Top 25 talk

[CNU85]

I was thinking the other day that the poll voters should probably be treating Yeshiva more like how they treated Lancaster Bible in 2015-16. LBC was undefeated going into the tourney, but the voters had refused to rank the Chargers any higher than #14. The Chargers ended up bowing out in the opening round by 13 to Wooster on Catholic's home floor in the nation's capital.

This does not change your point (one that I agree with), but that was a great Wooster team that caught fire in the tournament before getting beat by a great Christopher Newport in the Elite Eight, a team that knocked off the last great NYU team...

Incidentally, I can still picture the Christopher Newport fan who had the big sign of a stylized Donald Trump and would hold it up when the opposing team was shooting free throws.  Probably the most unique free-throw distraction technique I have ever seen.

and the following weekend I drove to Salem to watch CNU lose to a great St. Thomas team!

[WUPHF]

Non-great teams do not make it to the Elite Eight in my book.

Regardless of how you define great, the point still stands that dismissing Lancaster Bible after their early exit ignores the fact that they went up against a team that had a great postseason. 

That was a great St. Thomas team for sure.

[WUPHF]

I am prone to hyperbole as many of you know, but let's go with:

This does not change your point (one that I agree with), but that was a good Wooster team that caught fire in the tournament and had a great postseason before getting beat by a great (sticking with this) Christopher Newport in the Elite Eight, a team that knocked off the last good (probably more accurate) NYU team...

[thebear]

Glad to see Oswego State getting some respect. 

This is a very good team, Their lone loss was by 2 to another 1 loss team - Nazareth in the fourth game of the season. 

Since then they have reeled off 17 straight.

At the semester break they added former D2 player and JUCO All-American Christian Simmons, who averages 10 pts and 5 rebounds in 15 minutes off the bench in 14 games since joining.

They are not long, tallest regular is 6-6, but very athletic and very deep, they play at least 11 in most games.

Like most great teams, it starts with defense, they give up 59 ppg, and hold teams to .275 from the arc, and .441 inside. 
They are +90 in steals on the season. Their defense is a constant, it does not change when the subs enter.

Jeremiah Sparks is the glue that holds it all together, a 6'3 "point forward" he is a tweener, but does every thing his team needs for the W, scores, rebounds, leads them in assists, and plays tenacious D.

Devin Green, another JUCO transfer has 58 treys and is shooting .468 from three and adds 27/28 from the stripe, just a deadly shooter.

Ahkee Anderson, 2020 NY State HS class B player of the year, holds down the traditional point guard spot.
[It should be noted that nearby Syracuse University's point guard is the 2019 NY State HS class B player of the year JG-III].

This team is loaded with excellent basketball players. 

They also play in an excellent facility - Max Ziel Gym, which could easily host a pod. 

Look out for the Lakers.

[SpartyBlue]

Interesting to me how these two teams are being treated in their respective rankings:

Team A: 18-2 (17-2 vs D3), best win vs Massey 103, Avg Massey ranking of D3 wins 305
Team B: 17-0 (14-0 vs D3), best win vs Massey 84, Avg Massey ranking of D3 wins 253

Team A is of course Yeshiva MBB - currently ranked #6 but will no doubt fall in the next ranking due to their recent loss to Massey 196. 

Team B is the Webster WBB team - has not had a single vote this entire season.

Yes, I get that MBB and WBB are two different worlds so to speak, just seems pretty interesting to me...

They are quite different worlds.

Indeed they are - which I was I was merely interested at the difference.

I see a lot of voters online dropping Yeshiva completely out of the top 25, which I think is an overreaction.  It's hard to run the table no matter SoS.  Many of these voters have IWU, a four loss team who lost to a Massey 168 still in the top 10.  And yeah, I understand IWU has a lot of quality wins, but I still think Yeshiva should get a bit of a break here at 18-2 and clearly top 25 talented.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Interesting to me how these two teams are being treated in their respective rankings:

Team A: 18-2 (17-2 vs D3), best win vs Massey 103, Avg Massey ranking of D3 wins 305
Team B: 17-0 (14-0 vs D3), best win vs Massey 84, Avg Massey ranking of D3 wins 253

Team A is of course Yeshiva MBB - currently ranked #6 but will no doubt fall in the next ranking due to their recent loss to Massey 196. 

Team B is the Webster WBB team - has not had a single vote this entire season.

Yes, I get that MBB and WBB are two different worlds so to speak, just seems pretty interesting to me...

They are quite different worlds.

Indeed they are - which I was I was merely interested at the difference.

I see a lot of voters online dropping Yeshiva completely out of the top 25, which I think is an overreaction.  It's hard to run the table no matter SoS.  Many of these voters have IWU, a four loss team who lost to a Massey 168 still in the top 10.  And yeah, I understand IWU has a lot of quality wins, but I still think Yeshiva should get a bit of a break here at 18-2 and clearly top 25 talented.

But are they? Obviously lots of variation in opinions out there, since (as you say) multiple voters who publicly share their ballot are leaving them out. 

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

We had another midday edition of Hoopsville on Monday. Great show with plenty of DIII chat, but also insightful conversations with each of our guests.



The basketball season is now fully into February and with conference tournaments looming, teams continue to ready themselves for the stretch run.

On Monday's Hoopsville, we chatted with several teams who are leading their conference races and making national headlines in the meantime. Plus, we look ahead at what will be ever-changing Top 25 polls. There is always plenty of upsets, close games, amazing feats, and surprising results to talk about in Division III.

Reminder, Monday shows' guests primarily come from Regions 1 & 2, 4, 6, and 8.

Guests included:
- Brian Baptiste, UMass-Dartmouth men's coach
- John Krikorian, No. 4 Christopher Newport men's coach
- Dixie Jeffers, former Capital women's coach & interim AD
- Mandy King, Kean women's coach
- Olivia Lett, Millikin women's coach

Watch the show here: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2021-22/feb7

Listen to the podcast here: https://soundcloud.com/hoopsville/1920-stretch-run?si=77077a5aa28a4c8c9f0bfa60e5c3b3c2&utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing

[Pat Coleman]

Non-great teams do not make it to the Elite Eight in my book.

Regardless of how you define great, the point still stands that dismissing Lancaster Bible after their early exit ignores the fact that they went up against a team that had a great postseason. 

That was a great St. Thomas team for sure.

Wooster beat that untested Lancaster Bible team on a neutral floor, Endicott (19-11) on a neutral floor and went to 22-9 Oswego State and won in overtime.

[SpartyBlue]

Interesting to me how these two teams are being treated in their respective rankings:

Team A: 18-2 (17-2 vs D3), best win vs Massey 103, Avg Massey ranking of D3 wins 305
Team B: 17-0 (14-0 vs D3), best win vs Massey 84, Avg Massey ranking of D3 wins 253

Team A is of course Yeshiva MBB - currently ranked #6 but will no doubt fall in the next ranking due to their recent loss to Massey 196. 

Team B is the Webster WBB team - has not had a single vote this entire season.

Yes, I get that MBB and WBB are two different worlds so to speak, just seems pretty interesting to me...

They are quite different worlds.

Indeed they are - which I was I was merely interested at the difference.

I see a lot of voters online dropping Yeshiva completely out of the top 25, which I think is an overreaction.  It's hard to run the table no matter SoS.  Many of these voters have IWU, a four loss team who lost to a Massey 168 still in the top 10.  And yeah, I understand IWU has a lot of quality wins, but I still think Yeshiva should get a bit of a break here at 18-2 and clearly top 25 talented.

But are they? Obviously lots of variation in opinions out there, since (as you say) multiple voters who publicly share their ballot are leaving them out.

Talent is always somewhat subjective, but if we're going to bring in the numbers (Massey, etc) I think the IWU example is apt.  The ballots are an unscientific social media sampling, to be sure. 

[Pat Coleman]

Talent is always somewhat subjective, but if we're going to bring in the numbers (Massey, etc) I think the IWU example is apt.  The ballots are an unscientific social media sampling, to be sure.

They are. Yeshiva is on 19 of the 25 ballots this week.

[WUPHF]

Wooster beat that untested Lancaster Bible team on a neutral floor, Endicott (19-11) on a neutral floor and went to 22-9 Oswego State and won in overtime.

Thanks Pat, but I'll stick with my revision.

That is unless you want to move the fantasy league threads from the multi-regional thread and create a new one.

[Pat Coleman]

Wooster beat that untested Lancaster Bible team on a neutral floor, Endicott (19-11) on a neutral floor and went to 22-9 Oswego State and won in overtime.

Thanks Pat, but I'll stick with my revision.

That is unless you want to move the fantasy league threads from the multi-regional thread and create a new one.

Not sure what the false equivalency is here, unless you are taking one thing that was debated on and decided years ago (threads) and combining it with another (2015-16 Wooster).

[sac]

Good call. Albertus Magnus didn't get out of the first weekend of D3 tourney play that season.

I was thinking the other day that the poll voters should probably be treating Yeshiva more like how they treated Lancaster Bible in 2015-16. LBC was undefeated going into the tourney, but the voters had refused to rank the Chargers any higher than #14. The Chargers ended up bowing out in the opening round by 13 to Wooster on Catholic's home floor in the nation's capital.

Albertus had a strong 3 or 4 year run of teams, even had one make the QF if I remember right.  I think Yeshiva is very comparable to them and with a couple tournaments that didn't happen probably would have a similar success story line.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Non-great teams do not make it to the Elite Eight in my book.

Regardless of how you define great, the point still stands that dismissing Lancaster Bible after their early exit ignores the fact that they went up against a team that had a great postseason. 

That was a great St. Thomas team for sure.

Wooster beat that untested Lancaster Bible team on a neutral floor, Endicott (19-11) on a neutral floor and went to 22-9 Oswego State and won in overtime.

Wooster needed an NCAA record 21 of 25 night from Dan Fanelly to beat an LBC squad who's best player got hurt in warmups.  Neither one of those teams is as good as Yeshiva, although they could both probably beat them, the way YU has been playing of late.

I was at that game in DC. One of the gutsiest individual performances I've ever witnessed, but there was nothing about that game that could be used to measure anything. Lots of odd circumstances.

I think the better comparison for Yeshiva might be that Albertus team who lost a battle at Dickinson during the tournament.  Talented as all get out, but not tested.

[WPI89]

Wasn't sure where to put this - figured here was the most active string.  Does anyone know if the committee will take into account the Covid fan policy when choosing host sites for the tournament?