MBB: Southern Collegiate Athletic Conference

[pbrooks3]

I believe I understand your frustration, Frank.  Simply put, the remainder of the season is where Millsaps needs to make its case.  Centre, I realize, has benefitted from a lot of good fortune.  The reverse might have been the case if Britt doesn't hit that shot, and Millsaps then goes on to beat DePauw at Greencastle.  I know it's difficult to have a team's body of work for a season seemingly judged on the basis of two games.  I guess we'll all need to schedule Maryville for 2 games every season to boost our strength of schedule!
   

[Pat Coleman]

I doubt Maryville would argue.

[frank_ezelle]

Wes, I had to go back and read my posts to see where I gave the impression that Millsaps should be ranked ahead of DePauw.  That wasn't my intent, plus I don't really have an argument with where Millsaps is currently ranked in the South Region.  

The SCAC is not the strongest basketball conference from top to bottom and I think most of us would agree with that statement.  Teams from the SCAC get helped by building good records against weak competition and they also get hurt by playing against weak competition when it comes time for the regional rankings.  That's just a reality of the SCAC in most if not all of the major sports.

My post was mostly just some frustration from repeatedly reading from Ralph (whom I respect tremendously) about the Millsaps 2-point win over LC.  I've read this multiple times and it's just tiring to have someone reduce your season to one specific game.  It was the second game of the season, and sometimes things are a little shaky at the start.  As I pointed out, Centre lost to Rust in the first game so should that be the benchmark to their accomplishments for the season?  OR, maybe I should point out that Mississippi College lost to Wesley College in their first game last year and then they went on to dominate the ASC.  Should we use that Wesley College game as a measuring stick and therefore conclude that the ASC is a weak conference?

So here's my bottom line:
--I don't have a problem with where Millsaps is ranked in the South.
--I don't have a problem with DePauw being one spot above Millsaps.
--I agree with Ralph and everyone else that these are important games for Millsaps this weekend and sweep will be difficult but it is what Millsaps needs.
--I agree with Wes that second best in the SCAC is no guarantee for an at-large berth.
--And I disagree with taking one game during the season and pinning the merits of a team on that one game.  

[scottiedoug]

Boosting strength of schedule by scheduling Maryville would solve the sos problem but you'd have to innovate by actually beating them to really help.

[MC wild animal]

I would really love to see the Maryville vs. Centre game.  Hopefully, I will get my wish in the tournament.  I just dont see how Centre could possibly be considered the #3 team in the country.  I really feel that Maryville would beat them at Centre. What win does Centre hang their hat on?

[DPU3619]

I would really love to see the Maryville vs. Centre game.  Hopefully, I will get my wish in the tournament.  I just dont see how Centre could possibly be considered the #3 team in the country.  I really feel that Maryville would beat them at Centre. What win does Centre hang their hat on?

Beating #18 at home is a start. 

You've also apparently never been to that building.  You may beat them at your place, but you won't win at Alumni.  No, siree.

[Ralph Turner]

Good response, Frank!

I have not wanted to commit on Millsaps to this point, but having read your analysis, let me state my reasoning.

At the top level, the best of the ASC is better than the best of the SCAC, when the two teams have played or been matched in the playoff bracket.

Only the powerful Trinity 2005 team beat Cinderella UT-Dallas by six points in the first round at home in this decade.  The 2006 Trinity team lost badly to Maryville TN, which lost badly to Miss College.  The 2004 Sul Ross team (11-3 in the West Region) beat Trinity 24-5 in San Antonio in the second round (having received a bye.)  In 2001 Millsaps lost badly to Mississippi College.  In 2000, Pomona-Pitzer edged #9 Trinity in San Antonio, and then lost to 35 at McMurry.

This year, we see the inter-conference games:

Trinity has two 2-point home wins...over Texas Lutheran and HSU.
Southwestern has a 26-point road loss at HSU.
Austin College has a home 10-point loss to UT-Dallas and 16-point road loss at UT-Dallas.
Austin College has a 2-point home loss and a 5-point road loss to LeTourneau.
Sewanee has a 5-point home win over UT-Tyler in the first game.
Hendrix has an 11-point home loss to Ozarks.

I think that the #7 team in the South Region should sweep the Texas series.  I think that Millsaps is on the radar, but must win the tourney, or run the table until the Tourney finals (and finish with a South Region record of 19-3) to get a bid.  I think that they have too many teams ahead of the them at this time to earn the Pool C.

[pbrooks3]

So here's my bottom line:
--I don't have a problem with where Millsaps is ranked in the South.
--I don't have a problem with DePauw being one spot above Millsaps.
--I agree with Ralph and everyone else that these are important games for Millsaps this weekend and sweep will be difficult but it is what Millsaps needs.
--I agree with Wes that second best in the SCAC is no guarantee for an at-large berth.
--And I disagree with taking one game during the season and pinning the merits of a team on that one game.  

I remind you Millsaps lost to both Centre and DePauw.  You're saying Centre is only an average team because they lost to Rust in the opener and sweaked by Millsaps in Danville.  Sounds like you pinning the "one game moniker" on Centre.  If Centre is simply average, then what does that make Millsaps?   

[frank_ezelle]

pbrooks3--either I need to rewrite or you need to reread.  My intent was to point out that a person can't get fixated on one game, especially an early season result, and use that as a measuring stick for an entire season.  Since I've been saying that it is unfair to question the strength of Millsaps by just looking at one game (the Louisiana College game), I obviously would think it unfair to judge Centre by their first game and disregard the following 20.  Or it would be unfair to judge the 2006-07 MC team by their opening loss to Wesley when they had such a great season in the rest of the game. 

By the way, I don't think I've said this already but I've really appreciated your contributions to the D3 board this season.  It really has been a good and interesting year on the SCAC board and I just wish we could get representation from all the teams.

[MC wild animal]

PLEASE, PRETTY PLEASE schedule murvul for 2 games, we would love to help strengthen others schedules as well as our own but the problem is its tough to get teams to come here and play hence the 14-2 region record(not as many south region games as others) Not too many wins from visiting teams in boydson baird  8) Beating the #18 team is a solid mark, no doubt about it.

-Granted the GSAC is a TAD subpar compared to the SCAC and other conferences lol...Murvul is undefeated vs. the SCAC the past 2 seasons (Centre, Oglethorpe, Sewanee) and 2-0 vs. centre the past 3 seasons including the win @ centre 2 seasons ago Wes, so YES, SIREE! Including a 30 pt thrashing of oglethorpe(flightofthepetral) this season and a 26 pt thrashing of sewanee on the mountain.

-Murvul would also be undefeated against the USASouth the past 2 seasons had it not been for the slip up the 1st game after christmas this season(6-1)! Also 5-0 against scholarship schools this season including handling 16-5 Carson Newman....Murvul doesnt have as strong a resume as other teams in the South but they can only control whats put in front of them and they have been doing so thus far, hopefully they can sustain this. I would also like to recognize centres 20 game win streak. I dont care who or who youre not playing, VERY IMPRESSIVE. The scots are own their own streak of 13 strait since the Averett game.

[pbrooks3]

pbrooks3--either I need to rewrite or you need to reread.  My intent was to point out that a person can't get fixated on one game, especially an early season result, and use that as a measuring stick for an entire season.  Since I've been saying that it is unfair to question the strength of Millsaps by just looking at one game (the Louisiana College game), I obviously would think it unfair to judge Centre by their first game and disregard the following 20.  Or it would be unfair to judge the 2006-07 MC team by their opening loss to Wesley when they had such a great season in the rest of the game. 

By the way, I don't think I've said this already but I've really appreciated your contributions to the D3 board this season.  It really has been a good and interesting year on the SCAC board and I just wish we could get representation from all the teams.

I may have misunderstood you, Frank.  The comment about Centre being an average team based on losing to Rust struck a chord with me.    Anyway, I am truly looking forward to the tournament and finally having an opportunity to see the Majors play.  I so want this conference to advance in the eyes of D3.  I really think the teams of the SCAC are the epitome of what I commonly refer to as "student-athletes".
 

[DPU3619]

including the win @ centre 2 seasons ago Wes, so YES, SIREE!

Yeah, and Centre went a rather unremarkable 19-8 two seasons ago.  That and a dollar won't get you much more than a Sunday paper.  They're 20-1 right now.  Again, I say no, you wouldn't beat them in that building.

I fail to see how 2005 leads you to tell me that you're going to come in and blow the doors off of 'em this season.  Southwestern beat Centre in Danville two years ago.  Does that mean they'd stomp a mudhole in 'em, too? 

I bet you'll say no because they're an SCAC team.  Or it just because they aren't Murvul?  Which one is it?  I never can tell.

[MC wild animal]

I never mentioned "blowin the doors off or stompin a mudhole in centre" i just said they i feel we would win. Thats how im supposed to feel, i support the scots! I never said anything bad about Centre or the conference because I for 1 think it would be brutal to be in there. But i also dont want people disrespecting murvuls schedule without them knowing who exactly were playing and as you and everyone else can see we try and schedule teams from various conferences and have had some success! And why i see maryville vs. centre 2 seasons ago and last season as being relevant...both teams strengths are their guards and and just about every perimeter player from both schools still remain on the roster with much improved depth to murvuls! Im sure centre has added improved depth as well, otherwise wouldnt be 20-1! Just think it would be a great game.

[Ralph Turner]

... And on top of that, DPU's OOWP is stronger by a good margin.  DePauw is 1-0 against ranked teams (Millsaps) and I believe Millsaps is winless.

...

This is a fine point, but the precise wording is "Results" against regionally ranked opponents.

That makes the case for a team that is 19-4 in-region and 2-4 versus regionally ranked teams being considered more favorably than a "19-4/1-0" team.

[pbrooks3]

I never mentioned "blowin the doors off or stompin a mudhole in centre" i just said they i feel we would win. Thats how im supposed to feel, i support the scots! I never said anything bad about Centre or the conference because I for 1 think it would be brutal to be in there. But i also dont want people disrespecting murvuls schedule without them knowing who exactly were playing and as you and everyone else can see we try and schedule teams from various conferences and have had some success! And why i see maryville vs. centre 2 seasons ago and last season as being relevant...both teams strengths are their guards and and just about every perimeter player from both schools still remain on the roster with much improved depth to murvuls! Im sure centre has added improved depth as well, otherwise wouldnt be 20-1! Just think it would be a great game.

Centre's record against Maryville in the regular season over the past 7 years is 2-4 with MC having won the last 2 in 05 & 06.  Obviously you're hanging your hat on the fact that you've won early season contests twice against them at Alumni in 05 & 03.  Centre did win at Maryville in 04.  So I'll give you credit where credit is due.  I remind you November is different than post season.  2008 is not necessarily 2006.  I am glad you think this would be a good match-up; I do, too.  I like the odds of the Colonels winning at Danville in the tournament if this scenario should play out.  Perhaps it will happen and one of us will be able exclaim I told you so!