Top 25 talk

[Greek Tragedy]

Season poll results

TEAM	TOTAL	FINAL	WK13	WK12	WK11	WK10	WK9	WK8	WK7	WK6	WK5	WK4	WK3	WK2	WK1	PRESEASON
Swarthmore	9296	608	606	623	620	618	620	625	625	625	625	621	621	622	623	614
Wittenberg	7670	452	418	539	519	517	498	466	472	587	578	552	546	540	531	455
RMC	7253	567	574	527	587	570	570	554	543	472	537	470	464	403	303	112
St. Thomas	7247	546	526	589	581	539	522	450	446	426	529	502	493	466	387	245
St. John's	7156	589	598	547	521	602	599	590	589	543	429	346	324	311	273	295
Emory	6979	209	382	343	433	397	491	446	449	552	518	596	592	586	567	418
Neb Wes	6327	261	453	404	515	508	471	428	398	390	390	469	467	445	379	349
Middlebury	5417	77	103	149	259	350	308	395	382	493	562	528	528	522	479	282
Platteville	5403	325	441	489	455	424	324	274	392	461	410	436	415	330	173	54
Wash U	5065	409	245	337	317	265	328	380	313	331	295	429	416	356	258	386
Marietta	4520		45	107	230	296	230	360	476	436	414	476	466	423	334	227
Johns Hopkins (WUPHF)	4499	277	493	415	407	440	378	293	264	238	249	312	349	250	134	0
Elmhurst	4170	365	270	102	60	219	464	540	489	404	375	241	326	228	87	0
North Central IL	4119	455	338	406	368	301	217	297	255	212	162	51	33	160	354	510
Colby	4081	142	329	393	367	320	452	523	485	360	341	224	110	27	8	0
Mount Union	2682	545	507	456	411	336	248	110	25	10	3	7	5	1	0	18
La Crosse	2053	19	63	116	56	20	178	261	228	297	247	244	218	105	1	0
Amherst	1857			2		14	0	0	1	98	251	104	78	290	550	469
Babson (nescac1)	1710	1	7	52	76	181	126	80	76	196	271	320	248	49	27	0
Springfield (SpringSt7)	1651	121	217	304	256	179	95	47	48	147	58	31	97	17	34	0
Virginia Wesleyan	1626	28	169	222	198	311	235	133	156	72	45	43	14	0	0	0
Yeshiva	1625	415	294	254	213	153	96	63	38	45	23	12	7	6	5	1
Oshkosh	1490	87	61	20	17	2	15	13	0	0	8	44	63	296	301	563
Nichols	1360						0	0	0	0	0	20	160	429	418	333
Whitworth	1315	175		1	45	15	12	35	137	103	72	276	176	143	113	12
Wooster	1240		14			9	8	163	269	127	60	63	73	47	240	167
Christopher Newport	1215	223	18	25	12	11	26	17	5	6	3	0	57	163	311	338
Tufts	1013	247	151	35	27	182	125	103	60	39	17	0	0	14	9	4
Guilford	934						0	0	0	18	104	100	98	244	154	216
St. Joseph CT	888	79	281	214	168	91	55	0	0	0	0	0	0			0
SNC (magicman)	832	52	82	178	133	79	39	33	146	54	36	0	0	0	0	0
WPI	809	1	5	4	99	14	9	42	45	0	66	22	49	109	105	239
Augustana	712		12	21	18	28	6	9	2	9	15	0	94	82	187	229
Brockport	691	331	184	100	53	15	6	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	2
Centre (CollegeGolf18)	566	15	51	32	19	10	172	104	51	21	13	2	4	32	40	0
Albertus Magnus	524			1	4		0	130	121	157	99	10	2	0	0	0
Whitman	472		10		2	1	29	33	5	0	0	12	17	25	145	193
Carthage (augie77)	441						0	0	0	2	2	130	96	127	84	0
Benedictine	431				12	42	19	13	11	15	75	129	86	29	0	0
Augsburg	419						0	3	6	26	5	25	61	34	146	113

[Greek Tragedy]

TEAM	TOTAL	FINAL	WK13	WK12	WK11	WK10	WK9	WK8	WK7	WK6	WK5	WK4	WK3	WK2	WK1	PRESEASON
Wabash	403						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	1	133	269
Texas-Dallas	403	5	11	23	19	6	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	26	313
Ponoma-Pitzer	382	230	2				0	1	8	60	41	11	7	4	3	15
Hamilton	303						0	0	0	7	23	85	20	55	54	59
Stevens Point	250						0	0	2	0	16	41	138	53	0	0
Hobart	210	172		1		4	1	0	0	22	10	0	0	0	0	0
Oswego	208						0	0	1	0	0	0	0	64	60	83
York Pa	198	51	60	16	15	7	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	49
Brandeis	172					8	56	50	57	0	0	0	0	0	0	1
Rochester	161						4	7	6	14	49	23	15	5	33	5
RPI	149	11	28	58	26	7	17	0	2	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Albion	135			6		27	63	21	14	4	0	0	0	0	0	0
Baldwin Wallace	128						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	128
IWU (NCF)	110	6	8				5	0	0	0	7	68	7	9	0	0
SJF	100						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	7	93
Stevens	93		43	10	7	1	0	0	3	1	28	0	0	0	0	0
Eau Claire	86	10	6				0	0	0	0	13	0	48	0	9	0
Wheaton IL	77						0	0	0	0	0	12	9	0	11	45
Salem St	58						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	58
ETBU	53						0	25	18	8	2	0	0	0	0	0
Mary Hardin-Baylor	49						0	0	0	0	44	0	3	2	0	0
NJCU	43						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	14	29
Widener	42					3	2	0	6	5	2	22	2	0	0	0
MIT	35						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	35
CMS	31						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	31
Scranton	24						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	24
Muhlenberg	20						0	0	0	0	0	0	10	10	0	0
Loras	18						0	0	0	0	4	0	13	0	0	1
Endicott	18						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	18
LeTourneau	17		16				1	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
TCNJ	14	3	1				0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	10	0
E. Connecticut	14						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	14
Ithaca	10	8	2				0	0	0	0			0
Williams	8						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	5	3
Washington & Lee	7			3		3	1	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
PS Harrisburg	7	7					0	0		0
SUNY Oneonta	5						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	5
Convenant	2						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	2
Linfield (Smitty)	1			1			0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Keene St	1						0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	1
Susquehanna	1	1

[Titan Q]

In looking at the universe of the final D3hoops.com Top 25 teams, here are the # of wins vs other Top 25 teams...

#1-Swarthmore = 2
#2-St. John's = 2
#3-Randolph-Macon = 1
#4-St. Thomas = 3
#5-Mount Union = 0
#6-North Central = 3
#7-Wittenberg = 0
#8-Yeshiva = 0
#9-Wash U = 1
#10-Elmhurst = 2
#11-Brockport = 2
#12-UW-Platteville = 3
#13-Johns Hopkins = 2
#14-Nebraska Wesleyan = 1
#15-Tufts = 2
#16-Pomona-Pitzer = 1
#17-Christopher Newport = 1
#18-Emory = 3
#19-Whitworth = 1
#20-Hobart = 2
#21-Colby = 1
#22-Springfield = 0
#23-UW-Oshkosh = 1
#24-St. Joseph (Conn.) = 0
#25-Middlebury = 2

Four teams tied for the most (3).

Five teams tied for the least (0).

[SpringSt7]

Is that wins against the Top 25 as presently constructed, or the rankings as of when they played?

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

I wonder if it would be interesting to put that list together, but eliminate Top 25 teams in conference.  Non-conference Top 25 games tells us a lot.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Or losses against Top 25 teams as well.

[WUPHF]

I was curious so, in looking at the universe of the final D3hoops.com Top 25 teams, here are the Top 25 teams with their Massey SOS.

Oshkosh had the toughest SOS at No. 1 followed by Elmhurst at No. 6
St. Joseph edged Yeshiva for the worst SOS at No. 254.

Interestingly, the top 11 teams in terms of Massey SOS were Central Division schools. 
The top 20 teams featured 15 Central Division schools.

#1-Swarthmore = 50
#2-St. John's = 50
#3-Randolph-Macon = 38
#4-St. Thomas = 18
#5-Mount Union = 21
#6-North Central = 9
#7-Wittenberg = 142
#8-Yeshiva = 253
#9-Wash U = 11
#10-Elmhurst = 6
#11-Brockport = 161
]#12-UW-Platteville = 13
#13-Johns Hopkins = 115
#14-Nebraska Wesleyan = 49
#15-Tufts = 25
#16-Pomona-Pitzer = 78
#17-Christopher Newport = 43
#18-Emory = 16
#19-Whitworth = 55
#20-Hobart = 136
#21-Colby = 68
#22-Springfield = 63
#23-UW-Oshkosh = 1
#24-St. Joseph (Conn.) = 254
#25-Middlebury = 48

[Pat Coleman]

Is that wins against the Top 25 as presently constructed, or the rankings as of when they played?

As presently constructed. A ranking from October, for example, means basically nil in March.

[Titan Q]

@RowanAthletics
Oh do we have a good #RowanReplay tonight! Considered by most the best game of the 1996 NCAA Tournament, @RowanMBB used a dramatic last second tip-in by @metepoles4 to beat Illinois Wesleyan in the semifinals! Watch it live tonight 7pm
https://youtu.be/bAhnjpm1XxA

[Titan Q]

2020-21 Preseason Top 25 work...

I'd love to hear thoughts on the preseason predicted order at the top of conferences...and where the Top 25 line potentially falls.

For example...

CCIW
T1. Elmhurst (25-5/11-5) lock Top 25
T1. Illinois Wesleyan (19-9/11-5)  lock Top 25
----
3. Wheaton (15-11/9-7)  keep an eye on
4. North Central (23-5/14-2) lost too much
5. Augustana (18-8/12-4)  lost too much

Thanks.

[ronk]

Landmark

1. Susquehanna  possible Top 25
2. Scranton possible Top 25
3. Drew

[tomt4525]

WIAC

1. Platteville - Lose All American Voelker but a lock to be top 25, Return a lot, top 10 I would think
2. Oshkosh - Lose a lot, Return good nucleus of Mahoney, Peterson, Borchert, near end of top 25 to start
3. La Crosse - Lose a couple starters but return some good parts and recruits, around same spot as Oshkosh
4. Eau Claire - lose best player Rabedeaux but return a lot, definitely a team to watch for top 25
5.  Stevens Point - will be garbage unless the transfer market is extremely beneficial to them, lose 5 of top 6

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Landmark

1. Susquehanna  possible Top 25
2. Scranton possible Top 25
3. Drew

Susquehanna - maybe, they only lose one of their top six scorers and have a lot of youth. But they didn't figure things out until late (inconsistent prior). I love what Frank Marcinek does there and I would hope they could be tough, but I also found them to be a bit undersized. I think I would wait to see on these guys despite how they finished the season.

Scranton - why? I think this is a wait and see. First, losing Mancuso and Verma will have an impact. I know they have other talent, but those are two huge losses. Secondly, they don't put together schedules that challenge them. They just inflate WL% numbers.

Drew - this could be interesting. While they lose two of their top scorers (and a good player in Riley), they have a lot of youth that really stepped up. I'm not sure I buy in for preseason, but they will be on my watch list.

Granted - this is off the top of my head. The Landmark is not that strong a conference ... it just doesn't build national teams and it really never has despite some teams either getting to the tournament or one miraculous run in 2012. And not many are willing to go out and put together really challenging schedules leaving a lot to be desired. Maybe they figure it out and maybe they produce some good teams ... but even as one who knows the conference well ... I'm going to wait and see.

[SpringSt7]

NESCAC

1. Tufts---return AA/POY Luke Rogers, only graduate one senior from a Sweet 16 team, should be borderline Top 10

2. Amherst--underwhelmed this year but still have main nucleus intact, Grant Robinson's health remains their biggest question mark, if he plays like he did when he was a sophomore they could make a claim for best backcourt in the country, plus Dave Hixon returns to the sidelines. 17-25 range

3. Middlebury--Stacked Class of 2021 finally seniors, but still yet to make the splash they've been expected to (2 postseason wins total in 3 years). Jack Farrell could be an All-American and junior transfer Tommy Eastman looked like one of the 5 best players in the NESCAC once he got comfortable and should also have a monster senior year. A lot depends on whether or not C Alex Sobel returns to the program after he left midway through this season. They are already very thin on depth, especially in the frontcourt. 17-25 range

----

One of Colby/Williams/Wesleyan should flirt with the Top 25 at some point in the year. New England as a region looks to be down next year and there should be better non-conference records. All three teams feature talented underclassmen but Colby and Williams both graduate key seniors and will be asking a lot of their younger guys. Wesleyan returns 6 of their top 7 scorers, but missed the NESCAC tournament. They need their talented freshman and sophomore classes to take big steps as sophomores and juniors.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

IF Hixon returns to the sideline ... you never know what a sabbatical year might reveal. Don't get me wrong, I want to see him back ... but I am understanding that things like this could happen.