Top 25 talk

[sac]

Hoosiers is my  personal favorite of the bunch, but White Men Can't Jump is set in sunny Southern California.  Perfect for a cold winters night.

4 degrees, windchill  -16

[Mr. Ypsi]

I guarantee that Hell (MI - a hamlet about 25 miles from Ann Arbor) has frozen over!

[LogShow]

Big match up out west tonight...

#12 Puget Sound travels to #24 Whitworth

Lets go Puget Sound

[April]

In the latest "OMG WHEATON LOST ANOTHER ALL AMERICAN" saga, Wheaton is currently up at Millikin by 12 at the half. Millikin is in foul trouble early, Wheaton shot 67% from the field in the first half. You can listen at www.wetn.org or watch live stats here

Millikin is, of course, one of the 37 CCIW teams receiving votes. My guess/hope would be that they aren't after they lose this one.

[ephoops]

Hoosiers is my personal favorite....

[Darryl Nester]

How They Fared (Complete)

The men's games ended early (only one game today), so here is the final report, in a slightly revised--and I hope improved--layout.

Top 25

Rank	Pts	Team	W-L	Results
#1	618	Wheaton (Ill.)	15-0	def. #11 Augustana, 79-71; def. #38 Millikin, 61-47
#2	601	St. Thomas	14-0	def. St. John's, 86-55; def. Gustavus Adolphus, 70-49
#3	578	Washington U.	13-1	def. Case Western Reserve, 87-77; def. Emory, 79-58
#4	557	UW-Stevens Point	13-2	def. UW-Stout, 78-58; def. UW-Superior, 104-60
#5	487	Buena Vista	14-1	def. Dubuque, 66-62; def. Loras, 86-75
#6	482	UW-Platteville	14-2	def. UW-La Crosse, 71-61
#7	472	UW-Whitewater	14-2	def. UW-Stout, 99-71
#8	448	Capital	14-1	def. Heidelberg, 85-53; def. Otterbein, 79-60
#9	435	Amherst	13-1	def. Babson, 62-55; def. Wesleyan, 76-46; def. Connecticut College, 74-49
#10	347	Trinity (Texas)	14-1	def. Birmingham-Southern, 65-56; def. Rhodes, 83-77
#11	319	Augustana	12-4	LOST at #1 Wheaton (Ill.), 71-79; def. T#39 North Central (Ill.), 80-63
#12	301	Puget Sound	13-2	def. #24 Whitworth, 89-77; def. Whitman, 75-60
#13	283	Ithaca	14-1	def. Potsdam State, 116-94; def. Hartwick, 56-49
#14	244	Richard Stockton	15-2	def. Hunter, 100-60; def. Montclair State, 69-63
#15	227	Mass-Dartmouth	13-1	def. Eastern Connecticut, 81-64; def. Plymouth State, 94-61
#16	217	Elms	13-1	def. Wheelock, 96-68; def. Southern Vermont, 123-88
#17	208	St. Norbert	12-1	def. Knox, 64-53; def. Grinnell, 107-96
#18	180	Roanoke	14-2	def. Guilford, 80-76; def. Bridgewater (Va.), 79-66; LOST (at home) to Washington and Lee, 66-68
#19	175	Carnegie Mellon	11-2	IDLE
#20	156	Elmhurst	11-4	def. North Park, 88-76; def. #37 Illinois Wesleyan, 90-72
#21	137	Franklin and Marshall	13-1	LOST at McDaniel, 57-66; def. Haverford, 70-56; def. Muhlenberg, 60-59
#22	133	Texas-Dallas	14-1	def. East Texas Baptist, 76-61; def. LeTourneau, 60-59
#23	122	Anderson	12-4	def. Bluffton, 81-73 OT; LOST at Transylvania, 69-80
#24	113	Whitworth	12-3	LOST (at home) to #12 Puget Sound, 77-89; def. Pacific Lutheran, 88-60
#25	45	William Paterson	12-2	def. Ramapo, 67-53; def. Rutgers-Camden, 70-34

Others receiving votes

Rank	Pts	Team	W-L	Results
#26	36	Gettysburg	11-2	def. Haverford, 71-62; def. Swarthmore, 66-51; def. Ursinus, 73-68
#27	32	St. Mary's (Md.)	12-3	LOST at York (Pa.), 97-101 OT; def. Mary Washington, 81-77 OT
#28	30	Carthage	11-4	LOST (at home) to #37 Illinois Wesleyan, 70-73; def. North Park, 73-65
#29	29	Middlebury	14-2	def. Bates, 73-65 OT; def. Tufts, 108-64
#30	26	Rochester	11-3	def. Keuka, 65-54; LOST (neutral site) to T#33 St. John Fisher, 66-71; def. Geneseo State, 81-63
#31	22	DeSales	12-2	def. Manhattanville, 63-59; LOST at Delaware Valley, 70-72
#32	15	Centre	12-3	def. Colorado College, 66-51; def. Austin, 77-59
T#33	14	Salem State	12-2	def. Massachusetts College, 105-66; def. Westfield State, 69-47
T#33	14	St. John Fisher	12-2	def. Roberts Wesleyan  @ Nazareth, 72-55; def. #30 Rochester, 71-66; def. Nazareth, 76-71
#35	13	Randolph-Macon	12-3	def. Eastern Mennonite, 82-73; def. Emory and Henry, 93-76
#36	12	Carroll	11-3	def. Ripon, 99-95; def. Grinnell, 108-102; def. Monmouth, 79-66
#37	8	Illinois Wesleyan	9-6	def. #28 Carthage, 73-70; LOST (at home) to #20 Elmhurst, 72-90
#38	7	Millikin	10-4	LOST at T#39 North Central (Ill.), 55-66; LOST (at home) to #1 Wheaton (Ill.), 47-61
T#39	5	Claremont-Mudd-Scripps	10-4	def. Cal Lutheran, 59-55; LOST (at home) to Occidental, 51-52
T#39	5	North Central (Ill.)	11-4	def. #38 Millikin, 66-55; LOST at #11 Augustana, 63-80
T#39	5	Wilmington	11-5	def. Otterbein, 71-62; LOST at John Carroll, 66-92
T#39	5	Worcester Polytech	12-3	def. Trinity (Conn.), 62-54; def. Clark, 91-82
#43	2	Rochester Tech	10-4	LOST at Nazareth, 73-87; def. Brockport State, 62-61; def. Roberts Wesleyan, 68-53

Other teams to watch (as suggested by posters on this board)

Rank	Team	W-L	Results
---	Cal Lutheran	10-4	LOST at T#39 Claremont-Mudd-Scripps, 55-59; def. La Verne, 73-61
---	Hiram	10-5	LOST at Wooster, 63-79; def. Denison, 74-46
---	Milwaukee Engineering	11-3	def. Concordia (Wis.), 77-59; def. Concordia (Ill.), 81-61

[sac]

After seeing this nicely produced table by DarylNester, somewhere I'm sure a man in the heart of Ohio Amish country is banging his head on a table.

[David Collinge]

After seeing this nicely produced table by DarylNester, somewhere I'm sure a man in the heart of Ohio Amish country is banging his head on a table.

My close association with the Amish notwithstanding, I have never been opposed to progress.  Darryl and Hoosier Titan (I'm not sure how the labor is distributed between them) are doing a wonderful job on this project.  +k to both.

[sciacguru]

By the way, Carthage just beat the #7 team in the county!

I saw Carthage play. Cal Lutheran manhandled them and won easily. Carthage was wholly ordinary. If the Red Men beat the so-called "#7 team in the county!" then the CCIW is even more overrated than I already knew.

I watched the link to the Carthage/Cal Lu game today and I would say "manhandled" and "won easily" is at best an exaggeration of the game from what I could see. Cal Lu got out to a 10 pt lead in the first 6 minutes, played even the rest of the half to lead by11 at the break, led by 17 with about 11 min left and then Carthage came back (due largely to CLU inability to handle the press--21 turnovers) and with 4.22  to play it was a 5 pt game when Carthage lost Fendley (ejected) and Tolo (fouled out). Without 2 of their starters they they made Cal LU earn it but got hammered on the boards down the stretch without Tolo. I was impressed with Cal Lu as a team but from what I could tell I don't see them as significantly better than Carthage. Steve D. scored 38 pts and Cal Lu had no answer for him.

Nothing like looking at a game through CCIW-colored glasses, I guess. Just so I'm clear, we are talking about the Carthage-Cal Lutheran game that was played on November 24, 2008, right? In that game, which I attended, Carthage led 7-5 after 2 minutes and never led again. CLU led by 13 at 10:00 of the first half and by 11 at the break. This is what you term "play[ing] even the rest of the half." In the second half, CLU had a 17 point lead at 11:00. Carthage made a run and got it down to 7. At 4:22 a double technical foul was called. Djurickovic made 2 FTs for Carthage, and Knudsen made 2 FTs for CLU, so CLU's lead remained at 7. This is what you term "a 5 pt game." A minute-forty and 4-0 later it was 11 and game over, never in doubt. Carthage's front line got hammered by Andy Meier & Co.: Adam Tolo was bageled and fouled out, Adam Stuart scored 6 and fouled out, and Richard Williams scored 4 and fouled out. Lucky for Eric Moore he only played 3 minutes and picked up 1 foul or he'd have been well on his way to fouling out, too. No "answer" for Djurickovic was necessary since there was no question as to the result. He is a mighty fine FT shooter, however.

OxyBob

ToxicBob,

What's with the attitude? I can certainly tell you if you think I have CCIW colored glasses you haven't read many of my posts. I wouldn't have minded if Cal Lu beat Carthage by 100, let alone 6. I also wouldn't mind if Carthage didn't win another game as I am 21 turnovers and losing a 17 pt lead isn't exactly manhandling anybody. Carthage shot 38% and it wasn't because of the contested looks from what I could see. Cal Lu shot 52% in their own gym and won a game by 6. According to CLU's own broadcast team the game was certainly in doubt down the stretch and they both said multiple times that CLU couldn't guard Steve D.

You can keep your battered poster syndrome all you want. All I did was give a viewpoint that I thought Cal Lu and Carthage are pretty even at worst. You want to slant that as CCIW Bias when in fact I am promoting Cal LU. IF the voters think Carthage is top 40 then CLU certainly should be....I think that's what I said. CLU was certainly the better team that night but if they were so dominant they wouldn't have turned it over so much and let Carthage back in the game at the end. But if you don't think a 5 or 7 pt game with 4min left is still in doubt then you keep going to embellishment school and I'm sure everyone will believe CLU "waxed" the Redmen like you keep promoting.

I have been out and about and havent been able to respond/write at my normal rate, but I have to stick up for my Kingsmen.  Sure "waxed" may not be the proper term, but they were the better and more dominant team.  Granted 21 turnovers doesnt warrant a stellar evaluation but with the 21 turnovers they still beat a good Carthage team.  And if some no name bench player doesnt come in and hit 3 3's and get a career high of 10 pts, then maybe "waxed" would be appropriate.  As for not stopping Steve D, well who does???  His season low is 23 against the then #1 team in the country.  How about them holding Fendley 10 pts below his average, holding Tolo scoreless and fouling him out?  I think that is a pretty good performance defensively.  And lets be honest, the way Steve D gets to the foul line, Carthage will be in every game.  Let it be clear, I am not suggesting that CLU be in the top 25 or even get votes, but maybe some people should rethink the top 25 and their votes.

[Pat Coleman]

A voter asked for DePauw to be added to the tracking report that I send out to them. Just FYI.

[Hoosier Titan]

After seeing this nicely produced table by DarylNester, somewhere I'm sure a man in the heart of Ohio Amish country is banging his head on a table.

My close association with the Amish notwithstanding, I have never been opposed to progress.  Darryl and Hoosier Titan (I'm not sure how the labor is distributed between them) are doing a wonderful job on this project.  +k to both.

Darryl has done most of the "labor"--he wrote (and continues to refine) the program to generate these updates.  I fill in when he's busy.  I do think they're a wonderful way to keep up, and I thank David for showing us the example.  It was interesting that Darryl and I started the project up again within a day of each other completely independently. 

[April]

Personally I just hope the CCIW results this week solidify what CCIW teams should be getting votes so we can get back down to a reasonable number like 3.

[thundermike11]

I'm curious as to how Wheaton will be treated in the poll. Is it possible that the injury to Kent Raymond could cause Wheaton to drop even though to this point they are still undefeated. Any thoughts?

[scottiedawg]

+56 Gettysburg
+50 UMass Dartmouth
+48 Richard Stockton
+38 Puget Sound
+33 William Patterson
-22 DeSales
-23 Elms
-24 Rochester
-26 Carthage
-27 St. Mary's
-45 Roanoke
-55 Augustana
-63 Whitworth
-72 Franklin & Marshall
-85 Anderson

[scottiedawg]

Number of teams that received votes by poll
Pre-53
1-51
2-51
3-44
4-42
5-42
6-43
7-39