MBB: Southern Collegiate Athletic Conference

[Ralph Turner]

Not good news for the Majors this week in the region rankings.  They do not pass DePauw and they do not collect $200.  Perhaps they aren't "more in than DePauw" as I stated a couple of days ago.

1. Centre 21-1 16-1
2. Mary Hardin-Baylor 20-3 18-2
3. Guilford 19-4 18-4
4. Virginia Wesleyan 19-5 18-4
5. Maryville (Tenn.) 21-2 15-2
6. DePauw 18-5 15-4
7. Millsaps 21-3 16-2
8. Randolph-Macon 18-5 13-5

Very disappointing.  Baseball, football and now basketball--I've just about come to the conclusion that Millsaps needs to win the AQ in order to get into the NCAA tournament.

Frank, Millsaps did not help themselves in their non-conference games.

Louisiana College (South Region 9-11, gives an OWP .450)
Rust College (South Region 7-7, gives an OWP .500)
Huntingdon (South Region, 6-11, gives an OWP .283)

[Ralph Turner]

Not good news for the Majors this week in the region rankings.  They do not pass DePauw and they do not collect $200.  Perhaps they aren't "more in than DePauw" as I stated a couple of days ago.

1. Centre 21-1 16-1
2. Mary Hardin-Baylor 20-3 18-2
3. Guilford 19-4 18-4
4. Virginia Wesleyan 19-5 18-4
5. Maryville (Tenn.) 21-2 15-2
6. DePauw 18-5 15-4
7. Millsaps 21-3 16-2
8. Randolph-Macon 18-5 13-5

Hard to believe that a 4-loss DePauw team would be ahead of a 2-loss Millsaps team in the regional rankings. Especially when looking at the RPI numbers posted earlier this week. I know DePauw has the head to head, but I wouldn't think it would be used with a 2-game advantage.

Reg Conf Rank Prior RPI    OWP    OOWP   School                       Natl Status      Reg Overall
SO  54   01   01   0.6101 0.5001 0.4989 Centre                          006  A w C       16-1 21-1
SO  51   02   02   0.5945 0.4832 0.5116 Mary Hardin-Baylor          014  A w C       18-2 20-3
SO  53   03   05   0.6074 0.5431 0.5251 Virginia Wesleyan            017  A w C       18-4 19-5
SO  53   04   04   0.6073 0.5403 0.5305 Guilford                          019  C 3         18-4 19-4
SO  54   05   06   0.5840 0.4756 0.4958 Millsaps                          024  C 6         16-2 21-3
SO  52   06   03   0.5817 0.4729 0.4986 Maryville (Tenn.)              030  B 1         15-2 21-2
SO  54   07   07   0.5698 0.5000 0.5016 DePauw                          049  C second    14-4 18-5
SO  53   08   08   0.5926 0.5592 0.5299 Randolph-Macon               054  C second    13-5 18-5
SO  51   09   11   0.5554 0.4870 0.5107 Mississippi College             066  C third     145 17-5
SO  53   10   09   0.5968 0.6127 0.5118 Roanoke                          070  C third     13-7 15-7
SO  53   11   13   0.5595 0.5193 0.5327 Washington and Lee          084              126 14-8

Please remember that the OWP and OOWP calculations by pabegg are only one of the criteria.  Do not accept this as the "be-all/end-all" to the process.

If you compare pabegg's table with the Regional Rankings, where a committee has sat down with the information and tried to give a reasonable assessment of the information, you see the difference.

I am glad that pabegg has run the numbers, but we have to realize that the bubble begins about "C12".

There are 17 Pool C bids that go to the the runners-up in 38 conferences.

[golden_dome]

Please remember that the OWP and OOWP calculations by pabegg are only one of the criteria.  Do not accept this as the "be-all/end-all" to the process.

If you compare pabegg's table with the Regional Rankings, where a committee has sat down with the information and tried to give a reasonable assessment of the information, you see the difference.

I am glad that pabegg has run the numbers, but we have to realize that the bubble begins about "C12".

There are 17 Pool C bids that go to the the runners-up in 38 conferences.

Ralph, a question I would have regarding DePauw jumping Millsaps this week in the regional rankings is the RPI number in which Millsaps holds a definite advantage according to pabegg's numbers. Plus, Millsaps has a significanlty better winning percentage in region and in years past those two criteria were considered first even though there are other primary criteria. Millsaps has a couple weak out of conference games, but DePauw does as well and their OWP and OOWP numbers are not much better than Millsaps' numbers.

[frank_ezelle]

Ralph,

You have left out the win over U. of Dallas, not a powerhouse team, but another win in region.

Here's a list of the Millsaps non-conference games:

Pensacola Christian--Home--non D3 (I can't remember their exact designation)
Louisiana College--Home--D3
Rust College--Home--D3
Southeastern Louisiana--at Hammond, LA--D1
Pensacola Christian--at Pensacola, FL--non D3
Huntingdon--at Montgomery, AL--D3
Belhaven College--Jackson--NAIA
Loyola College of New Orleans--Jackson--NAIA
U. of Dallas--at Dallas--D3
Birmingham Southern--Home--D3 Provisional

Look closely at the schedule and you'll see one common theme--these are teams that Millsaps can play on an affordable budget.  The Dallas game was added to the tail end of the Colorado-Austin trip, an extra day on the road and the 3rd game in 4 days, but an effort to get in another D3 game.  The Pensacola Christian game was combined with the Huntingdon game to make a reasonable road trip.  The Southeastern Louisiana game is one that doesn't require an overnight stay, as are the Belhaven and Loyola trips when it comes time to play at their place.

The bottom line with the Millsaps schedule is the bottom line.  In a year when Millsaps already has required road trips of Colorado-Austin, Centre-DePauw, and Southwestern-Trinity, it's not like there is a lot of time or money left for long road trips out of the area.  Millsaps plays the available teams with the notable exception of MS College, a team they do scrimmage in the preseason.  An Millsaps-MC matchup is something that would have to happen early in the season because of ASC and SCAC scheduling, and I don't think that's a matchup that would be helpful to either team if it had to be played in the first weeks of the season.

We had this discussion during baseball season.  Millsaps plays a non-conference schedule that is affordable and it doesn't keep the players away from a lot of classes.  Millsaps can't cherry pick from a lot of South Region schools to build a better OWP and OOWP--they have to play the schools within a reasonable distance of Jackson and the options are limited.  Lately it seems like this limitation of potential opponents has come back to bite Millsaps when the NCAA starts running their numbers for at-large bids--that was certainly true in baseball last year and it is happening again this year in basketball.

[OLD STUDENT/ATHLETE]

Not only is their great expense and inconvenience in long away trips, but the stress on the student/athletes is horrible. Centre players are just beginning to recover from their trips to Trinity/SW and Austin/CC. I'm sure its the same situation for everybody that made those trips. Which brings me to the question of why did we bring in Colorado College. Are they the Harvard of the West? Are they the Duke or North Carolina of the West in DIII basketball? Certainly not. If the pres.' of our fine institutions want to expand, there are certainly some schools within a reasonable driving distance to all of us, that compare with Colorado College. Maybe the Pres.'
have plans to add hockey teams. Millsaps or any school should not be penalized for their schedule when they're thinking about the welfare of their students and their bank account, which ultimately effects the students. I believe the main reason DePauw is ranked higher in the Region (NCAA ranking), is that they are a household name in DIII, and have recent appearances in the NCAA tourn.

[Ralph Turner]

Colorado College is in the realm of Trinity, DePauw and Southwestern, with respect to endowment.  They can afford the travel.

I think that the "household name" effect is slowly being "winnowed out" of the selection process, because of the objective criteria described in the Handbook.

The object criteria in the Handbook are what they are.  Millsaps is not penalized for their schedule.  There is no emotion or guilt in the ranking that mathematically derives from their schedule.  It is what it is.

Yes, the UDallas game was a good addition.  UDallas will benefit from that arrangement.  It is no secret that UDallas wants to be invited to the SCAC.  (Thanks for correcting the oversight.  )

Millsaps' plight is shared by the ASC.  Maybe you can get Louisiana College to be the 4th team in a "Classic Tourney".  The Belhaven and Loyola New Orleans games did not help.  I would love to ask a Selection Committee member if it helps an isolated team more to play a weak in-region foe or to play a challenging NAIA or D-2 that has no impact on primary selection criteria.  I will submit the question to Dave McHugh for his consideration for this week's Hoopsville.

Maybe UDallas can be invited to the SCAC when the SCAC moves to 16-teams in about a decade.   

[DPU3619]

Which brings me to the question of why did we bring in Colorado College. Are they the Harvard of the West? Are they the Duke or North Carolina of the West in DIII basketball? Certainly not. If the pres.' of our fine institutions want to expand, there are certainly some schools within a reasonable driving distance to all of us, that compare with Colorado College.

This started long before Colorado joined the conference.  Heck, Trinity and Centre have been in this conference together for 20 years now.  It was already tough travel for Centre before that.  Still had to go to Texas and still had to go to Arkansas.  It was already tough travel for Hendrix and the Texas teams, too. 

Then they let DePauw and RHIT in the conference (9 hrs for Hendrix, OU, and Millsaps).  They added 2 geographic extremes at the same time.  Then when RHIT left, they added another geographic extreme in the opposite direction.  Long story short, it's been like this in this conference for a long, long time.

[Pat Coleman]

I've just about come to the conclusion that Millsaps needs to win the AQ in order to get into the NCAA tournament.

... just like every other team. There are no guarantees as an at-large.

[Pat Coleman]

Millsaps or any school should not be penalized for their schedule when they're thinking about the welfare of their students and their bank account, which ultimately effects the students.

Instead, you're planning to punish teams that DO play a tougher schedule. Doesn't work.

[Ralph Turner]

Colorado College is in the realm of Trinity, DePauw and Southwestern, with respect to endowment.  They can afford the travel.
...

Maybe UDallas can be invited to the SCAC when the SCAC moves to 16-teams in about a decade.   

So when does the SCAC add UDallas (which has added a Phi Kappa Gamma chapter) and Centenary LA (up from the Division I non-football Summit League, you know North Dakota State, Oakland MI, Southern Utah) to the West and Berry College GA and Berea College KY to the East?   

[OLD STUDENT/ATHLETE]

Pat-I see what you mean! Ultimately, Millsaps needs to keep winning. If Centre wins their bracket at Conway, and Millsaps and DePauw are in the finals of the other bracket, and both have no more losses until then, I would think that the winner of that game regardless of whether they win the tournament, would get an at large bid. Am I too naive?

[pbrooks3]

OS/A, I don't think you're naïve. But don't assume that either Pool C candidate in the full scheme of things is in.  What Centre is doing this year as a "David" among "Goliaths" is refreshing and is good for D3 basketball. We know that not all programs and endowments are created equal - those are the facts of live. If Centre, and even Millsaps continue with strong stretch runs, perhaps both "Davids" will earn D3 berths which bodes well from a recognition factor throughout the land. We know it'll be hard to build strength of schedules among most SCAC member schools simply based on economic and geographic challenges. However, if Centre and/or Millsaps could take it deep into the D3 tournament, perhaps the SCAC will gain some additional respect beyond our so-called "Goliath" schools in sports. This is just another great testament to the fine jobs Coaches Mason and Wise are doing at their respective schools.

[jekelish]

So, any predictions for this weekend's slate of SCAC games?

[frank_ezelle]

I want to be sure that everyone is clear on my comment about feeling like Millsaps needs to win the AQ instead of counting on an at-large bid, a comment I made about sports in general at Millsaps.

The Millsaps basketball schedule this year is made up of SCAC teams and teams that fit into the schedule because of financial and travel constraints.  Apparently those teams all combine to constitute a weak schedule by the NCAA criteria.  Last year in baseball the team played just about everyone they could play from Alabama, Tennessee, Louisiana and Georgia.  Those teams combined with the SCAC schools were considered a weak schedule and that kept Millsaps from getting an at-large berth.  It wasn't the record of the Millsaps baseball team that was the problem, it was the record of their opponents.

The NCAA criteria, combined with the travel and financial limitations of the Millsaps teams, combined with the weakness of the D3 schools in the Millsaps area, combined with an SCAC schedule that apparently is deemed as weak, makes it very difficult for Millsaps to get an at-large berth.  I'm not really 100% certain that the football team would have gotten an at-large berth if they had won against MC, but who wants to discuss that subject again.

The rules are what they are, and the situation is what it is.  I get the impression that a Millsaps loss to Hendrix this Saturday will eliminate Millsaps from any chance of an at-large berth.  It also seems like a loss to Rhodes in the first round will eliminate Millsaps, so in essence Millsaps begins their NCAA Tournament feed-in play this Saturday.  Lose to Hendrix and you have to win three straight to get to the NCAA's.  Lose to Rhodes and the NCAA hopes for the season are over.  I hope the players fully understand what's at stake in these next two games.

[OLD STUDENT/ATHLETE]

Frank-Didn't Millsaps used to play Mississippi College. Having them on the schedule would help Millsaps' strength of schedule. I know Maryville always helped Centre's strength of schedule, but the game with them was canceled because of the death of one of their coaches in an accident. Early in the year Maryville probably would have beaten Centre, and maybe even now.