Top 25 talk

[Rofrog]

Thanks for the explanation.But I think there are teams out there that deserve to be there before a 15-6 team just my thought.No argument here but they did lose to some okay teams except Whitman 21-0.Losses to.St Olaf 17-5,St Norbert 15-6,Augustana 16-5 and 13-8 Wartburg.It is just thought there is some teams that have 3 losses that can be ahead of them.They jumped from 25 to 18 that is a big jump for a team with 6 losses.Just my opinion not an argument thank you

[Rofrog]

Greek I have no fight in this but if the voters use that strategy then use it for all teams.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Greek I have no fight in this but if the voters use that strategy then use it for all teams.

They do.  Obviously, you have to win some games, but a gaudy record doesn't mean too much if the opponents aren't great.  Stevens Point would be heavy favorites against a lot of teams with better records right now.

[fantastic50]

UWSP is the only tournament contender with an SOS over .600, and no one else is close to that mark.  By tournament time, they will likely have ten games against regionally ranked opponents and outside of the NESCAC, the only other team likely to reach that mark is NJCU.  Despite the losses, Ken Massey has them in the top ten, and the same is true in my predictive rankings.  There is certainly a difference between "most deserving" and "best".  I'm talking about the latter, and the Pointers are a team that I would not want to see across from my team in a first-weekend pod.

[Greek Tragedy]

Thanks for the explanation.But I think there are teams out there that deserve to be there before a 15-6 team just my thought.No argument here but they did lose to some okay teams except Whitman 21-0.Losses to.St Olaf 17-5,St Norbert 15-6,Augustana 16-5 and 13-8 Wartburg.It is just thought there is some teams that have 3 losses that can be ahead of them.They jumped from 25 to 18 that is a big jump for a team with 6 losses.Just my opinion not an argument thank you

Fair enough. In YOUR opinion, who are some of those teams?

[Onward on, John Carroll]

Latest Top 25 with a familiar face returning in the No. 24 spot.

http://d3hoops.com/top25/men/2017-18/week10

I think this team breaks out in hives when they earn a ranking in the Top 25.  This almost guarantees that they will drop a game to either BW or ONU. 

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Took a while despite trying to cut back, but here is my ballot: http://bit.ly/2FTiZWa

[Fifth and Putnam]

Latest Top 25 with a familiar face returning in the No. 24 spot.

http://d3hoops.com/top25/men/2017-18/week10

I think this team breaks out in hives when they earn a ranking in the Top 25.  This almost guarantees that they will drop a game to either BW or ONU. 

Dropping both wouldn't be the worst thing in the world either. 

[irapthor]

Thanks for the explanation.But I think there are teams out there that deserve to be there before a 15-6 team just my thought.No argument here but they did lose to some okay teams except Whitman 21-0.Losses to.St Olaf 17-5,St Norbert 15-6,Augustana 16-5 and 13-8 Wartburg.It is just thought there is some teams that have 3 losses that can be ahead of them.They jumped from 25 to 18 that is a big jump for a team with 6 losses.Just my opinion not an argument thank you

When I vote, I weigh a lot of factors and take a lot of time to try to get this right. After a rocky start, I had a wait and see attitude with UWSP. I've waited and I've seen. What they have done in the WIAC through 10 games is eye-opening. They deserve to be ranked. Too bad some fans only look at a team with a gaudy record...team's that don't play anyone...and assume they must be good. If you're in a weak conference and don't challenge yourself outside your league, it will take a lot for me to vote for you unless you're undefeated or a 1-loss team (which in any league is impressive).

You want to be considered one of the best? Play someone. And win most of those games when you do.

I'm voting for UWSP 15th in the country because they've proven to me they're an elite team. I have four WIAC teams in my Top 25 right now. Platteville, Stevens Point, Whitewater and Oshkosh. I had River Falls before they faded.

You will not see a lot of 18-3 teams on my ballot with a .475 SOS. There will be a few, but to me if you want to be a Top 25 team, you need to be great, not just in your conference. Because come March, you won't be playing conference games anymore and we've seen tons of gaudy records make quick first-round exits over the years to teams that they shouldn't lose to if you're just looking at the records.

[smedindy]

Well, there's a couple of things:

1. SOS isn't a very good measure of strength of schedule, despite the name.
2. It's easy to say "Play Somebody" - some schools cannot due to travel restrictions, number of conference games, or no one will play them. It takes two.

[Greek Tragedy]

What's a good measure for strength of schedule? I understand it takes two to schedule. Definitely a valid point there.

[irapthor]

Well, there's a couple of things:

1. SOS isn't a very good measure of strength of schedule, despite the name.
2. It's easy to say "Play Somebody" - some schools cannot due to travel restrictions, number of conference games, or no one will play them. It takes two.

In the case of our program, I know our head coach makes hundreds of phone calls every year just to schedule seven non-conference games. There are a number of current Top 25 teams, past and present, who won't play us. Particularly in the Eastern portion of the country, if you really want to play someone there are ample opportunities to do so.

In the end, we made it work and our strength of schedule is among the highest in the country because our coach believes in playing the hardest non-conference schedule we can afford to. That will help come NCAA Tournament time.

But as a voter for 15+ years, I absolutely scrutinize who you play. That's my responsibility. I'm not just throwing schools on the wall and throwing darts. You've got to earn it.

[irapthor]

What's a good measure for strength of schedule? I understand it takes two to schedule. Definitely a valid point there.

A great example BTW in our case is Albertus Magnus. They've been perennially the best team in the GNAC but if they don't win their conference title, probably don't make the NCAA Tournament because the league's strength of schedule is very low. So Albertus Magnus chooses to challenge itself and we have played them in four of the last five seasons. It's a 3+ hour trip but it's become a really good rivalry of two teams that more often than not will compete for an NCAA Tournament berth.

How does it help either of our programs to play a 1-8 non-conference opponent?

[fantastic50]

What's a good measure for strength of schedule? I understand it takes two to schedule. Definitely a valid point there.

I prefer something along the lines of "strength of record." The usual version of it gives the probability that a hypothetical team of some specified rating would have an equally good or better record against the same schedule. An alternative version is based on what rating would be needed to have a 50% probability of an equal or better record against that schedule.

[Smitty Oom]

https://portal.stretchinternet.com/whitworth/portal.htm?eventId=385188&streamType=video

#1 Whitman at #4 Whitworth

This game has been as fun as advertised so far. If anyone is still up, I advise tuning in.

BONUS: Download the NWC app on your Roku/Apple TV to watch on the big TV while your comfortably on your couch or laying down in bed!