 in playoffs)
Reasoning at the time of Kickoff ranking: Beyond Occidental, teams hadn't always been competitive in non-conference play.
2007 non-conference record so far: 7-7
What's been established so far in '07: The SCIAC is capable of surprising. Redlands' win at Whitworth meant Occidental may have a challenger on its hands.

Interesting look at the two West coast conferences.  I'd like to contest that the SCIAC is getting stronger as opposed to the NWC getting weaker... but that's up for debate.

I think it all depends on how a conference is rated.  I think that this year the SCIAC may be better than the NWC from the bottom up.  The worst of the NWC are pretty bad this year while the traditonal bottom of the SCIAC have looked improved over past performances.  Of course, what really matters is how the top teams play when they meet each other.  This year, the SCIAC has the edge with Relands beating Whitworth.  If the playoffs go as they have in the past we'll probably get to see how the top teams from these 2 conferences match up.  Linfield vs. Oxy maybe....

[wildcat11]

Of course, what really matters is how the top teams play when they meet each other.  This year, the SCIAC has the edge with Relands beating Whitworth.

Until a SCIAC members puts Linfield on their schedule and beats Linfield then I don't think you can say the top of the SCIAC has the edge over the top of the NWC.  However I will say the that so far Menlo has done zero to help the strenght of the conference but has actually hurt the NWC's national rep so far.

PLU getting back on their feet really adds spark back into the conference.

[D O.C.]

so far Menlo has done zero to help the strenght of the conference but has actually hurt the NWC's national rep so far.

Truth...and I still give Menlo cudos for knowing how to schedule all over the country and pay for it (in more ways than one).

[Fear the Poet]

That's alright -- appreciate any answer you want to give. Thanks!

you might want to consider leaving the headshot off next time:)

pop warner was my favorite when my son played,then High school,now D3 is where it is at.

If my son is not involved, I prefer High school. No parents ruining everything like in Pop Warner. You know the old saying.."the only thing that can ruin a youth sporting event, is a parent"  I just love seeing the High school guys out there under the lights!  Part excitement, part jealousy for me. I want to be out there!

[Gray Fox]

However I will say the that so far Menlo has done zero to help the strenght of the conference but has actually hurt the NWC's national rep so far.

After being picked on by MonroviaCat and OxyBob for my Menlo pick this week on the pick'em board I decided to review my assumptions.

I was assuming that Menlo would have all of their best players back and that would help them play well this year.  After checking their roster, they lost about half of the guys that should have been returning.  I'm sure that is the reason they are not doing so well.  If this happens too often, every year will be a "rebuilding" year.

[wildcat11]

However I will say the that so far Menlo has done zero to help the strenght of the conference but has actually hurt the NWC's national rep so far.

After being picked on by MonroviaCat and OxyBob for my Menlo pick this week on the pick'em board I decided to review my assumptions.

I was assuming that Menlo would have all of their best players back and that would help them play well this year.  After checking their roster, they lost about half of the guys that should have been returning.  I'm sure that is the reason they are not doing so well.  If this happens too often, every year will be a "rebuilding" year.

Actually the more confusing pick from you is taking Willamette over Linfield.  This Willamette teams plays with a ton of heart but I would consider that a huge upset if they toppled Linfield this weekend.

[Gray Fox]

Actually the more confusing pick from you is taking Willamette over Linfield.  This Willamette teams plays with a ton of heart but I would consider that a huge upset if they toppled Linfield this weekend.

I probably was using too little brain and too much cojones.

[MonroviaCat]

Of course, what really matters is how the top teams play when they meet each other.  This year, the SCIAC has the edge with Relands beating Whitworth.

Until a SCIAC members puts Linfield on their schedule and beats Linfield then I don't think you can say the top of the SCIAC has the edge over the top of the NWC.  However I will say the that so far Menlo has done zero to help the strenght of the conference but has actually hurt the NWC's national rep so far.

PLU getting back on their feet really adds spark back into the conference.

11--What I meant was that the SCIAC has the edge this year in games played by the better programs (e.g. Linfield, Whitworth, PLU..) of the 2 conerences.  I was not suggesting that Whitworth and Relands are the best teams in their conference (though anything is possible as we learned the hard way last year).  Obviously a game between Linfield and Oxy would be a good measure of which Conference can offer the best contender.  PLU vs. Redlands/Oxy might be interesting to see as well. 

[MonroviaCat]

probably was using too little brain and too much cojones.

My wife accuses me of that all the time! 

[light n' darkness]

what up wildcats of all shapes, sizes and decades:

as for the loose look i think its gone, maybe intill they bring back the short shorts for the NBA. man that takes it back a ways.

here is something for discussion:

how do you guys out there rate "the streak" of the wildcats to that of say:

Mount Union  - winning 55 game in a row.

De LaSalle High School (Concord California) - winning 151 games in a row in 13 years.

i think the de la salle winning streak is the most impressive in sports history.

anyway

lnd out

[D O.C.]

Mount Union answering the door with a punch every year.

LINFIELD doing it so long.

De La Salle High School beating the So Cal giants when DLS was strong.
(I came late and only saw Mission Viejo kick 'em good)

Lewis and Clark's first two back to back wins.

[George Thompson]

SCIAC vs. NWC strength.

OxyOswald and Wildcat 11 both make good points.    I love the NWC.    But, it is not the same conference of 10-15 years ago.   Except for Linfield, it is much weaker.   

I do not believe the NWC is #4 in the country.   Lately, only Linfield has shown the strength to compete head-to-head with powerhouses St. Johns, UW-Whitewater, Mary Hardin Baylor, etc.   PLU is a shadow of their 80s and 90s power.   Hopefully, they are on the way back.    Whitworth is good, but again no match for the NWC powers of the 80s and 90s, nor the Div. III Midwest powerhouses.

Yes, the SCIAC should schedule Linfield every year.   They would improve by doing so.   

GO CATS GO!     Swat the fly Saturday!

George
   

[Foss]

We have to remember that, other than the WIAC (the Wisconsin conference) and OAC (Mt. Union conference), there are very few, if any conferences that have more than 1-2 very good teams, or "powerhouses." It's true that lately in the NWC only Linfield has shown it can compete with the nation's best, but many conferences have NO teams that can claim that, and of the conferences that can claim it, almost all have no more than 1-2 teams at most on that level.

The NWC still has the 2nd highest playoff winning percentage (in what many view as the toughest region to win playoff games), and last year the 3rd different team won a playoff game. Also, out of 230+ different teams, the league has had 2 of its 7 teams ranked as one of the 25 best at one point in the season by this website the last couple of years.

Yes, the bottom half of the NWC is very weak, but that is the case with almost every other conference. (The  WIAC is very good top to bottom, but even the bottom half of the conference Mt. Union plays in is extremely weak). I think the important thing is to keep a 2nd strong team in the conference. A 3rd would be an added bonus, and obviously isn't going to happen every year.

Right now, the conference is kind of hard to figure out. A couple of good wins, and a couple of bad losses. We'll see as the season progresses how many strong team(s) there are this year.

[Ralph Turner]

However I will say the that so far Menlo has done zero to help the strength of the conference but has actually hurt the NWC's national rep so far.

Respectfully, Menlo's value to the NWC is:

1)  another West Region opponent that is willing to go home-and-home,
2)  a trip to Menlo spends less of the travel budget than anyone else in D3 available.
3)  the Pool A bid in 2008.  (You win conference, and you get the bid.  Some non-conference (in-region) loss won't hurt you too badly.  You can take a chance on a WIAC, a HSU or a UMHB.  I anticipate only 2 Pool B bids in 2010 if the NAthCon and the SLAIC  gets their bids.)
4)  some leeway for the Pool A bid, if/when Pacific or someone else comes on board and L&C doesn't field a team.

[wildcat11]

However I will say the that so far Menlo has done zero to help the strength of the conference but has actually hurt the NWC's national rep so far.

Respectfully, Menlo's value to the NWC is:

1)  another West Region opponent that is willing to go home-and-home,
2)  a trip to Menlo spends less of the travel budget than anyone else in D3 available.
3)  the Pool A bid in 2008.  (You win conference, and you get the bid.  Some non-conference (in-region) loss won't hurt you too badly.  You can take a chance on a WIAC, a HSU or a UMHB.  I anticipate only 2 Pool B bids in 2010 if the NAthCon and the SLAIC  gets their bids.)
4)  some leeway for the Pool A bid, if/when Pacific or someone else comes on board and L&C doesn't field a team.

Ralph,

1)  They were willing to go home/home as an indy since 1999 so that isn't that big of deal. But it does help the other NWC teams that have not played Menlo in the past.
2)  See Number 1 but yes the flight to San Jose from PDX is more affordable than any other flight out of PDX
3)  So far this is the big bonus for having Menlo in. 

However, the main thing Menlo has done is add a bad program to the NWC.  However, Menlo can turn it around in a hurry due to location, talent pool, and admissions.  They don't have to face the same hurdles Lewis and Clark is battling and could turn it around in a hurry....but I have my doubts.

Frank,

As someone who was playing in the NWC 10-15 years ago I don't know saying the conference is weaker now is super accurate.    I would say that Linfield, Whitworth, Puget Sound are much better programs than they were during the mid late 90's.  PLU is building back up and Lewis and Clark was still terrible 10-15 years ago.  The main team that is way different is Willamette and have added a bad Menlo program.  WU was a power with Hawkins running the show but have fallen off due to the schools rising admissions standards/cost. 

It's a good discussion but I tend to feel the same way as Foss.