Top 25 talk

[augie77]

Yes, Augustana is still 3-0, but Illinois counts it as win, moving to 5-0.  The loss of Forward Pierson Wofford to a torn ACL is very real, however.  He was leading the Vikings in both scoring and rebounding.

[Greek Tragedy]

Yes, Augustana is still 3-0, but Illinois counts it as win, moving to 5-0.  The loss of Forward Pierson Wofford to a torn ACL is very real, however.  He was leading the Vikings in both scoring and rebounding.

Wait, so if the game didn't count for Augi, why does the ACL tear count?

In all seriousness, that's too bad, for any player and team.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

There is always a large gathering of friends and family around a large table with plenty of food that helps ring in the new basketball season. Many call it Thanksgiving, we tend to call it the second weekend of the Division III season.

And one again the early weeks of the season have not disappointed... nor been lacking surprises.

Preseason Top 25 teams have lost as often as turkeys have been overcooked this holiday week. Teams who have had surprise starts have followed up with continued surprises or more head-scratching results. However, no matter the games and no matter the wins and losses, we are thankful to have the season here and be able to talk about it.

On Sunday's Hoopsville, Dave tries to gobble up the leftovers and figure out who was granted their wish after the snap of the wishbone. At the same time, we take the time to recognize a milestone at D3hoops.com: 20 years of being ... D3hoops.com - the home of Division III men's and women's basketball.

Dave also chats with a new dynamic duo in Baltimore. Hope Josh Loeffler and Catherine Bixby are settling into jobs that have seen the same coaches (Bill Nelson and Nancy Funk) in over thirty years.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show LIVE starting at 7:00 PM ET (or On Demand) here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2017-18/nov19. You can also listen to the podcast, located to the right, after the show is off the air.

You can also send your questions to the show and have them featured on the Hoopsville Mailbag segment. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com.

Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Pat Coleman, Editor-in-Chief, D3sports.com
- Tim Sweeney, Hobart men's coach
- Josh Loeffler, Johns Hopkins men's coach
- Katherine Bixby, Johns Hopkins women's coach

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville

[Darryl Nester]

How They Fared (Complete)

Top 25

Rank	Pts	Team	W-L	Results
#1	621	Whitman	3-0	def. Waynesburg, 113-74; def. Gallaudet, 122-58; won at Walla Walla, 116-78
#2	596	Augustana	4-0	def. (n) Heidelberg, 73-64; def. Calvin, 80-69; def. Alma, 65-53; def. MacMurray, 89-57
#3	561	Williams	4-0	def. Salem State, 80-68; def. Stevens, 73-55; won at Massachusetts College, 97-72; def. Yeshiva, 78-65
#4	496	Hanover	3-1	def. (n) Kent State Tuscarawas, 103-49; def. (n) Otterbein, 71-68; won at Spalding, 83-47; LOST at #30 Wooster, 79-87
#5	457	Ramapo	2-1	LOST to (n) Randolph-Macon, 61-79; won at Marymount, 80-67; def. William Paterson, 87-65
#6	441	Tufts	1-2	def. (n) Webster, 83-68; LOST at #9 Washington U., 94-98; LOST to #36 MIT, 83-93
#7	436	Babson	3-2	def. Lasell, 95-64; def. Worcester State, 101-52; LOST to Endicott, 80-90; won at Becker, 83-66; LOST at Bowdoin, 71-80
#8	433	Middlebury	4-0	def. Fitchburg State, 111-72; def. Wentworth, 74-58; won at Johnson State, 84-77; won at Endicott, 78-67
#9	403	Washington U.	4-1	def. Wabash, 82-70; def. #6 Tufts, 98-94; won at Principia, 71-57; def. (n) Ohio Northern, 77-73; LOST at T#45 Mount St. Joseph, 74-96
#10	402	UW-River Falls	4-1	def. Central, 85-73; LOST to (n) Baldwin Wallace, 65-68; def. (n) DePauw, 72-69 OT; def. UW-Superior, 98-68; def. Hamline, 68-60
#11	327	UW-Whitewater	4-0	def. #15 Claremont-Mudd-Scripps, 82-66; def. Waldorf, 75-57; def. Monmouth, 66-50; def. Anderson, 79-70
#12	319	North Central (Ill.)	2-2	LOST at Heidelberg, 93-98 2OT; def. T#42 Benedictine, 82-79; LOST to (n) T#32 Whitworth, 72-75; def. (n) Lewis and Clark, 83-53
#13	300	Marietta	4-0	def. #29 Hope, 102-71; def. T#37 St. Thomas, 85-83 OT; won at Frostburg State, 91-77; won at Bethany, 83-70
#14	262	Christopher Newport	3-1	won at Randolph-Macon, 69-64; def. (n) Catholic, 80-78; def. (n) Wilmington, 82-64; LOST to Dickinson, 54-64
#15	217	Claremont-Mudd-Scripps	0-4	LOST at #11 UW-Whitewater, 66-82; LOST at UW-Platteville, 57-74; LOST to George Fox, 73-91; LOST to Puget Sound, 74-87
#16	198	Rochester	4-1	def. Bard, 73-54; def. Utica, 72-67; LOST at Hobart, 61-72; def. SUNY-Canton, 84-51; def. Stockton, 64-56
#17	177	Emory	3-1	def. Piedmont, 83-64; won at Berry, 109-103; LOST at LaGrange, 78-84; def. (n) Maryville (Tenn.), 102-92
#18	158	Guilford	2-2	won at Greensboro, 98-88; LOST to Concordia (Texas), 67-68; def. Huntingdon, 90-63; LOST to Averett, 69-82
#19	152	St. John Fisher	2-2	LOST at Hobart, 75-87; def. (n) Birmingham-Southern, 94-75; LOST to (n) #29 Hope, 86-97; def. #30 Wooster, 90-57
#20	141	St. John's	2-1	def. (n) St. Scholastica, 94-71; won at St. Cloud St., 73-67; LOST at UW-La Crosse, 63-65
#21	104	Wartburg	4-1	LOST at Northern Iowa, 43-72; def. Crown, 91-88; def. Aurora, 80-66; def. (n) Graceland (Iowa), 78-71; won at Waldorf, 78-67
#22	98	Lycoming	5-0	won at Medgar Evers, 101-81; def. Penn St.-Wilkes Barre, 94-84; def. SUNY Oneonta, 108-86; def. #26 Susquehanna, 89-70; def. Penn College, 92-70
#23	95	Cabrini	2-1	won at Eastern, 82-68; LOST to (n) Denison, 70-90; def. (n) Randolph, 88-72
#24	94	Scranton	2-3	def. Penn State-Berks, 78-63; LOST to York (Pa.), 70-84; LOST at Widener, 75-82; def. King's, 85-79; LOST to Wilkes, 45-52
#25	73	Swarthmore	4-0	def. Hood, 111-89; def. Albertus Magnus, 95-85; won at Washington College, 79-70; def. Misericordia, 93-75

Others receiving votes

Rank	Pts	Team	W-L	Results
#26	71	Susquehanna	1-3	def. Bethany, 75-73; LOST to King's, 89-93; LOST to Rowan, 72-88; LOST at #22 Lycoming, 70-89
#27	68	Nichols	3-1	def. Newbury, 117-72; won at Lasell, 91-80; LOST at Wesleyan, 61-80; won at Trinity (Conn.), 89-75
#28	54	Skidmore	3-0	won at Castleton, 89-79; won at Hartwick, 96-85; def. T#40 Plattsburgh State, 88-62
#29	51	Hope	2-2	LOST at #13 Marietta, 71-102; def. (n) #19 St. John Fisher, 97-86; LOST to (n) Cornerstone, 61-88; won at Aquinas, 89-83
#30	47	Wooster	3-1	def. Oberlin, 70-64; def. Medaille, 86-76; LOST at #19 St. John Fisher, 57-90; def. #4 Hanover, 87-79
#31	44	Keene State	2-2	LOST at Southern Vermont, 67-73; won at T#40 Plattsburgh State, 73-66; LOST at Springfield, 67-73; won at #36 MIT, 67-63
T#32	42	Ohio Wesleyan	4-0	def. (n) Trine, 99-96; def. (n) Albion, 98-60; def. (n) Otterbein, 81-59; won at Capital, 87-70
T#32	42	Whitworth	5-0	def. La Verne, 95-73; def. Gallaudet, 92-56; def. Waynesburg, 83-58; def. (n) #12 North Central (Ill.), 75-72; def. (n) Arcadia, 75-66
#34	37	UW-Oskhosh	3-0	def. T#42 Benedictine, 74-68; won at T#37 St. Norbert, 60-57; def. Edgewood, 78-66
#35	22	Amherst	3-0	def. Sarah Lawrence, 83-51; def. Western New England, 73-61; won at Westfield State, 84-48
#36	17	MIT	3-1	def. Bridgewater State, 91-52; def. Eastern Nazarene, 80-50; won at #6 Tufts, 93-83; LOST to #31 Keene State, 63-67
T#37	13	St. Norbert	3-1	def. UW-Eau Claire, 77-69; def. T#42 Benedictine, 70-53; LOST to UW-Oshkosh, 57-60; def. UW-Stevens Point, 58-54
T#37	13	St. Thomas	2-1	def. (n) Dickinson, 73-68; LOST at #13 Marietta, 83-85 OT; won at St. Scholastica, 80-56
#39	8	St Lawrence	1-2	LOST to (n) Bowdoin, 74-80; LOST to (n) Lehman, 86-90; won at SUNY-Canton, 89-78
T#40	7	Carthage	3-1	def. Rockford, 86-66; LOST to Lake Forest, 65-71; def. (n) Centre, 61-41; def. (n) Coe, 83-72
T#40	7	Plattsburgh State	0-2	LOST to #31 Keene State, 66-73; LOST at #28 Skidmore, 62-88
T#42	5	Benedictine	1-3	LOST at UW-Oshkosh, 68-74; LOST at T#37 St. Norbert, 53-70; LOST at #12 North Central (Ill.), 79-82; def. Marian, 82-77
T#42	5	Eastern Connecticut	5-0	def. (n) Dean, 87-64; won at WPI, 78-68; won at Connecticut College, 89-77; def. (n) Montclair State, 72-55; won at Colby, 83-77
T#42	5	Hardin-Simmons	0-3	LOST at Southwestern, 77-83; LOST at Texas Lutheran, 74-82; LOST at Schreiner, 84-93
T#45	1	Hamilton	3-0	def. (n) T#45 Oswego State, 75-69; def. (n) Keystone, 97-60; won at Western Connecticut, 97-88
T#45	1	Loras	3-1	won at Lake Forest, 84-81; won at Concordia-Chicago, 104-87; LOST at Concordia (Wis.), 86-101; def. Ripon, 90-88
T#45	1	Mount St. Joseph	2-3	LOST to (n) Wittenberg, 74-78; LOST to (n) Dickinson, 64-80; def. Wilmington, 75-72; LOST to Case Western Reserve, 69-74; def. #9 Washington U., 96-74
T#45	1	Nebraska Wesleyan	4-0	won at North Central (Minn.), 122-84; won at Northwestern (Minn.), 78-67; def. Iowa Wesleyan, 117-54; def. Bethany Lutheran, 95-78
T#45	1	New Jersey City	5-0	def. Stevens, 77-73; def. (n) Gwynedd Mercy, 82-76; won at Drew, 76-72; won at Rutgers-Newark, 68-54; won at Farmingdale State, 77-71
T#45	1	Oswego State	1-2	LOST to (n) T#45 Hamilton, 69-75; LOST at Elmira, 90-103; won at Clarkson, 82-66

[sac]

Yow, has a pre-season Top25 ever gone 0-4 like Claremont MS before the next poll.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Yow, has a pre-season Top25 ever gone 0-4 like Claremont MS before the next poll.

If we'd known Scarlett was out, the chances of them being Top 25 probably would've been slim.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Yow, has a pre-season Top25 ever gone 0-4 like Claremont MS before the next poll.

If we'd known Scarlett was out, the chances of them being Top 25 probably would've been slim.

Absolutely agree!

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Yow, has a pre-season Top25 ever gone 0-4 like Claremont MS before the next poll.

If we'd known Scarlett was out, the chances of them being Top 25 probably would've been slim.

Absolutely agree!

Frankly Scarlett, I don't give a damn... 

[nescac1]

Maybe this is typical with early-season uncertainly, but it seems like a lot of highly regarded teams, both inside and just outside the top 25, suffered a lot of unexpected losses in the first few weeks. 

Tufts, Babson, North Central, Claremont, Guilford, St. John Fisher and Scranton all with multiple losses are likely not going to be ranked next week, same deal with Cabrini after getting blown out by Denison.  That would open up eight spots, and I would guess that the six undefeated teams who received more than 1 vote in the preseason will likely sneak in: Skidmore, Ohio Wesleyan, Whitworth, UW-Oshkosh, Amherst, and Eastern Conn.  All six of those are strong programs with at least one (if not more) prominent individual players, and seem deserving.  Wooster I think makes it in thanks to a win over Hanover and a strong pedigree as well.  The last spot seems like anyone's guess ... Wesleyan, St. Thomas, Hamilton and St. Norbert all have pretty solid resumes though. 

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Maybe this is typical with early-season uncertainly, but it seems like a lot of highly regarded teams, both inside and just outside the top 25, suffered a lot of unexpected losses in the first few weeks. 

Tufts, Babson, North Central, Claremont, Guilford, St. John Fisher and Scranton all with multiple losses are likely not going to be ranked next week, same deal with Cabrini after getting blown out by Denison.  That would open up eight spots, and I would guess that the six undefeated teams who received more than 1 vote in the preseason will likely sneak in: Skidmore, Ohio Wesleyan, Whitworth, UW-Oshkosh, Amherst, and Eastern Conn.  All six of those are strong programs with at least one (if not more) prominent individual players, and seem deserving.  Wooster I think makes it in thanks to a win over Hanover and a strong pedigree as well.  The last spot seems like anyone's guess ... Wesleyan, St. Thomas, Hamilton and St. Norbert all have pretty solid resumes though.

You are assuming all eight of those fall out of the poll. I am not sure all of them fall out. You could make an argument for all of them, but with 25 voters and with those teams in different places on their ballots, not sure they all fall.

As for who takes their place... is it too early to throw darts this season?

I kid for those who don't know the long-running joke. I do anything but throw darts.

[nescac1]

I don't know (of course) that all eight fall out.  But I believe they should. None have beaten a single top 25 team. All have lost to at least one unranked team.  Babson and Tufts do have a long way to fall, but Babson has two losses to pretty good (but not great) teams and was already a big question mark given all the losses from last year's squad.  Tufts also lost a lot, is decimated by injuries (at least one long term), and has only one win on its resume. Also several New England teams with good talent and no losses (Amherst, Wesleyan, Bowdoin, Eastern Conn) plus one-loss MIT all deserve to leapfrog them.  They got the benefit of the doubt from last year, fairly, but both are playing with very different rosters. 

North Central to me has the best case for staying ranked. The other seven?  I just don't see it. 

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

It's out.  http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2017-18/week-1

Lots of new faces, but maybe not enough?

[Greek Tragedy]

Yow, has a pre-season Top25 ever gone 0-4 like Claremont MS before the next poll.

If we'd known Scarlett was out, the chances of them being Top 25 probably would've been slim.

Absolutely agree!

Do we have a time table for Scarlett's return?

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Yow, has a pre-season Top25 ever gone 0-4 like Claremont MS before the next poll.

If we'd known Scarlett was out, the chances of them being Top 25 probably would've been slim.

Absolutely agree!

Do we have a time table for Scarlett's return?

I haven't been able to get any information as of yet.. and not sure what information I get that I will be able to share. Will update if I can.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

I'll tweet this in the morning (automated), but I don't have time to time that tweet in here... so here you go for you late-night readers.

I apologize in advance, this is a bit lengthy. I went to edit it down and then decided I have far more pressing things to do, so read what you want and skip what you need... I won't take it personally... this week. LOL: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/wp-admin/post.php?post=2944&action=edit