Top 25 talk

[ECSUalum]

Of the Top 25 teams in last year's preseason poll, 14 of them made the Top 25 in the final poll. Several other teams in the preseason Top 25 ended up at #26 and #28   I think that's a pretty good number and shows that the voters did a fairly good job with their selections at the beginning of the year.

I'd also be willing to bet that a majority of the regulars on D3hoops are quite happy that there is a preseason poll. In fact an awful lot of us can't wait for it to come out.

I can't help but wonder if ECSUalum would be so riled up about the preseason poll if his Eastern Connecticut Warriors had been ranked 15th or so instead of 33rd in the ORV category.    Last year they weren't ranked in the preseason poll at all but cracked the top 25 by week 7 and ended up at #14 in the final poll.  This year they are already 6 weeks ahead of where they were last year at this time.   I'd be happy with that if it were my team.     

Did I say anything about my concern with ECSU'S RANKING??!!!! No one know how good or bad Eastern will be, (except for the Coach Geitner and his staff and players), untill the season starts and games are played. 

[ECSUalum]

Pat, With all due respect, IMHO, wouldn't it be better to wait for some NCAA stats,W/L records, rosters, etc etc to roll in before you publish an "early vs pre season"  hoops poll!!!!!!  Again IMO, Pre season polls "do not compute"
I know people like to see their teams ranked early in the season, but, what, in fact, benefit does D3Hoops get from a pre season poll?  If it is monetary, then maybe I can understand the rational, otherwise, I dont 

OK, we get it, you think it's a waste of time and inaccurate. 

Easy solution: don't read it.  Or a simple statement that you think the polls are questionable, if you want to express your opinion.  But while you're getting on the pollsters for being defensive, you're also demeaning their work in multiple posts.

Many of us are very appreciative of the time and effort it takes to put together these polls, yes even the preseason polls.  It stimulates interest and conversation, including detailed discussion about teams and players.  It's also interesting to see how the experts that are polled view things going into the season.  We fully understand the polls are inaccurate by their nature, but amazingly that doesn't keep us awake at night.

Keep up the good work, D3hoops!

Its an ego trip for the teams that show up in the preseason polls, thats why everyone follows it.  And to your comment "dont read it", dont be rediculous!!!   

[ECSUalum]

Or midseason additions, like Cabrini had last year. No way to account for that in October.

Your "stats" are half a slice of one year's poll. Compare that to other polls, while you're at it. You've done about 5% of the necessary work, just enough to satisfy your own point of view.

Then show everyone how well your predictions, (performance) have been over the last 5 years!!!!!

With all due respect, Pat is a busy man who is running a number of websites and a message board that is by far the most popular in Division III athletics.

If you want to know how well the "predictions" are vs. the "performance," do it yourself like the rest of us have.

And, these aren't Pat's predictions. It's a poll constructed by 25 media, coaches, administrators, etc. One person could put out their own poll (and we actually DO run a poster's poll... you should check it out if you're interested).

The poll is for fun. If you're not having any fun with it, then you don't have to "participate" in it.


D3hoops.com (and the other sites in the D3sports.com family) don't do anything that isn't done by other media outlets, such as the AP or ESPN. Are you calling them out on their preseason polls?


Or, how about this? Why not, as people have suggested, put your own poll out? You'll realize how difficult it is to rank the top 6% of teams, period, let alone in order.

And if you don't want to do that, why don't you figure out how far the teams moved compared to the full 405 teams, not just the top 14? You just acknowledged that the poll identified 8 of the top 14 teams in the top 14. 5 of the other 6 received votes in the poll (i.e. were identified by pollsters as being in the top 6% or with the possibility of attaining that level).

That's one of the difficulties of a poll at any point during the year.

Do you select teams that are good right now? Do you select teams that have played well throughout the year (i.e. the full body of work)? Do you select teams that have the potential for greatness by the end of the year? How do you deal with injuries (See Wheaton, Kent Raymond several years ago or UW Stevens Point, Tyler Tillema last season for example).


You could pot shot the rankings... but look deeper. Preseason #2 Augustana had their starting center leave the team half-way through the year. They started off the year 11-1... They finished 8-6 after they lost a significant piece of their team.

We could go on... but what's the use? Each team has a narrative. These are often complex and the fact of the matter is that we're talking about humans and college-age humans at that. Things change throughout the year and teams don't always reach their potential or live up to their expectations.



The top-25 poll is no different than what pretty much every conference in the land does. They put out preseason polls for their conferences as well.

Then I urge everyone to continue to have "fun" with the preseason poll.

[Roundball999]

Pat, With all due respect, IMHO, wouldn't it be better to wait for some NCAA stats,W/L records, rosters, etc etc to roll in before you publish an "early vs pre season"  hoops poll!!!!!!  Again IMO, Pre season polls "do not compute"
I know people like to see their teams ranked early in the season, but, what, in fact, benefit does D3Hoops get from a pre season poll?  If it is monetary, then maybe I can understand the rational, otherwise, I dont 

OK, we get it, you think it's a waste of time and inaccurate. 

Easy solution: don't read it.  Or a simple statement that you think the polls are questionable, if you want to express your opinion.  But while you're getting on the pollsters for being defensive, you're also demeaning their work in multiple posts.

Many of us are very appreciative of the time and effort it takes to put together these polls, yes even the preseason polls.  It stimulates interest and conversation, including detailed discussion about teams and players.  It's also interesting to see how the experts that are polled view things going into the season.  We fully understand the polls are inaccurate by their nature, but amazingly that doesn't keep us awake at night.

Keep up the good work, D3hoops!

Its an ego trip for the teams that show up in the preseason polls, thats why everyone follows it.  And to your comment "dont read it", dont be rediculous!!!   

Ego trip, fun, inaccurate, whatever.  People enjoy it, including many of us on these boards who have no direct involvement with any current team.  We all understand these polls are far from perfect, so your posts just come off as sour grapes.

[ECSUalum]

Sour grapes ?!!!! whatever!!!!!!!!

[7express]

This maybe OT, but the Transylvania UK exhibition game is on Fox College Sports-Atlantic tonight at 8:00 PM.  FCS-Atlantic is one of those digital cable packages.  There's also FCS-Central and FCS-Pacfic, so make sure your tuned into the FCS-Atlantic channel.

[Greek Tragedy]

Checking the schedules for the pick em league...man, #24 Randolph-Macon has it rough. Plays Christopher Newport who was 23-5 last year, then #16 Tranyslvania and then #19 St. Mary's (Md).

[sac]

Checking the schedules for the pick em league...man, #24 Randolph-Macon has it rough. Plays Christopher Newport who was 23-5 last year, then #16 Tranyslvania and then #19 St. Mary's (Md).

Or a great opportunity to make an early season statement

[magicman]

Checking the schedules for the pick em league...man, #24 Randolph-Macon has it rough. Plays Christopher Newport who was 23-5 last year, then #16 Tranyslvania and then #19 St. Mary's (Md).

Plattsburgh State has to play #4 Middlebury on 11-25, then go to Oswego State who ended last year at #17 with a 26-4 log and is #32 in the ORV category this year. On 12-4 they travel to Keene State, a preseason pick to win the Little East Conference by many, and #41 in the ORV category (19-8 last year and have their 4 top scorers returning). They visit #9 Franklin & Marshall on Jan.2nd and could face Eastern Connecticut (#33 in the ORV category on Jan 3rd).  4 of those teams won games in the NCAA tournament  this past year and many people felt that Keene State deserved a Pool C bid. With 4 of those 5 games on the road I'll be real happy if they go 2-3.

[Greek Tragedy]

Tough schedule indeed but RMC's stretch is three games in four days to open the season!

[madzillagd]

As some anticipated, RMC is the first to fall with a 77-70 loss to Christopher Newport. 

Consider the #24 spot officially up for grabs in the next poll.

[John Gleich]

#15 Stevens Point trailed 21-11 in the first half but closed on an 18-2(?) run to close the half. Led by as many as 18 early in the second half and held on to win at Lawrence.

#15 UWSP 72
Lawrence 64

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

As some anticipated, RMC is the first to fall with a 77-70 loss to Christopher Newport. 

Consider the #24 spot officially up for grabs in the next poll.

Well, unless they succeed in their next two tests (Transylvania and St. Mary's - both ranked) and others fall around them.

[Pat Coleman]

Next poll isn't until a week from Monday.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Yep - meant to mention that - I think the lack of sleep is already getting to me... doesn't this usually only happen in mid-December and March? What in the world is going on in November? Oh... that's right... back to work...